This one makes me scratch my head a little, while shows like WKRP have struggled because of music rights and Maude because of too politically based, why is Kotter struggling? You have a breakout star in John Travolta and overall quality show with plenty of laughs. I just don't get it?

I'm not sure, but personally, while I loved the show as a kid, I think it's very much "of it's time". It honestly doesn't translate well across the decades.

Plus the fourth (and final season) is pretty much empty of laughs.

http://i52.tinypic.com/2hp7yft.jpg

This one makes me scratch my head a little, while shows like WKRP have struggled because of music rights and Maude because of too politically based, why is Kotter struggling? You have a breakout star in John Travolta and overall quality show with plenty of laughs. I just don't get it?


1. Because the last season is weak

2. The star, Vinny is barely seen in the last season

3. Adding a replacement sweathog was dumb-"Beau"

4. I think because the show had no real purpose but to just have the sweathoggs act foolish



That is just speculation-lol

1. Because the last season is weak

2. The star, Vinny is barely seen in the last season

3. Adding a replacement sweathog was dumb-"Beau"

4. I think because the show had no real purpose but to just have the sweathoggs act foolish



That is just speculation-lol
http://i53.tinypic.com/29x7w5j.jpg

Still can't believe i'm stuck with one season of WBK

I like it personally, but it is dated, very very dated. Also many of the jokes were used so many times maybe it is hard for new fans to tell one episode from another.

I think there weren't a lot of episodes that could sustain a long and successful syndicated run because there were fewer than 100, including the disasterous last season. Usually, shows that have longer network runs haven a better chance to be a hit in reruns.

I think there weren't a lot of episodes that could sustain a long and successful syndicated run because there were fewer than 100, including the disasterous last season. Usually, shows that have longer network runs haven a better chance to be a hit in reruns.


Good point, which means it's only less than 60 eps that are worth watching

Welcome Back Kotter was pretty popular in syndication thru the 1980's, since then the show seems to have more or less lost it's audience. There could be several reasons for this. I have the 1st season DVD and would also like to have seasons 2 and 3, but not season 4.

A bit of trivia: Marcia Strassman had a 45 RPM record out in 1967. The A side title is "The Flower Children", B side is titled "Out Of The Picture". The songs are on you tube if anyone wants to give em a listen.

Welcome Back Kotter was pretty popular in syndication thru the 1980's, since then the show seems to have more or less lost it's audience. There could be several reasons for this. I have the 1st season DVD and would also like to have seasons 2 and 3, but not season 4.

A bit of trivia: Marcia Strassman had a 45 RPM record out in 1967. The A side title is "The Flower Children", B side is titled "Out Of The Picture". The songs are on you tube if anyone wants to give em a listen.


what would some of those reasons be?

Your guess is as good as mine. I personally think the show is still funny, some others might think it is dated, I don't know. I like those corny jokes Gabe tells at the start and end of the episodes. The 4th season I can do without, but I'd like seasons 2 and 3 DVD to be released.

Your guess is as good as mine. I personally think the show is still funny, some others might think it is dated, I don't know. I like those corny jokes Gabe tells at the start and end of the episodes. The 4th season I can do without, but I'd like seasons 2 and 3 DVD to be released.


the way you posted your last comment it sounded like you had a list of reasons why the show is not successful in syndication but didn't feel like posting them-lol

I think the show has the capability to do well in reruns. If the people don't watch, then we automatically think it might be outdated. Maybe that's not the real reason. Perhaps, people just don't care. Malcolm is more up to date but it keeps being shelved around from one Nick channel to another.

I am glad that I taped a bunch of uncut episodes from NY1 back in 2000 when there was a marathon. Of course, they never aired last season episodes.

I think the show has the capability to do well in reruns. If the people don't watch, then we automatically think it might be outdated. Maybe that's not the real reason. Perhaps, people just don't care. Malcolm is more up to date but it keeps being shelved around from one Nick channel to another.

I am glad that I taped a bunch of uncut episodes from NY1 back in 2000 when there was a marathon. Of course, they never aired last season episodes.


you are so lucky to be living in NYC.

