(Last one, I swear!) From what I remember, a woman is out with her 2 kids late one night and can't get her car started or something like that. She decides they should sleep in the car and get help in the morning. The next day the kids wake up and their mother is gone. She was never seen again.

sounds like Pamela Ray, although her initial problem wasn't car trouble, but rather a lack of finding a place of lodging. Admittedly, I do think it was unwise of her to leave her kids in the car at 4 a.m.

Thats the one, thank you. I saw it about 5-8 years ago and the story always stuck with me. I guess there aren't any updates since I last saw it :(

sounds like Pamela Ray, although her initial problem wasn't car trouble, but rather a lack of finding a place of lodging. Admittedly, I do think it was unwise of her to leave her kids in the car at 4 a.m.

Wasn't she parked in the motel parking lot when she left her kids though? IIRC, she was parked near the front door and left her kids in the car because she was going to try the front door or to try and find a motel employee so they could check in.

Wasn't she parked in the motel parking lot when she left her kids though? IIRC, she was parked near the front door and left her kids in the car because she was going to try the front door or to try and find a motel employee so they could check in.

Not sure what difference that makes. Plus, she apparently walked quite a ways away from them.

But in any event, even if you can get past that, it wasn't wise of her to not make resevations. I've worked in the hotel industry most of my adult life, and can tell you that you don't want to be driving around in the middle of the night trying to find somewhere with an opening (and apparently there weren't any in the immeidate area.) Helps if you book in advance. 20 years later, many people still haven't latched on to that concept.

But in any event, even if you can get past that, it wasn't wise of her to not make resevations. I've worked in the hotel industry most of my adult life, and can tell you that you don't want to be driving around in the middle of the night trying to find somewhere with an opening (and apparently there weren't any in the immeidate area.) Helps if you book in advance. 20 years later, many people still haven't latched on to that concept.

It took me an ill-planned drive from Arizona to Georgia to figure that out quick. It is entirely possible to have every hotel room in Odessa, TX booked for the night when you come bumbling in at 2 AM just expecting a vacancy like the entire staff was waiting on YOU alone to come in and claim your bed.

I book everything in advance now. It's the polite thing to do, and it's a whole lot less stressful on everyone involved.

As far as Pamela goes, weren't she and her children traveling from Georgia? I always thought that was an unusual arrival time considering the relatively short distance. But maybe she felt better driving through the night, or couldn't leave any sooner. Just always thought it was strange.

As far as Pamela goes, weren't she and her children traveling from Georgia? I always thought that was an unusual arrival time considering the relatively short distance. But maybe she felt better driving through the night, or couldn't leave any sooner. Just always thought it was strange.

I once heard that the trip from Georgia to Florida was surprisingly long. In fact, I once asked about this elsewhere here on the net awhile back. Here is my observation, along with the response I got. This is in regards to the movie Summer Rental.

me: something i didn't get...it shows them heading out for the trip from Atlanta, Georgia to Northern Flordia in the morning. It's presumed a whole day passes because Jack is driving while everyone else is asleep. I guess they could have been napping, but would they have all been so tired that quickly. Anyways, it wouldn't take that long to drive from Atlanta to Northern Florida, but you get the impression it was a 24 hour journey.

response: I-75 from Atlanta to St. Petersburg was build in 1977, eight years before this movie. Yet Jack is driving on Highway 301 to get to Florida. Hwy301 is beeing shown on the edited version they show on TV, not on the DVD version. That trip alone would set you back 9 hours and fifteen minutes, 530 miles according to Google Maps. Sandy mentioned that she is tired of eating burgers all day long so you can only assume that they have made a bunch of stops along the way.
So, it does make sense, it took them more than a day to get there.

I apologize if that's confusing, one might have to see the movie to get a better sense of it.

sidebar: Summer Rental is a a pretty good movie if you haven't seen it. John Candy, Richard Crenna, Night Court alums Karen Allen and John Larroquette, and a very young Matthew Lawrence. Not to mention an Academy Award worthy performance from Harry Yorku.

Not sure what difference that makes. Plus, she apparently walked quite a ways away from them.

I see nothing wrong with her leaving her kids (they were both older than ten IIRC) locked in the car while you she went to get a room. It was the wee hours of the morning and I'm assuming she thought everything would be fine and that she would find an employee of the motel quick enough.

As for the unusal time she picked to travel, I've always figured she wanted to travel at night because her kids could sleep the whole way. Kids can be annoying on long road trips (I used to be), so I can see why a parent would want to drive during the night.

