Is there anybody that you personally like or admire that the majority of other people don't seem to? Either the consensus on this board or on the segment itself.

For starters I'll say Christie Mutzfeld (Todd Kelly's girlfriend, the young guy killed in 1989 in rural Indiana). On one hand I can understand Todd's dad being saddened over his death, but I never liked his grudge (not letting her go to the funeral is pretty darn cold!) and insistance that she was withholding information. I got the impression she was nice and genuinely cared about Todd (no matter what state their romantic relationship was) and mourned his death. I also thought she was cute as an early teen - she reminds me of alot of those Val chicks in the 80s and early 90s I grew up seeing. I hope she's doing well today.

I know there's a Todd thread already, but I hope Mafoos Huck gets caught someday. This is one of those cases I kept thinking would be solved pretty quick. I first saw it in '94/95 and was surprised it was unsolved even then.

Stephen Geri.

The first time I watched the episode, I thought he was an a--hole, but after watching it a few more times I came to like him and I think he is innocent. It just seemed like his in-laws were really gunning for him despite the lack of evidence. I can't exactly explain why, but I didn't get the same vibe from Geri that I did from other "concerned" spouses like Paul Polis, Judy Groezinger, Mark Nichols, etc.

C.W. Roddy of Palo Alto, California

She's a brave woman that's not afraid to stand up to gang members/drug dealers, or criminals in general.

EXCELLENT thread idea oldschooler81, and a great complement to my 'people on UM you tried to like but just couldn't' thread

my man Bob Bean has been getting a bad rap lately.

Al Henderson and Tim McClure

I agree about Christie Mutzfeld. I always felt really bad for her though most people seem to think she's faking. I also agree about Tim McClure, actually. I never thought he was guilty.

I wasn't aware most people disliked C.W.- I always strongly admired her for her bravery and actions.

Tim McClure


Oh…not Tim McClure, CD!! Not old Timmy Boy!! I know you think he’s innocent but you have to at least admit he’s woefully inept at professing that innocence. That guy was the absolute worst at saying things that would seem so easy to say. He seemed like a hard luck guy but it seemed to me, by the way he answered questions, like he made his own hard luck. I bet if he fell into a box of money he’d come up holding his own ass.

Oh…not Tim McClure, CD!! Not old Timmy Boy!! I know you think he’s innocent but you have to at least admit he’s woefully inept at professing that innocence. That guy was the absolute worst at saying things that would seem so easy to say. He seemed like a hard luck guy but it seemed to me, by the way he answered questions, like he made his own hard luck. I bet if he fell into a box of money he’d come up holding his own ass.

Yep good ole Timmy. He certainly didn't seem devious enough to commit the crime. A bit odd, definitely but not a murderer.

Oh and another to add...Bill Wacker. Poor guy is treated pretty harshly on here but I still think he's innocent.

"I wasn't aware most people disliked C.W.- I always strongly admired her for her bravery and actions."

My mistake, I misinterpreted the question. Instead of thinking "underdog" in terms of viewers and people's negative opinions of someone featured on the show, I was thinking along the lines of someone featured on the show who appears to be an "underdog" in life (in general) by learning about the setting they're in or their background.

"I wasn't aware most people disliked C.W.- I always strongly admired her for her bravery and actions."

My mistake, I misinterpreted the question. Instead of thinking "underdog" in terms of viewers and people's negative opinions of someone featured on the show, I was thinking along the lines of someone featured on the show who appears to be an "underdog" in life (in general) by learning about the setting they're in or they're background.

That's ok. I'm glad to see others agree with me about her. :wave: She certainly is an underdog and definitely one of the bravest people U.M. ever profiled.

I also thought Lisa Albert was not guilty of being directly involved in the arson. I think she was an unwilling participant and forced to go along with her husband. The fact that she called the police herself also really made me feel she wasn't so guilty. What sentence did she receive?

I don't think the Wackers were guilty either. Just the vehement way the husband was determined not to move, etc. really seemed convincing- I don't believe they were involved.

