It's been awhile since I've watched MTM, but from what I recall, Mary and Phyllis were really not close. I could be wrong, but they were certainly nowhere as close as Mary & Rhoda.

I think they were friends (didn't Mary get the apartment because she knew Phyllis?), but no, not nearly as close as she and Rhoda, at least not as close as the latter became.

Phyllis was a hard person to get close to, I imagine. It would take someone very patient and even tempered (like Mary) to befriend her. I'd guess that Phyllis felt closer to Mary than Mary did to her.

One time after Phyllis walked out the door, Mary says something like, "You know I like her....and I don't know why."

Interestingly, there were 2 times Mary was absolutely infuriated with Phyllis, and neither time was on TMTMS.
On Rhoda, at Rhoda's wedding, Mary was mad at her, along with everyone else, because she "forgot" to pick Rhoda up! and on Phyllis Mary was mad because Phyllis made her fly out to San Francisco because it was urgent, and when she got there, Phyllis had no pending urgency!

I think they were friends (didn't Mary get the apartment because she knew Phyllis?), but no, not nearly as close as she and Rhoda, at least not as close as the latter became.

Phyllis was a hard person to get close to, I imagine. It would take someone very patient and even tempered (like Mary) to befriend her. I'd guess that Phyllis felt closer to Mary than Mary did to her.
I feel the same way. I personally think Mary liked Bess better than Phyllis!!! :lol:

I feel the same way. I personally think Mary liked Bess better than Phyllis!!! :lol:

Well, in all honesty, Bess was a lot more likeable. :lol:

Well, in all honesty, Bess was a lot more likeable. :lol:
Yes, she was - thank goodness. :lol:

Well Phyllis and Mary had known each other years previous, obviously, although I don't recall them ever telling us how. But it's definately "shown" in various eps that they have known each other for a very long time. Besides the Pilot, another off the top of my head is, Rhoda The Beautiful from Season 3. When Phyllis asks Mary if she remembers the "orlon"-fur coat she used to always where.

I think they were friends, but yes, Phy did get on Mary's nerves quite a lot in my opinion. There are several moments/episodes to list, lol. But I would call them friends, but the closest, or best, but friends none-the-less.

And, I hope you don't mind me bringing this up Kristen, and if you do, you can skin me alive later, :lol:. But I remember when we would talk about the story idea I had that took place YEARS after the series ended when Mary was taken to the hospital and her daughter calls in all her friends to see her and I didn't really have places for certain characters and one was Phyllis (I think Sue Ann was another) and you had mentioned that you didn't see Phyllis visiting Mary if she was in the hospital, IF I recall...

Speaking of the Phyllis eps, I would love to see the one with Mare. I actually wouldn't mind seeing the series. I don't remember seeing many AT ALL even when they aired it on TV. I just see bits and pieces in my mind.

I could look it up, lol, but does anyone remember how many Mary guest starred in? Was it only the one?

^ MTM was on 2 Phyllis eps:

"The First Day" (originally aired September 30, 1975)

"You're Not Getting Better, Just Older" (originally aired September 27, 1976)

Well Phyllis and Mary had known each other years previous, obviously, although I don't recall them ever telling us how.

I remember Phyllis's brother asked Mary if Mary and Phyllis met in college and Mary said no that it was after that, but she didn't elaborate on how they met.

Wasn't Phyllis significantly older than Mary? I know Mary was supposed to be 30 when the show began and Phyllis must have been at least 40. So they must have met someplace outside of school, unless Phyllis was just an unusally older student at the time.

I remember Phyllis's brother asked Mary if Mary and Phyllis met in college and Mary said no that it was after that, but she didn't elaborate on how they met.
Yeah, we never did learn how Mary and Phyllis met.

Mary and Phyllis were friends but Mary was a true friend,Phyllis was a friend on her terms!

I think Phyllis is summed up in the episode where Phyllis asks Ted to speak at a meeting,she makes Mary late for work,then when Mary asks Phyllis for a lift,Phyllis does such a guilt trip,Mary takes the bus.

Mary finds Phyllis funny but also annoying at times,Mary although younger,mothers Phyllis at times,so they are friends but Mary's a lot better friend than Phyllis.

^ I think the lesson here is never, EVER ask for a lift from Phyllis!! (As Rhoda would also learn on her wedding day. :lol:)

Or Mother Dexter come to that!

If you think about Phyllis in season 5 too,she comes up to Mary's when she wants to borrow chairs,when she wants to boast about having a new male friend take her out,when she has an argument with Lars over money.

Overall Phyllis was a bragger but a mass of insecurites underneath and she needed Mary a lot better than Mary needed Phyllis but thanks to Cloris Leachman's comedy genius,this made Phyllis hilarious.

In my relationships with people, there are certain ones who I like to see every week or so and have a friendly relationship with them and are cool. However, if they were family members, or co-workers or someone I had to see everyday, I would eventually snap and kill them because they are so annoying.

Who could really stand Phyllis anyway? Lars was either on a conference or drunk. Then he conveniently was killed off when CBS gave Phyllis her own show. (for some reason, although that 200 year old grandmother was cool.)