TMTMS wanted Phyllis and Sue Ann to be unlikeable, but actually were liked by audiences. What do you think was the reason for that? Thoughts?

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRJhFXO_Ro5OvMN165JYb0gZB7ELFLaOt7lP9ZZO2f2KHupAjCshttp://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTLl236s2q8fEr5Pkl8qiBArTOd6fH42qPvjwlgOX0iGTPGZqMK

Well, the characters were not likeable people, but because their quirks lent themselves so well to themes and material, the viewing public "liked" Phyllis and Sue Ann. The passive-aggressive neurotic machinations of Phyllis, and Sue Ann's promiscuity, made for some VERY FUNNY story lines.

I didn't find Sue Ann at all likeable. I FF a lot when she is on.

As for Phyllis, what made her likeable is that see genuinely did care about Mary.

TMTMS wanted Phyllis and Sue Ann to be unlikeable, but actually were liked by audiences. What do you think was the reason for that? Thoughts?

Because they were not intentionally being mean. Both seemed totally clueless as to how they came across to people, and it was clear that deep inside, they were both actually insecure and didn't really think so highly of themselves. We knew that their behavior was just a defense mechanism; they wanted to think of themselves as superior to Mary when, in fact, they knew, we knew, and even Mary knew, they were not. Ultimately they were completely powerless and harmless. If they had truly been in a position of power and dominance over nice people like Mary and still behaved that way, then they wouldn't have been funny and we wouldn't have liked them. It's kind of like Louie de Palma on Taxi. He was technically in a position of power and was a complete jerk, yet the audience was drawn to him, perhaps because we felt for some reason -- his stature, perhaps? -- he had a low opinion of himself and was simply trying to hide it and overcompenstate with a rough, obnoxious exterior.

Two great actresses plus great writing - that simple!!!!! :D

I'm not sure "likeable" is the word here. I mean, I don't think any of us would want Phyllis or Sue Ann as a friend. But their quirks definitely led to a lot of the show's humor. A lot of the time, someone has to be the butt of the joke, and they both often were. And, of course, it worked. :)

I'm not sure "likeable" is the word here. I mean, I don't think any of us would want Phyllis or Sue Ann as a friend. But their quirks definitely led to a lot of the show's humor. A lot of the time, someone has to be the butt of the joke, and they both often were. And, of course, it worked. :)

Agree! I think "quirky" fits them better.

I always felt Mary was protective towards Phyllis,almost Motherly as Mary had the common sense and Phyllis didn't.
There's a scene when Phyllis and Rhoda and bickering and Mary looks at them both and smiles,it is avery sweet moment.

Mary didn't like Sue Ann,she wasn't a friend like Phyllis but Mary was such a kind hearted soul,she could see Sue Ann was actually a very lonely person,particularly when they go to that convention togethor.

Mary also comes to Sue Ann's rescue when The Happy Homemaker is axed in season 7 although very reluctantly as she doesn't want her in the newsroom which is understandable.

The characters were likeable because Cloris and Betty are comedy legends who could potray their annoying traits but their vulnerabilities too.

I could deal with a SueAnn in my life. But Phyllis, I think would be quite annoying.

Interesting query! I think they were 'likable' as sitcom personae due to being contrasts to Mary's golden goodness and 'spunk' . Both these characters were folks who were rather openly selfish and self-important and even the more 'worldly' Rhoda was nowhere in their league. Of course, it goes without saying these would have been interesting folks to have been acquainted with but not folks many people would have considered genuine friends.:p

I agree with the statement made earlier, that it is the great writing and the great actresses. The characters were portrayed as real people, you could see that Phyllis and Sue Anne had their weak points and vulnerabilities at times. They weren't 2D characters that were just annoying and the butt of the jokes. Plus, Betty White and Cloris Leachman are just hilarious.