- Jule Caylor
- Dub Wackerhagen. Probably a decent guy with a bit of an agitated anger problem who just snapped.
- Gail Delano. She gets such a bad rap on here for her "selfishness" in committing suicide. She was mentally ill!

(Runs to the bunker..) :)

Phillip "Monster from Outer Space" Breen

Hmm, I agree on Gail Delano and yes even though Jule is a sack of crap, I do feel he got accused of his wife's 'murder' because he is a sack of crap and not because of any actual evidence. With Gail, I feel that many on here are being unfair in giving her the very harsh bad rap. Yes it was in the technical sense selfish of her to end her life. However what you all seem to not understand is that she was seriously mentally ill as in she had severe depression and when you have depression that bad, it can get to a point to where you feel suicide is the only alternative to living a life you simply don't want to live anymore. But the mistake the majority of you are making is you are judging an irrational person from a rational point of view.

Gosh who are some other underdogs that I like? Michael Scott Martin is one. I also like Tommy Zeigler. I do feel D.C. Cole, the 'investigative journalist' from the Dave Bocks case, I feel like D.C. Cole gets a bad rap because of the full man chew mustache and his turtleneck and blazer and his accent and mullet. The D.C. Cole look could make a comeback any day of the week. Don Deveroux is another guy who am I amazed is still around, people had it out for him for years and maybe still do. But glad to see he is still kicking.

I also agree with Crystaldawn on Tim McClure and Bill Wacker. I feel both are guys that got bad raps for things that they didn't have anything to do with.

I do feel D.C. Cole, the 'investigative journalist' from the Dave Bocks case, I feel like D.C. Cole gets a bad rap because of the full man chew mustache and his turtleneck and blazer and his accent and mullet.

I liked D.C. Cole, too. I feel like he suffers the "Jeff Oberholtzer problem" some people initially have--they judge him solely on how he looks.


- I feel like Eddie Wooten was more a victim of an extremely weak personality than he was a cold-blooded killer. Cheryl Holland was an entirely different matter, though.

- Father John Kerrigan. Even though there's dark speculation about his past and the circumstances surrounding his disappearance, I like to give him the benefit of the doubt rather than automatically assume that it's possible he might have been a pedophile.

- Sort of in the same vein--the U/I man who committed suicide in Sacred Heart Catholic Church in Boise, ID. We may never know the details of his past, but his story certainly came to a sad and lonely end.

- Jacqueline Castenada's mother. Perhaps it wasn't the best choice to leave her baby momentarily unattended, but she certainly does not deserve the flak I've seen dealt her on the site that shall not be named.

- The cashier at the store where George Owens bought his cigar and ice cream in Lobelville, TN. It seemed like she felt really guilty about what happened. It wasn't her fault.

- Arnold Archambeau, Ruby Bruguier, and Ruby's father Quinten. I could write volumes on why they don't deserve the harsh criticism they've gotten in the past on this forum. Serious mistakes were made, but above all, what happened was a tragedy.

- Patty Belew, the former massage parlor employee who became an Oak Grove, KY coucilwoman and spoke out against the police corruption and coverup in Candy Belt and Gloria Ross's murders. A woman employed in a degrading and illicit industry will certainly at some point feel very small and quite helpless, and will definitely be judged harshly. I admire her courage.

Hmm Meg the Egg, Eddie Wooten, there is an interesting one. I hate to say it in some ways but I agree with you on him. It is because Eddie, by all accounts, uneducated, he did not get past the 7th grade, and he was easy for Cheryl to intimidate and manipulate. I am not saying he should not be in prison for what he did and I do not think you are saying that either but I do not view Eddie in nearly the negative light that I do Cheryl for a variety of reasons, but basically it is because Eddie, even though a grown man physically he had the mentality of a 12 or 13 year old. I have actually thought of writing him just to see how he communicates as he remains in prison to this day.

But the other big difference between Eddie and Cheryl. Eddie I do not think had malice on his mind. I do not think he killed one or both of the Harvey's for money, he killed them because Cheryl wanted him too. It remains unclear whether Eddie shot one or both of them. He has gone back on his story somewhat over the years. First he said he killed both of them but at Cheryl's direction than he later said he killed Joe at Cheryl's direction but that Cheryl killed Mattie 'Teet' herself. But that said, that was Cheryl's aunt and uncle, not Eddie's and even more so, Cheryl and the Harvey's were very close, they viewed her as their own daughter and they viewed Cheryl's daughter as their granddaughter.