Back in 2000, I was living in Tampa, FL. I came on one of my many visits to NYC to visit my family for Thanksgiving and bumrushed my aunt's VCR to tape as many eps as I could as they aired all night on the station with Ron Palillo as the host for the marathon. Now, Metro 1 has turned into NY1, 24 hour news station. Ugggh...

the way you posted your last comment it sounded like you had a list of reasons why the show is not successful in syndication but didn't feel like posting them-lol

Not really, it's probably just one of those things where the show is currently out of fashion and not in the syndication rotation, but will likely come back again at a later date.

I'm guessing that WBK simply doesn't "hold up" (not necessarily for being "too dated") for several arguable reasons:
1) None of the sweathogs are plausible as high school students. They are all too old. This is true even in the first episode.

2) Gabe Kaplan/Kotter doesn't carry in a dramatic role. Kaplan's forte (pronounced fort) seems to be as a stand-up comedian.

3) The character of Kotter's wife is completely unsympathetic and shouldn't be interacting with the sweathogs. She seems to have a part only so Kotter doesn't have to spend all of his scenes with sweathogs.

4) The typical viewer is completely unable to identify with any of the characters.

5) It is really nothing but a disjointed string of one-liners. There is nothing touching or heartwarming about it at all.

6) The appeal of the show significantly plummeted after the first season and by the fourth season (the last) it totally sucked, especially with the addition of the Beau character and the frequent absences of Barbarino.

When you consider how hard it is to find some of the other school-related series that preceded it, like Our Miss Brooks, and some that came later, like Head of the Class, availability and syndication success haven't been bad for WBK...!

WBK was a very big hit and there was a lot of licensed merchandise. How well it holds up today is a different matter, but despite the actors being "too old" to play high school students (a very common situation in sitcom history), the series was very well cast and had elements in place for success.

And again it's certainly in good company among sitcoms that eroded in quality by their final seasons.

Possibly, because of John Travolta's so-called Trangressions.

I own the complete series and I enjoy watching it once in a while but I honestly don't really care much for John Travolta-- I don't think he can act and he kinda creeps me out.

It hasn't aged well and looks horrible today.

I think it's because it's not a family show and mainly geared toward men

The only high school show's that have done well in syndication are Saved By The Bell and Boy Meets World. Kotter is way better than Saved By The Bell at least. Along with Head Of The Class I think audience that grew up watching those show's don't want to see those show's again. I loved watching reruns of Welcomd Back Kotter on Nick At Night in the late 90s t I remember my dad saying "He didn't want to see a show about high school in the 70s anymore", he already saw Kotter and went to High School during that time.

Head of the Class was way better than Kotter.

Head of the Class was way better than Kotter.


Maybe better than season 4

Maybe better than season 4
Agreed none of the studen's were as great of standouts as the " Original Sweat Hogs"(Epstein, Horshack, Washington, Barbarino). Howard Hessmen may have been better than Gabe Kapler though! Also I would pick Mr. Woodman over Mr. Samuels!

Howard Hessman can act. Gabe Kaplan has and will always will be a stand up comic.

Since the show was geared to address social issues of it's day with busing and cultural blending, it was going to have a tough uphill battle maintaining relevance through the years as those social concepts were addressed and overcome. Stylistically it no longer fits with most fast paced comedic shows of today, but then again Starsky & Hutch doesn't work with CSI either.

Nostalgia is what most shows from the 70's offer today and why people watch them. There are still some solid social messages to retain from this show, so it's fun to watch to reminisce and occasionally get a thoughtful reflection.

It plays quite a bit on MeTV and seasons two through four were released last year along with a complete series set soon after. Commercially it seems to have found a second life from what I see. Who has reported this show is not holding up well after getting such a big push commercially last year on DVD and in syndication right now?

Since the show was geared to address social issues of it's day with busing and cultural blending, it was going to have a tough uphill battle maintaining relevance through the years as those social concepts were addressed and overcome. Stylistically it no longer fits with most fast paced comedic shows of today, but then again Starsky & Hutch doesn't work with CSI either.