I see nothing wrong with her leaving her kids (they were both older than ten IIRC) locked in the car while you she went to get a room. It was the wee hours of the morning and I'm assuming she thought everything would be fine and that she would find an employee of the motel quick enough.

As for the unusal time she picked to travel, I've always figured she wanted to travel at night because her kids could sleep the whole way. Kids can be annoying on long road trips (I used to be), so I can see why a parent would want to drive during the night.

I never understood the backlash about her leaving her sleeping kids in the car while she went to get a room. What? Would it have been better for her to drag them along with her?? Those kids are probably darned lucky she DID leave them to continue sleeping. I'm sure if the kids were harmed too people would be saying "Why didn't she just let them keep sleeping until she got a room?" :rolleyes:

Also, fwiw, my parents did the same thing - left late at night - so I'd sleep a good portion of the travel time. Sleep is a great way to keep a kid entertained when they're stuck in a car. It's perfectly reasonable that a parent wouldn't want to wake their kids until they needed to be awake. She left them in a *locked* car. It's not like she left the doors wide open with a sign that said "free kids take one".

Also, Atlanta is up in the Northern part of Georgia and Panama City is in the western part of FL. Georgia is a pretty long state so it's no wonder it took her awhile to get there. It isn't a hop skip and a jump across the border when you're coming from Atlanta.

According to Charley Project, they had purchased a condo in the city so maybe she arrived earlier than she expected and was stuck trying to find a room instead of meeting up with the realtor?

Your arguments hold no water. She left her kids in the car, something terrible happened, and the kids woke up not knowing where the mother is or where they are. That must have been a very terrifying experience. I'm willing to bet if she had taken the kids with her, she would still be alive. I highly doubt the perp would have been able to control 3 people. The car was locked? Still would have been not that difficult to break in. She was also spotted walking away from the motel to God knows where. And what difference does it make letting them sleep if you have to wake them up anyways if she does find lodging? You do not leave your kids in the car in the middle of the night in a big city in a state with a lot of crime. If you believe otherwise then you're incredibly dense.

I suppose arguing about it is going to make things better/bring her back. Some may disagree with her leaving her 2 kids locked in the car, but it could've been worse and all 3 could've been victims instead. It is sad that she's gone but arguing about what she did wrong is not going to solve matters.

Your arguments hold no water. She left her kids in the car, something terrible happened, and the kids woke up not knowing where the mother is or where they are. That must have been a very terrifying experience. I'm willing to bet if she had taken the kids with her, she would still be alive. I highly doubt the perp would have been able to control 3 people. The car was locked? Still would have been not that difficult to break in. She was also spotted walking away from the motel to God knows where. And what difference does it make letting them sleep if you have to wake them up anyways if she does find lodging? You do not leave your kids in the car in the middle of the night in a big city in a state with a lot of crime. If you believe otherwise then you're incredibly dense.

It's so easy to say what you would do in a situation like that, but people are different. You make it seem like Pamela knew she was going to be abducted and murdered that night and somehow it's her fault because she left her kids in the car. That's pretty dense. We don't know if she did attempt to wake her kids up, who's to say she didn't and they wouldn't budge or starting whining? And I simply don't see how taking her kids with her would somehow up her chances of fending off her abductor. Some guy could have snatched her up and dumped her in a car and sped off before one of her kids could even flinch. And she walked away from the motel office to the area of the swimming pool before patrons heard screams coming from the pool area. That's hardly "God knows where".

I always had the impression she was a prostitute but UM and the police kept it quiet to help the case, I know things like that happen on UK crime tv shows.

Also, Atlanta is up in the Northern part of Georgia and Panama City is in the western part of FL. Georgia is a pretty long state so it's no wonder it took her awhile to get there. It isn't a hop skip and a jump across the border when you're coming from Atlanta.

I used to live in Columbus, GA, which is about an hour southwest of Atlanta. I seem to recall it took at least over four hours to reach the Florida border. I haven't been to Panama City in many, many years, so perhaps I am not taking into account the time it takes to drive into the Florida panhandle.

Perhaps it's just personal relativity. Four, five, six hours DOES seem like a short trip to me because I've done many 10-14 hour drives before in recent years.

All the things mentioned in this thread have been discussed on Pamela's thread.

She had about a 6 hour trip. Not long. It is common for families with kids(mine included) to drive at night so the kids would sleep and then you would have more time to spend at your destination. My parents did it every trip we ever took, and we did it many times with our own kids.