So, looking at it: As the Harvey's other relatives said, all Cheryl had to do was ask the Harvey's for the money and they would have given it to her. She did not even have to be threatening, she could just say she was in trouble and needed help and needed money and they would have given it to her with no hesitation at all. So yeah, the whole thing and how far it went was just very unnecessary and to be honest, Cheryl threw Eddie under the bus pretty quick and well, she showed her true colors as if the fact she had Eddie kill her aunt and uncle was not enough to show she showed her true colors.

I am glad you like D.C. Cole, he seemed cool, he was straightforward and to the point. He seemed like a guy comfortable in his own skin. Also I agree with you on Father Kerrigan. Folks here jumping to conclusions based on recent scandals with the Roman Catholic Church (of which I am a member) but in any event while I admit there were/are problems in regards to the molestation issue within the Roman Catholic Church I too give Father Kerrigan the benefit of the doubt. As of this moment I do not believe he was a pedophile as many here are pretty quick to fling that allegation about without any real evidence of it.

Just to update, Eddie Wooten is now 49 and turns 50 later this year. He is in prison at the Northeast Correctional Complex in Mountain City, Tennessee. His parole eligibility date is currently listed as January 25th, 2019.

Also on Cheryl Holland she too remains in prison, claims to be 'born again' and does admit she put Eddie up to the whole thing. Cheryl turned 46 last month and remains in prison at the Tennessee Prison for Women in Nashville. Her parole eligibility date is currently listed as 05/26/2020.

Jeff Overholzer (spelling)...the man from Breckenridge, Colorado who was a suspect in his wife's murder. Sure, both women who were killed knew Jeff but for some reason I don't think he did it. He just came across as innocent and he passed a lie-detector test. These were the famous orange sock murders.

I am also a fan of D. C. Cole. The way he says, "The effect that it has on the environment is one thing. We have an environmental disaster," is very authoritative and genuine. He also seems legitimately concerned about how Dave Bocks died: "I'd hate to think that he was conscious. I can't imagine a more horrible death than that." Overall, D. C. Cole is a cool guy and he made the segment even more enjoyable.

Judy Olive....and I admit that I was one of the people who was so angry that she would continue to leave her son Alex with his father knowing he was being abused. I'm sure this woman has had years of guilt and shame over Alex and what might have been done differently. I hope that she can find some peace at some point in the future.

The couple that followed Dennis Depue on that country road. I'm sorry but I thought that was just stupid! I definitely would have taken his tag number and called the police but no way would I have followed him. What if he had been armed and had retaliated against them??????

And not case related but I'll go ahead and say Dennis Farina. I don't think anyone could ever fill Robert Stack's shoes. I don't think he's doing a bad job. Granted I still hate the music and the new set but Dennis is doing okay...all things considering.

Bob Bean. Served in the military, abides by the law, has a sense of humor, wants a moral environment for his children. What's not to like?

Curtis Croft. The guy made some mistakes in his early life, but he worked hard to steer away from that when the tragedy happened. Alot of people are under the theory that the tragedy would not have happened had it not been for Curt's own wrongdoings, but he certainly did not ask for this. And while Jenny obviously got the worst of it, he didn't come out of the accident completely unscathed either, then had to endure harassment from the police.
What people need to remember is that the guilty parties were in the pick up truck, not the motorcycle

Bob Bean. Served in the military, abides by the law, has a sense of humor, wants a moral environment for his children. What's not to like?

Curtis Croft. The guy made some mistakes in his early life, but he worked hard to steer away from that when the tragedy happened. Alot of people are under the theory that the tragedy would not have happened had it not been for Curt's own wrongdoings, but he certainly did not ask for this. And while Jenny obviously got the worst of it, he didn't come out of the accident completely unscathed either, then had to endure harassment from the police.
What people need to remember is that the guilty parties were in the pick up truck, not the motorcycle

Yeah, I mean no doubt he wasn't innocent and made some enemies, but I don't think he's the horrible person some people make him out to be either. I can understand being angry with him because Jenny wouldn't have been hurt if not for him coming into her life (and that's true), but he genuinely seemed sorry.