Nostalgia is what most shows from the 70's offer today and why people watch them. There are still some solid social messages to retain from this show, so it's fun to watch to reminisce and occasionally get a thoughtful reflection.

It plays quite a bit on MeTV and seasons two through four were released last year along with a complete series set soon after. Commercially it seems to have found a second life from what I see. Who has reported this show is not holding up well after getting such a big push commercially last year on DVD and in syndication right now?


This thread was started 4 years ago which was

1. Before Antenna TV

2. Before the DVD complete series release of WBK

This thread was started 4 years ago which was

1. Before Antenna TV

2. Before the DVD complete series release of WBK

I caught that. But I was responding to the recent comments over the past 60 days that seem to still cater to that idea. It seems to have definitely found a niche in retro community.

I caught that. But I was responding to the recent comments over the past 60 days that seem to still cater to that idea. It seems to have definitely found a niche in retro community.


I found it funny that the show is in syndication now when it;s complete on DVD.lol


It was out of syndication from 2003-2012 and now it's back which doesn't make sense because now we have the option to buy it

I found it funny that the show is in syndication now when it;s complete on DVD.lol


It was out of syndication from 2003-2012 and now it's back which doesn't make sense because now we have the option to buy it

That is true but I find allot of what is seen on the retro channels is so cut up in editing it serves you well to buy them on DVD if you're a big enough fan. Hell, I watched Starsky & Hutch on Antenna TV the other night and they even edited the damn intro to the show! :lol:

That is true but I find allot of what is seen on the retro channels is so cut up in editing it serves you well to buy them on DVD if you're a big enough fan. Hell, I watched Starsky & Hutch on Antenna TV the other night and they even edited the damn intro to the show! :lol:


I hate how Me-TV airs WBK the same time as the Jeffersons at 10pm:lol:

Since Antenna TV has removed Three's Company from the 12am slot in my local area and I am finished with the cycle of One day at a time

I have 2 hours of nothing to watch now, 11pm to 1am

I hate how Me-TV airs WBK the same time as the Jeffersons at 10pm:lol:

Since Antenna TV has removed Three's Company from the 12am slot in my local area and I am finished with the cycle of One day at a time

I have 2 hours of nothing to watch now, 11pm to 1am

Ah, you have that problem too? I have the solution. I have WBK DVR'd and watch Jeffersons live. If you do that, then you have coverage from 11 to 1 to go back and watch Kotter.

Ah, you have that problem too? I have the solution. I have WBK DVR'd and watch Jeffersons live. If you do that, then you have coverage from 11 to 1 to go back and watch Kotter.


Yeah I guess I can do that now, since the 12am hour is open

Maybe better than season 4

Season 4 of WBK, for all intents and purposes, killed the reruns on Nick at Nite 20 years later. Nick wound up pulling the show from their schedule because ratings dropped hard after airing that season.

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As someone who never got into this show as a kid and has tried and failed to get into it in reruns, I can guess why this show keeps doing poorly.

1. It was supposed to be a funny version of The Blackboard Jungle but then turned into a very cringe-inducing fanboy homage to The Marx Brothers.

2. The show became very "shticky." It started laying the Borscht belt humor and accents real thick. It was fine if Kaplan wanted his character to be this way but then everyone began acting and sounding like Henny Youngman (with the smart aleck, hyuk hyuk, fast-paced delivery). It's a real turnoff because that kind of humor is dated and it didn't fit the characters or the theme of the show. (Why does Horshack sound like a middle-aged yenta?)

3. The characters became too one dimensional and obnoxious, which undermined the premise (which was about a bunch of troubled inner city kids being inspired by their teacher).

4. The show stopped feeling like a sitcom and felt more like a bunch of actors playing up to the audience with nonstop one liners and mugging.

As someone who never got into this show as a kid and has tried and failed to get into it in reruns, I can guess why this show keeps doing poorly.

1. It was supposed to be a funny version of The Blackboard Jungle but then turned into a very cringe-inducing fanboy homage to The Marx Brothers.

