I'm bored, so I figured I may as well start a new topic. There are probably many cases that have been hampered by the police's incompetence. So, we should list some of them. :D

Eric Tamiyasu - Sheriff Joe Wampler's burning of Eric Tamiyasu's mattress has to be listed. Plenty of potential clues have possibly been lost. Though, some have argued he did it on purpose. Even if he did, he's now become one of the main suspects.

Gary Grant Jr - The police interrogation of Gary Grant Jr's friend was a hilarious mistake. For hours, they tried to get a confession from a mentally handicapped kid. Instead of focusing on other potential clues, they went off the beaten bath for nothing. I'm pretty sure this was early in the case, so that hurt any chance of finding any early clues on who killed Gary Grant Jr.

Michael Rosenblum. That whole business with the backdated letter is really suspicious.

There are quite a few (I hope Kadrmas sees this, he has pointed out many in the past).

Right off the bat one name immediately sprang to my mind: Debbie Wolfe.

How anyone could believe that she somehow drowned herself in a barrel while wearing someone else's clothes in the lake behind her house is beyond me.

Steve Sandlin.

Police Chief Carson (was it?) definitely knew more than he was telling. And I mean the whole thing being a suicide? Come on...

Danny Casolaro. Suicide, eh? I thought all cops were trained to view each death as a homicide when investigating. They also didn't alert the family until 2 days after Danny's body was found.

I think it should be specified what's bad policework and what's just a plain cover-up.

In a lot of these I think you could make an argument that the mistakes in the investigation were intentional.

curious what you think mastermind in the Eric Tamiyasu case.....bad police work or cover up?

Tommy Burkett-Why didn't the police interview the neighbors??? What about the 911 call??? Why did the police automatically think it was a suicide.

The guy who spoke for the police was full of ****.

curious what you think mastermind in the Eric Tamiyasu case.....bad police work or cover up?


Cover up.

It takes a lot of effort to burn a mattress. I'm sure everyone here has known how much hell it is to put a mattress into a room. It's not something you just do offhandedly. You have to move the materials of the sheet, move the mattress, gain the assistance of a third party, then find the materials to burn the mattress. It's practically a 6 step effort!!!!

My theory on Eric Tamiyasu's death has been that Don Davis hired either the sheriff or his deputies to committ the murder. Sherriff Wampler either burned the bad as part of the plan or decided to do so to protect his deputies.

It's even possible that Sherrif Wampler was going to expose Don Davis for the murder and may have made an on spot financial agreeement to burn the bed.

I've always found it bizzare that the two main suspects in this case were both privy to the burining of the bed. AND YET NEITHER ONE OBJECTED TO IT!!!!:mad:

The Bordello Murders for sure. Kathy Bonderson.

mastermind the I find the on the spot bribe theory in tamiyasu case very possible. I have never considered it before, seems a hell of alot more likely than the deputy theory. was don fairly well off? if so i wonder how much cash it would have taken? 10k at least probably.

Also, in the Eric Tamiyasu case, there was that jazz about Eric having some affair with the Polynesian woman, which was only mentioned by Don Dixon. Sheriff Wampler's wife was Polynesian, and supposedly the woman Eric was having the affair with. It seemed to be a convenient way for Don to turn the blame towards the Sheriff. The Sheriff ordering the burning of the bed looked awfully suspicious as well. So there are 2 things that help Don get the blame off himself. I wonder if he was blackmailing the Sheriff.

Stanley Gryziec is another case where the police did a real half-assed investigation. The police said he had been stabbed, and his body had to be exhumed to prove it was a gunshot wound. I think someone on that police force knew or was involved in the drug activity happening in the bar associated with Peter Gryziec, Stanley's brother.

Tracy kirkpatrick. For more details, read my post on the thread on her. Frederick county police screwed this up completely.

It was Frederick, Maryland city police not the county police or county sheriff that screwed up Tracy Kirkpatrick's case but yes Marlins, one of the rare times you and I agree that case was heavily screwed up by Frederick, Maryland Police.

