I love Cloris Leachman & I liked the Character on TMTMS, especially her interactions with Rhoda. However, with all that said, was it really smart to choose Phyllis as character to spinoff? She wasn't exactly the most likeable person. She was more a person you loved to hate.

I think after the success of the Rhoda spinoff and the laughs Cloris got on MTM and particularly on her guest spot at "Rhoda's Wedding",you can see why the thought :"Lets give Phyllis a show!".

I do think Phyllis was dumbed down on the spinoff but still was very funny,thanks to Cloris and the wonderful Judith Lowry as Mother Dexter.

I don't think people hated Phyllis,she was so over the top and totally over reacted like when she thought Rhoda was gonna marry,her brother Ben but then when she calmed down,she felt awful.

She was a total oddball,she could be selfish and controlling but wasn't out and out nasty like Sue-Ann except to poor Rhoda!

I think Phyllis was a far better supporting character. I just don't think she was a strong enough character to carry a show. No offense to Cloris Leachman - who did the best she could - but I just don't think it worked.

I think Phyllis was a far better supporting character. I just don't think she was a strong enough character to carry a show. No offense to Cloris Leachman - who did the best she could - but I just don't think it worked.


I agree, Phyllis was much better in small doses, where as Rhoda was someone viewers rallied behind.

I think so. Plus, not only was the character not the most sympathic, but she ended up really playing the straight role once she got into her own sitcom. It was the people she lived and worked with that were supposed to be the screwed up ones and not her.

I think so. Plus, not only was the character not the most sympathic, but she ended up really playing the straight role once she got into her own sitcom. It was the people she lived and worked with that were supposed to be the screwed up ones and not her.


That's sort of what they did on the Rhoda spinoff. On MTM, Rhoda was neurotic and insecure. Then on her own show she was normal and her sister played the neurotic, insecure one. lol

That's sort of what they did on the Rhoda spinoff. On MTM, Rhoda was neurotic and insecure. Then on her own show she was normal and her sister played the neurotic, insecure one. lol
True - plus having her divorce Joe was a huge mistake.
Even when they had them fighting for what seemed like no apparent reason it was a drag - I mean, it wasn't even "funny fighting" like Archie and Edith. Even at my young age back then, I used to think Joe was hot, but really high maintenance. LOL

I think Phyllis really worked in the first season,I liked the quirky photo studio setting.
Yes I would agree Phyllis did start to be the straight person to quirky characters like Mother Dexter and Audrey.
It was the boring office setting I didn't like in season2 but funnily enough,Phyllis in season2 was more like her old MTM character.
Too many new characters in season2 for me,that I didn't really care about,did like Mark though,Phyllis never liked him,like she never liked Rhoda.

I think with the proper setting and 'situation', and no changes to the character, Phyllis could have been a hit.

Unlike 'Mary' or 'Rhoda', 'Phyllis' was never captain of her own ship. Phyllis became everyone's target for insults all of the time - the butt of everyone's joke in every scene (though Phyllis, for some reason, was too naive to realize this), whereas this never happened to Mary or Rhoda. The audience did not know whether to side with the supporting players (and laugh at her) or identify with her and laugh with her. It was tricky since she wasn't too likeable.

The setting didn't help (I have said this a hundred times). The 'photo studio' was cold and unpleasant, while the supporting players (Liz Torres and Dick Schaal) had no chemistry with each other or with Phyllis.

Funnily enough, Liz Torres ended up co-starring with Valerie Harper on the short-lived sitcom City, which aired on CBS in 1990. Some episodes of City are up on YouTube if anyone's interested.

I actually thought that the season 2 office setting had more interesting characters and story lines when compared to the season 1 photography studio. I remember a critic years ago saying that the show Phyllis was less satisfying when compared to the Rhoda series. It is still a shame that Phyllis did not last longer.