2. The show became very "shticky." It started laying the Borscht belt humor and accents real thick. It was fine if Kaplan wanted his character to be this way but then everyone began acting and sounding like Henny Youngman (with the smart aleck, hyuk hyuk, fast-paced delivery). It's a real turnoff because that kind of humor is dated and it didn't fit the characters or the theme of the show. (Why does Horshack sound like a middle-aged yenta?)

3. The characters became too one dimensional and obnoxious, which undermined the premise (which was about a bunch of troubled inner city kids being inspired by their teacher).

4. The show stopped feeling like a sitcom and felt more like a bunch of actors playing up to the audience with nonstop one liners and mugging.



Well I guess it wasn't too much of a fail in reruns since the whole series is on DVD

As someone who never got into this show as a kid and has tried and failed to get into it in reruns, I can guess why this show keeps doing poorly.

1. It was supposed to be a funny version of The Blackboard Jungle but then turned into a very cringe-inducing fanboy homage to The Marx Brothers.

2. The show became very "shticky." It started laying the Borscht belt humor and accents real thick. It was fine if Kaplan wanted his character to be this way but then everyone began acting and sounding like Henny Youngman (with the smart aleck, hyuk hyuk, fast-paced delivery). It's a real turnoff because that kind of humor is dated and it didn't fit the characters or the theme of the show. (Why does Horshack sound like a middle-aged yenta?)

3. The characters became too one dimensional and obnoxious, which undermined the premise (which was about a bunch of troubled inner city kids being inspired by their teacher).

4. The show stopped feeling like a sitcom and felt more like a bunch of actors playing up to the audience with nonstop one liners and mugging.
You nailed it!! This is one of the many shows I now regret I ever saw. Room 222 was way better.

Well I guess it wasn't too much of a fail in reruns since the whole series is on DVD

I attribute its "success" (and I use the term lightly) to John Travolta's stardom. When he made a splash the first time and then later had a comeback, I think it boosted the show. Fans of Travolta would watch it in reruns to get their Travolta fix or, of they had never seen it before, watch it out of curiosity. I don't think it was ever popular enough on its own without that Travolta factor.

You nailed it!! This is one of the many shows I now regret I ever saw. Room 222 was way better.

Thanks for mentioning Room 222. I'd heard of the show but never seen it. I think there are a few episodes on YouTube, so maybe I'll watch them this weekend.

I attribute its "success" (and I use the term lightly) to John Travolta's stardom. When he made a splash the first time and then later had a comeback, I think it boosted the show. Fans of Travolta would watch it in reruns to get their Travolta fix or, of they had never seen it before, watch it out of curiosity. I don't think it was ever popular enough on its own without that Travolta factor.

You maybe right because before it's release on DVD in 2014, the show was not seen at all on TV since 2002-03 on TV Land.

kotter seems be finally finding sucess on antenna tv in the Afternoons

I think the days of measuring success by DVD sales or syndication are becoming dated as well. So much is now geared towards streaming, I believe the days of just going out and getting something on DVD as a box set are becoming a format of the past.

I think the days of measuring success by DVD sales or syndication are becoming dated as well. So much is now geared towards streaming, I believe the days of just going out and getting something on DVD as a box set are becoming a format of the past.

Yup because I am more interested in watching tv shows on my computer instead of my tv

I think the days of measuring success by DVD sales or syndication are becoming dated as well. So much is now geared towards streaming, I believe the days of just going out and getting something on DVD as a box set are becoming a format of the past.
Very True!

I checked out the DVD set from the library and I started watching it last night. I hadn't seen the show in decades so I'm really enjoying myself and I'm surprised that I actually remember some of the episodes. I've only seen about four episodes off of Disc one so far, but they have funny movements. Yes, it's very dated and some of the jokes that Kotter tells at the beginning and the end of the show to his wife (I had forgotten about those segments) are kind of dumb but some of them are funny. I agree that Season 4 is lame. I watched some of those eps a few weeks ago on Antenna TV.