Let's see, since Justin wanted me to point some out, here are some more police that in my opinion either bungled or covered up cases. They are on my top 20 personal crap list:

The Cumberland County, North Carolina Sheriff's Department in the case of Debbie Wolfe. Covering up evidence, lying about the barrel that Debbie was found in. In my opinion the Sheriff's Department started lying about the existence of the barrel because they did not secure the crime scene and Debbie's Property thus whoever killed Debbie came back and stole the barrel and the Sheriff's Department did not want to own up to the fact that they bungled it so they started lying about the barrel's existence and on top of that started to insist that Debbie Wolfe somehow killed herself by drowning herself and they also seemed to go out of their way to make Debbie Wolfe's mother seem mentally unstable.

The Fort Lauderdale, Florida Police in regards to the nailing of John Purvis for a crime they did not do and continuing to keep him in prison even though as early as a year after Purvis's conviction the two detectives on the case had strong evidence that someone other than Purvis committed the crime. Even though it appears this situation was eventually rectified in terms of John Purvis getting out of prison after spending nine years in there for a crime he did not commit, it is still an injustice that could have been prevented had procedure been followed properly and it allowed the real people behind it to the walk the streets for nearly a decade.

The Mountain Air, New Mexico Police Department and their role, specifically, Chief David Carson's role in the death of Steve Sandlin. Now, I am not saying that Chief Carson necessarily murdered Steve Sandlin. I do, in my opinion, think that Chief Carson knew much more than he was letting on. I do not care if he passed a polygraph or not, he knew more. Carson, I do not know, I just got a bad vibe off the guy. He just seemed really flat and it was not just that maybe he is not an emotional guy, he just seemed like he was almost bored with the whole conversation. Plus what really bothered me is he kept insisting that Sandlin must have killed himself and that just seems weird to me. His theories were either Sandlin offed himself or he accidently shot himself. But yet never says anything of murder? It is just weird. Plus it seems that the proof needed there was something more to that case was the New Mexico Attorney General's Office firing a Deputy Attorney General because he was investigating this case too much and forcing another Deputy Attorney General that was helping him to resign. Plus the planted marijuana. Yeah, there was a cover up there, in my opinion.

The Eddy County, North Dakota Sheriff's Department. The late Sheriff Ed Almarrajas (sp?) and his crackpot theory of Kathy Bonderson's 'accident' aka murder. I mean seriously, this guy must have been pals with Rob Bonderson, either that or did not want to admit that a murder occurred in his jurisdiction as I am sure that the Bonderson case was the biggest case Almarrajas ever had to deal with and it showed. I mean suggesting that Kathy somehow veered to the right, went over the tracks, the car somehow burst into flames, Kathy hitting her head on the roof of the car, than going over to the passenger side of the car, specifically on the floor. Allmarajas claimed it was a ruptured gas tank that did this? Please. The gas tank was not only fully intact but held 12 gallons of gasoline! The lines to the gas tank were intact. The keys were an obvious plant as they were virtually undamaged on the floorboard of the car (I have made a theory in that thread as to how those keys got there) plus an arson investigator saying that there were large amounts of gasoline in and around the car. Plus the empty gas can found not that far from the car. Allmarajas overlooked all of this and Rob Bonderson walked free for twenty years until he knew he was finally going down and then he killed himself.

The Lawrence County, Missouri Sheriff's Department for their beyond incompetent handling of the Johnny Lee Wilson case. Bullying a mentally impaired young man into confessing, tricking him, misinterpreting evidence. That is the classic formula for arresting and convicting an innocent person. Picking a suspect that you feel it will be easy to get him to confess, basically picking a guy out of thin air and building a case around him. Like basically taking random things in Johnny Lee Wilson's house and saying oh, he has these things he must have done it when in fact all of those items had nothing to do with murder at all.

The Fairfax County, Virginia Police Department and their incompetent handling of the Tommy Burkett case. I did not believe a word out of that dude's mouth that spoke for them. I mean you could tell he did not even believe the official bs that he was being told by his superiors to spew to the public.

The Rome, New York Police Department and their incompetent which in my opinion was a cover up of Stanley Gryziwek's (sp?) murder.

The Chicago, Illinois Police and their horrible handling of evidence in the Chad Mauer case, I mean, losing that jacket in his car, losing what could have turned out to be a critical piece of evidence, could have been tested for DNA, etc, who knows? I do feel that jacket was key to solving that case.