P.S. I wonder if the kid outside the pizza place confronting him in the reenactment had anything to do with the attack the next day. Off topic, but that's one of the most 80s scenes in the whole show, lol.

I don't agree about Gale Delano. She was a DESPICABLE human being. Even if you could successfully argue that she had mental illness, there are several nagging things that come to mind.

1. The reason she came to be depressed. She was extremely selective in the men she dated, ignoring many potential suitors because they didn't meen her personal qualifications. And after not being able to find a man to her liking after being this picky, she decides that this world is not for her. If she had mental illness, it was through her own biases. And she had this absurd notion that men weren't interested in her, despite the fact that many of them were. It's not like she was the most unattractive person in the world here.

2. Do we really know for a fact that she killed herself because she thought the world would be better without her? Or was it because she was SELFISH and she though absolutely nothing about the children she left parentless, the relatives she left to worry, or the men she left to become suspects.

3. The manner in which she killed herself: Ok, it would be one thing to just off yourself and leave a suicide note, and have a relative find the body. But the manner in which she did this, leaving her sons and relatives to worry that she might have gotten robbed, abducted, raped and murdered and was being held captive somewhere, and forcing several innocent men subject to police scrunity, is absoutely horrible IMO. Going as far as to hide her purse, she knew damn well what she was doing.

4. She was obviously aware that she needed help, as evidenced by the calls to the disc jockey. But she failed to get professional help.

I am sorry, but I'm gonna need more than a simple "she had mental illness" to convince me Gale was not a selfish, deplorable human being.

I was thinking about Gayle Delano today. Hadn't she been responding to or placing ads in the personals columns?

Is it possible that she made arrangements to meet a strange man in another state, hoping to find true love, or to run off (purposely planning to leave her old life behind forever), imagining that she'd have a happy life with a new man, only to unknowingly meet a murderer posing as an interested boyfriend?

I can't remember all the details to her case. Were her travels and behaviors completely indicative of a person preparing to kill herself?

I was thinking about Gayle Delano today. Hadn't she been responding to or placing ads in the personals columns?

Is it possible that she made arrangements to meet a strange man in another state, hoping to find true love, or to run off (purposely planning to leave her old life behind forever), imagining that she'd have a happy life with a new man, only to unknowingly meet a murderer posing as an interested boyfriend?

I can't remember all the details to her case. Were her travels and behaviors completely indicative of a person preparing to kill herself?

She traveled from Maine to Alabama and overdosed on something rather, killing herself. Prior to leaving Maine, she parked her car at a restaurant and ditched her purse in the bushes. The only wrongdoing here was on her part, she didn't come into contact with anyone unsavory.

Hmm, I will disagree with you on this one wiseguy, at least as far as calling Gale Delano a 'deplorable' human being. No, James Donald King or someone in that vain is deplorable, not a woman who suffered from mental illness and a serious mental illness at that. She suffered from major depression which is a chronic illness, yes it can be successfully treated with medication and therapy although at that time the medications were not all that good and the misunderstanding about the illness while bad enough back then is equally prevalent now, your opinion about how you would have to be convinced that she 'just suffered from more than a mental illness' opinion is proof of this.

The fact of the matter is, Gale Delano suffered from major depression LONG before she ever started getting into the personal ads. I feel the personal ads scenario is a red herring when that simply is not accurate that she either was depressed by being involved in them or that her depression was caused by writing in them or that she was 'too picky' in the men she dated or tried to date through the ads, which correct me if I am wrong is also inaccurate as she only tried to date how many men through the ads that were different looks, shapes and sizes? Yes you were basing your opinion off what she put in her ad, but that said, I do not feel that her description was 'picky' she mostly described herself and what she was allegedly like and then basically said she wanted a male who was not overweight and not a smoker, that is hardly being picky.