I checked out the DVD set from the library and I started watching it last night. I hadn't seen the show in decades so I'm really enjoying myself and I'm surprised that I actually remember some of the episodes. I've only seen about four episodes off of Disc one so far, but they have funny movements. Yes, it's very dated and some of the jokes that Kotter tells at the beginning and the end of the show to his wife (I had forgotten about those segments) are kind of dumb but some of them are funny. I agree that Season 4 is lame. I watched some of those eps a few weeks ago on Antenna TV.

Watch the episode from season 2 I think when the sweathoggs perform on stage the song jeepers creepers

The series debuted on my 11th birthday, and that was the demographic they were going for. So, if you are my age, 55+ then, you will get it. Today's nostalgia is Seinfeld. I am an old old man.

I think the days of measuring success by DVD sales or syndication are becoming dated as well. So much is now geared towards streaming, I believe the days of just going out and getting something on DVD as a box set are becoming a format of the past.

Not me, I will never go with the streaming route. I much prefer watching DVD's on my TV set. The computer and sites like You Tube are great for watching videos that you don't see on TV but that's it.

Welcome Back Kotter's original run was exactly the same years I attended high school, 1975 to 79. I was a freshman when the series started in September 1975, and was a senior when the series started it's 4th season in September 1978. I remember the series being more popular with the guys at the school instead of the girls, the girls who watched the show thought that John Travolta was hot stuff :rolleyes: :lol:. I actually had a bit of a crush on Marcia Strassman, Mrs. Kotter, I thought she was cute looking :eyes:. I agree that the 4th season isn't very good with Kaplan and Travolta missing much of the time. I have seasons 1-3 on DVD but not season 4. I remember watching the two parter from season 4 when it originally ran in 1979, the episodes where Horshack gets married, I thought those episodes were lame.

Not me, I will never go with the streaming route. I much prefer watching DVD's on my TV set. The computer and sites like You Tube are great for watching videos that you don't see on TV but that's it.

Welcome Back Kotter's original run was exactly the same years I attended high school, 1975 to 79. I was a freshman when the series started in September 1975, and was a senior when the series started it's 4th season in September 1978. I remember the series being more popular with the guys at the school instead of the girls, the girls who watched the show thought that John Travolta was hot stuff :rolleyes: :lol:. I actually had a bit of a crush on Marcia Strassman, Mrs. Kotter, I thought she was cute looking :eyes:. I agree that the 4th season isn't very good with Kaplan and Travolta missing much of the time. I have seasons 1-3 on DVD but not season 4. I remember watching the two parter from season 4 when it originally ran in 1979, the episodes where Horshack gets married, I thought those episodes were lame.


I watch DVD on my computer since the internet rules lol

I watch DVD on my computer since the internet rules lol

The internet is great for viewing You Tube but I like to watch DVD's on my TV set, wouldn't have it any other way. :)

The internet is great for viewing You Tube but I like to watch DVD's on my TV set, wouldn't have it any other way. :)

I guess I can binge watch a DVD on TV since I used to do it in 2006 when the internet was still live and popping.

I guess I can binge watch a DVD on TV since I used to do it in 2006 when the internet was still live and popping.

Binge watching can be fun, choose a favorite show and watch several episodes in a row marathon style.

Binge watching can be fun, choose a favorite show and watch several episodes in a row marathon style.

But how do you binge watch and come to this site at the same time?:lol:

Do I pick one?

But how do you binge watch and come to this site at the same time?:lol:

Do I pick one?

I guess you could do your binge watching first, then sign on to this site and post about what you watched.

For classic TV shows that aren't currently seen on TV and haven't been released on DVD, the internet can be a useful source for those types of shows as long as episodes have been made available/downloaded for viewing.

The thing that aged well is the theme song. I love it.

The thing that aged well is the theme song. I love it.

Funny that you mentioned that because the theme song is being used now for a Apple Bee's Commercial:wave:

The thing that aged well is the theme song. I love it.

I agree and I love it too.

Funny that you mentioned that because the theme song is being used now for a Apple Bee's Commercial:wave:

Yeah, I saw that for the first time last night.