The Cook County, Illinois Sheriff's Police for covering up the death of Michael O'Mara. Now I also find it strange that a particular agency would be in charge of the investigation into the death of one of their own officers? The reason I find this unusual is because if an officer gets in a fender bender the whole investigation is typically turned over, yet an officer winds up dead under unusual circumstances and the Cook County Sheriff's Police insists on investigating it? Does not add up.

The Summit County, Colorado and Park County, Colorado Sheriff's Department along with the Colorado Bureau of Investigation for all focusing on Jeff Oberholtzer way too long in that case.

Now I could be off on this one as the laws probably were not what they are now, in fact I know they are not. But still, the Manatee County, Florida Sheriffs Department for basically allowing Jim Burnside to kill his wife and then on top of that run off and be on the run for over 3 years.

The Miami-Dade, Florida Police Department for their hatchet job on the whole Luis Diaz/Bird Road Rapist case in railroading an innocent man.

The Orange County, Florida Sheriff's Department in their railroad job of Tommy Ziegler.

The Jacksonville, Florida Sheriff's Department for basically letting Michael Haim get away with murder.

The Blue Island, Illinois Police Department and the Illinois State Police for their nice little railroad job of the Dowalliby's.

The DuPage County, Illinois Sheriff's Department for their role in going after Rolando Cruz and not even looking at Brian Dugan.

The Pearl River County, Mississippi Sheriff's Department for their seeming cover up of the death of Norman Ladner. Last I checked, a wallet containing 140 bucks does not get up and walk off on its own. Plus the Sheriff's little cheap shot at the Ladner's was uncalled for.

The Summit County, Colorado and Park County, Colorado Sheriff's Department along with the Colorado Bureau of Investigation for all focusing on Jeff Oberholtzer way too long in that case.

I'm going to respectfully disagree on this one being bad police work.

The fact that Annette Schnee(sp?) had Jeff's business card on her is more than enough reason for him to be a person of interest. That is kind of too much of a coincidence to just overlook.

Also I don't necessarily believe that investigating Jeff hurt the case that much. I think they had investigated other leads concurrently with looking into Jeff's background.

That would be why I said focusing on Jeff Oberholtzer too long. However I am not so sure why the fact that his business card being in her wallet would make Oberholtzer a person of interest? I have lots of business cards in my wallet, if something happened to me, should all of the people in there be checked out too as people of interest? I mean I guess I can see why Oberholtzer was checked out in the beginning but it seems they focused ONLY on Oberholtzer and ignored potentially viable leads.

That would be why I said focusing on Jeff Oberholtzer too long. However I am not so sure why the fact that his business card being in her wallet would make Oberholtzer a person of interest? I have lots of business cards in my wallet, if something happened to me, should all of the people in there be checked out too as people of interest? I mean I guess I can see why Oberholtzer was checked out in the beginning but it seems they focused ONLY on Oberholtzer and ignored potentially viable leads.

I agree about the business card jazz. Breckenridge was only about 2000 - 3000 people at the time of the murders. It's not that out of the question that Annette would have had Jeff's business card. When you have a small business, you give your card to just about anyone in hopes of bringing business in. It makes sense that Jeff would have picked up Annette when she was hitchhiking because his own wife hitched, and he would want to make sure any woman had a safe ride.

The sheriff's office is very certain that the 2 women were murdered by the same person because they found items from Annette's wallet/purse at Bobbie's crime scene.

However, based on what was presented in the segment and what I've been able to read on the case, there is no motive established for Jeff to have murdered Bobbie Jo, much less Annette. Investigators usually start with who is closest to the victims when looking for suspects. In this case though, Annette was murdered first, then Bobbie Jo, and at different areas. Why would Jeff have murdered Annette first? That makes no sense to me.

There's a group of people that we all know and love on UM that are very suspicious of the deaths of their spouses, but I've never believed Jeff to be one of them. He was quite sad in the interview over the loss of his wife.

Also remember that Jeff had trouble with his alibi. They could not find the person to corroborate that alibi until much later. And even then there were some problems.

I agree though that Jeff came off as sincere in his interview.

Family members are always looked at first during murder investigations. It's no surprise Jeff Oberholtzer would be questioned first even if his business card wasn't in Annette's wallet. I didn't see anything wrong with that.