She was actually parked only a few feet maybe 20 at most from the door to the motel office. The entire front of the office was glass windows so if she had made it inside, the car with her kids asleep in it would have never been out of her sight.

It was common practice at the mom & pop style motels at panama Cuty Beach to call ahead and make arrangements for a key to be left in a designated spot for you to get when you arrived if you expected to get there in the middle of the night. That was the extent of making reservations with them. BTDT.

These hotels were old, but clean and well maintained. They were not drug, prostitute motels , or in a high crime area.

It's so easy to say what you would do in a situation like that, but people are different. You make it seem like Pamela knew she was going to be abducted and murdered that night and somehow it's her fault because she left her kids in the car. That's pretty dense. We don't know if she did attempt to wake her kids up, who's to say she didn't and they wouldn't budge or starting whining? And I simply don't see how taking her kids with her would somehow up her chances of fending off her abductor. Some guy could have snatched her up and dumped her in a car and sped off before one of her kids could even flinch. And she walked away from the motel office to the area of the swimming pool before patrons heard screams coming from the pool area. That's hardly "God knows where".

Not at all what I said, but you do a terrific job of twisting my words around. Pamela doesn't deserve what happened, but she made some pretty bad errors in judgment.

She was at the swimming pool? Okay. My question is: What was she doing at the swimming pool? Going for a swim? People are making a point that when she went to the motel front doors that she wasn't too far from her kids at that point, but the swimming pool is a whole other story. Her kids were likely not in her seeing range at that point.

I always had the impression she was a prostitute but UM and the police kept it quiet to help the case, I know things like that happen on UK crime tv shows.

I have no idea about that, but I do know she committed fraud shortly before her disapperance and was in trouble with the law. I got the impression she wasn't exactly the pillar of society.

the whole case is sad and puzzling:confused: . None of us knows what happened to her or why she tried to get a room at 5 am etc. all I know is that two children were left motherless and no one has a clue what exactly happened that morning. i wish this case was solved so her family could get closure. this one always gave me the creeps hardcore.

I mentioned on her thread that his was a local case for me because I live near PCB and the local stations carry some news from there including this story. And also the fact we were vacationing in PCB when this happened. So I have always been interested in this case.

When it first came out about the money/legal problems she and her dad had been involved in, it was thought by many, myself included that her disappearance was staged. But it eventually came out that this event happened several years prior to her disappearnace, was for the most part over and done so she really didn't have a reason to disappear related to that.

People on this site have tried in discussing this case to make her out to be an addict and have even alluded to prostitution. I really believe that if you google and read up on the case you will find that it is a sad coincidence of her happening to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. She was trying to take her kids to the beach for a vacation on a budget and she ended up at the wrong place at the wrong time. And again I stress- this was a FAMILY motel, not a motel frequented by druggies or prostitutes.

Your arguments hold no water. She left her kids in the car, something terrible happened, and the kids woke up not knowing where the mother is or where they are. That must have been a very terrifying experience. I'm willing to bet if she had taken the kids with her, she would still be alive. I highly doubt the perp would have been able to control 3 people. The car was locked? Still would have been not that difficult to break in. She was also spotted walking away from the motel to God knows where. And what difference does it make letting them sleep if you have to wake them up anyways if she does find lodging? You do not leave your kids in the car in the middle of the night in a big city in a state with a lot of crime. If you believe otherwise then you're incredibly dense.

From what is on her Charley Project page, it sounds like she left the kids so she could go use the bathroom. If the lobby was closed or didn't have a bathroom she could use, the pool area is a pretty good place to look for a bathroom. It said she was followed to the pool area and that's where they heard the screams. The page/perhaps police assume that she already knew there weren't any vacancies in the area and had parked the car for the night but I'm not sure how they know that.

You're assuming an awful lot that the kids would have protected her by the virtue of safety in numbers. He got away with it even with her screaming. I'm willing to bet the opposite - he could have easily harmed her kids or used harming her kids as leverage to get her to comply with his demands. Heck, he could have seen her arrive with her kids and used them as leverage even though they were in the car.

I guess it's just not weird to me that a parent would leave their kids alone in a locked car for what was likely planned to be less than 5-10 minutes. Getting kids out of a car whether asleep or not can be a long production and it was probably far more easier and efficient for her to just get the keys and wake them up to get them in the room and not for something (that is usually) as simple as getting a room key or going to the bathroom.

She wasn't a prostitute. Her father obtained money through a bank error and she allegedly helped to spend it. It was ruled out that she disappeared because of this as she wouldn't have left her kids behind.