Yes Gale killed herself, yes it was in the true definition of the word 'selfish' as to be selfish would be only thinking of oneself. However I have considered, as I have and at times do suffer from major depression and have considered suicide (I am not considering it now and am doing alright now, now that I have proper treatment via appropriate medicines and therapy) however as weird as it sounds, when a person seriously considers suicide, and it has been years since I seriously considered it, but when a person seriously considers that A. They are not in their right mind and B. a lot of the time, they honestly think if they did this, the people around them would be better off. That is how it gets when you are that low, by low, I mean that down, you honestly think that by killing yourself, you would make everyone feel happy again and you would stop being such a disgrace and a letdown to your family and friends and acquaintances.

So to clarify, was what Gale did, both in the regard to her killing herself and the whole wild goose chase she led people on, making people think she was abducted and murdered when in fact she killed herself, wrong? Of course it was. Plus if Gail was a Roman Catholic, like I am, we are aware that basically the one unforgivable sin in the Church is killing yourself. But again, the biggest part of the problem in regards to Gail Delano is we have rational people looking at an irrational person from a rational point of view.

Sorry Wiseguy, you said she was 'despicable' not deplorable, so my apologizes although there is little difference in the two words. Point No. 1, professional help, okay, first off, we must remember this was 1985, 1986 that Gail killed herself, 1986 if I remember right. Very different stigma to seeking professional help then as opposed to now and even now it has a huge stigma. Point No. 2, the segment mentioned that Gail had been on and off anti depressant medication for years prior to her suicide so that tells me that she had sought professional help of some kind either through a physician or through a psychiatrist to even get prescribed such meds and those were the days before Zoloft or Prozac or anything like that so back then all you had were tricylic anti depressants.

You are giving her way too much credit to think that she did this all for herself and shameless and pathetically shift the burden to her, thinking it was this grand conspiracy to not only screw everyone over but also that she wanted to leave her kids parentless, screw over her family and make men suspects in a non existent murder. I feel she did this because she wanted out of her life, but felt there was no other way to go about it and that if she did it this way that her family would be able to deal with it better. As irrational as the thought seems and is, it is rather quite common.

Sorry Wiseguy, I beat up on you too much on this one, it is just I get emotional on this issue, the mental illness issue.

I was always bothered by the fact that UM never mentions her 2 sons. Where did they live at the time Gale was missing? When she was found out to be deceased, what happened to them then? Did they go to an orphanage? What arrangements, if any, did she make for the children before she committed suicide? Did she take care of them in her will? The update just glosses over all of this, probably because they didn't want to have Gale viewed in a negative light. But this would have been nice to know.

Its hard to get past the sympathy you feel for Gayle's family and have any left for Gayle. There are a lot of ways she could have sought help for her deep depression. She could have tried a mental health facility or even medication to help. Bottom line if she had determined to end her own life she could have simply wrote her sons and family a suicide note telling them what was in her mind and why she didn't want to live anymore and it would have avoided a lot of the heartache they went through. Its as simple as that.

On this issue, I am very torn. Recently, one of my best friends committed suicide and I'm still in the wake of the hole left behind, as are friends and family. Definitely, I think that Gayle was bent on doing this and too far into depression to consider backing out. Perhaps she decided to orchestrate her own disappearance because she thought that doing so would spare her family the pain of her decision to take her own life. Maybe she thought that this would be better than them knowing the truth. I don't think she was deplorable or despicable. Let me tell you (and my regards also to anyone who has experienced this as well) the pain and uncertainty that comes with such an event is quite staggering. And I am still in a whirlwind over this. It's hard to even begin describing how I feel. Mostly, I try to forget and accept, but there is a great deal of pain and doubt and questioning. Maybe Gayle thought of this and decided that she did not want her family going through that and they would be better off not knowing where she was. It may sound crazy, but no doubt she was very troubled and upset. If she was so intent to do this, then maybe that plan sounded good. But she also could have had very many doubts, but the depression won out in the end. I don't suffer from depression and therefore do not have the experience to discuss it accurately but I might ask, how much does this impact your reasoning and desires? I can never say I would condone what she did, but I have a hard time simply condemning her. I feel bad for both her and her family.