It just feels wrong to be all "hey lady, you made some dumb decisions that put your kids in danger" when she's the one who was abducted and likely murdered.

RE: Pamela June Ray, in her thread here, her daughter posted a couple years ago and said this in post #35:

The Pamela June Ray case was never solved, i know this because im her daughter. She left us (me and shayne) in the car because we were asleep.. and because we had made arrangements with the manager of the hotel prior to making the trip down to pcb. He was supposed to leave a key to the room in the mail box for my mother to get when we got there. also my aunt was supposed to come with us for the trip because my dad couldnt get off of work. but she backed out at the last moment.

The only thing i remember about the day we were found by the police was waking up because it was raining and i started crying because shayne was asleep and we were alone. not to long after i woke shayne up, a police officer took us to the police station and called our family, my dad and my aunt rhonda flew down from georgia to get us.

As for the leeds that came up in 2000... Sandra Marie Anderson who did search and rescue with her Cadaver Dog Eagle (if you google her you will see just how reliable she was ) were searching an area near pcb where they found several female remains. All the remains had the same profile.. White female with dark hair. The area they were searching was the home of a woman. However her son had murdered the victims and burried them on her property. This man is in jail for several life sentences because of this. But my mothers remains were not found among them, and the man who pled guilty to these crimes would not say if he knew what happened to my mom or not.
Aside from the numerous false reports of people seeing her, there has never been any real leads or evidence to what happened.

http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showthread.php?t=258312&highlight=pamela

I believe Ms. Ray's daughter posted a total of 4 times in that thread if anyone is interested in reading more of her info.

Not at all what I said, but you do a terrific job of twisting my words around.

I didn't twist anything around.

Your arguments hold no water. She left her kids in the car, something terrible happened, and the kids woke up not knowing where the mother is or where they are. That must have been a very terrifying experience. I'm willing to bet if she had taken the kids with her, she would still be alive. I highly doubt the perp would have been able to control 3 people. The car was locked? Still would have been not that difficult to break in. She was also spotted walking away from the motel to God knows where. And what difference does it make letting them sleep if you have to wake them up anyways if she does find lodging? You do not leave your kids in the car in the middle of the night in a big city in a state with a lot of crime.

I know you weren't saying she deserved what happened, but you still think it was foolish of her to leave her children in a car, asleep, while she was mere feet away looking for a key to a room so they could enjoy a vacation together. It does sound like your blaming her for the experience her children went through. She was the victim here, had there been no abductor none of this would have happened regardless of whether or not she left her kids in the car. That was my point.

She was at the swimming pool? Okay. My question is: What was she doing at the swimming pool? Going for a swim? People are making a point that when she went to the motel front doors that she wasn't too far from her kids at that point, but the swimming pool is a whole other story. Her kids were likely not in her seeing range at that point.

She was not seen at the swimming pool. She pulled up to the Wilhite motel and parked her car directly in front of the motel lobby. Then she got out (presumeably to see if someone was in the office or if in fact they did leave a key for her) and when she noticed the office was closed/locked she walked around the side of the building which is IMO she encountered her abductor. I think the abductor posed as a motel employee, said something to the effect of "Oh yeah, I got your keys over here in the maintenance office, follow me", so she followed this guy (they were seen walking towards the swimming pool area) and then she was abducted. She also may have simply been looking for a restroom like another poster suggested. We really have no way of knowing and I think asking why she was walking towards the pool area is a moot point.

I wonder how thoroughly the motel employees were all questioned by police in the PJR case.

I remember being very surprised by something in the Carey Stayner murders of Carole and Juli Sund and their friend Silvina Pelosso in 1999, just a few years after PJR went missing.

The police went around to local motels interviewing staff and IIRC at least one of the maintenance men for one motel was a convicted sex offender. He had master keys to all the rooms. It really made me think about how important it is to use the secondary lock inside your hotel room. You can't really trust your safety to the hotel management.

It makes me wonder how much the hotel expecting PJR to arrive was investigated. What if the guy knew a woman alone with little kids was due to arrive very early that day? Or what if he mentioned that fact to a friend, acquaintance, staff member, or someone at another of the motels on that strip.

That is a very good point you raised. Back then people were nowhere near as security conscious as they are today about things like this. I hope that was all checked out.

Too late to go back and check on it now, heck the Wilhite is gone and it's mostly high rise condos there now with a few old mom and pop hold outs. And given that the staff is so transient in a resort town, no way could they decide to follow up on it now.