Even before he was cleared as a suspect, the police pretty much ruled out Jeff being involved. In order for him to have been guilty, he would have had get home from work, drive 25 miles into town, find Annette, pick her up, drive another 20 miles, rape her, murder her and dump her body in time to get back home around 5:30 to receive the telephone call from his wife (which phone records confirmed). Then, from there he would have had to get back in his truck, drive back to Breckenridge, find his wife in the darkness, drive 10 miles, kill her and then get home in time for his friend to visit who stayed over for a couple hours. That evening, Jeff and his friend bought some beers at a gas station (a sighting that was also confirmed) around the time Bobbie left her friends at the bar to leave and hitchhike home over 20 miles away. Unless Jeff can move at the speed of light, me thinks it would have been impossible for him to have pulled this off.

Kadrmas, glad you mentioned Tommy Ziegler. That's one that was bungled and now has been covered up by generations of officials.

I'll add Kathy and Danny Freeman (and the missing girls, Lauria Bible and Ashley Freeman.) The authorities cleared the house after the fire, opening it up to the survivors, saying that only Kathy's body was there, and had been removed. Then while looking for clues the Bible's find Danny Freeman's body and a purse belonging to one of the girl's that was stuffed with cash. (Sort of ruling out "robbery" and the "girls murdered the parents and ran away without taking their cars or money" theories.)

Jeremy Bright. The cops said that the missing 14 year old boy had "run off with the circus", which according to his family, would be out of character for him.

Leroy Drieth. Some idiot bystander claims that Leroy got into a fight with his girlfriend and said he was going to committ suicide. The authorities don't investigate a thing, and tell the mom to "go home and get over it". Years later, a delayed autopsy points to murder.

Keith Warren. SOMETHING more needed to be done. The "suicide" death looked staged, the kid was wearing someone else's clothes, the officials had his body sent to the funeral home of their choice, for a quick embalming, without first sending it to a coroner for any kind of autopsy or even superficial inspection of the body. A post exhumation autopsy raised serious questions about the validity of the suicide theory.

Patty Stallings. The authorities did everything they possible could to pin her child's natural death on her and packed her off to prison. They didn't allow her to attend the baby's funeral. When the second child came down with the same symptoms and got a correct diagnosis, they still railroaded her, saying the first child's death was murder. The judge wouldn't allow the 2nd child's correct diagnosis (exactly what had killed his brother) to be admitted as evidence in the trial. Even though the father was not implicated at all, his parental rights were stripped, allowing him to see his surviving son only once a week. It took many doctors calling in to explain MMA (the killer disorder) to the officials before the prosector would finally drop the charges, let Patty out of jail, and offer one of the worst "apologies" I've ever heard regarding his conduct.

I've seen at least two cases where the family of a murder victim goes back to a murder scene the police have already searched and find a (often vital) piece of evidence the cops missed. Sometimes its found somewhere incredibly obvious. One example was the Lauria Bible case and the other was one where the family found a shell casing on the carpet, I forget the names of those involved.

I've seen at least two cases where the family of a murder victim goes back to a murder scene the police have already searched and find a (often vital) piece of evidence the cops missed. Sometimes its found somewhere incredibly obvious. One example was the Lauria Bible case and the other was one where the family found a shell casing on the carpet, I forget the names of those involved.

The second one was the murder of Stanley Gryziec. Although the question remains in that one of was it a police blunder, or cover up?

Keith Warren. SOMETHING more needed to be done. The "suicide" death looked staged, the kid was wearing someone else's clothes, the officials had his body sent to the funeral home of their choice, for a quick embalming, without first sending it to a coroner for any kind of autopsy or even superficial inspection of the body. A post exhumation autopsy raised serious questions about the validity of the suicide theory.

This is think is a cover up. With all due respect to Keith's family, I think there may have been a very good reason to hide who killed. I have a feeling that by investigating Keiths death another possibly larger investigation might have been hindered. I also feel that if Keiths murder were investigated there might have been other murders done.
I think there can consolation in that Keith's death was not in vain.

I feel that the Tommy Burkett and Keith Warren cases may be similar.

I've seen at least two cases where the family of a murder victim goes back to a murder scene the police have already searched and find a (often vital) piece of evidence the cops missed. Sometimes its found somewhere incredibly obvious. One example was the Lauria Bible case and the other was one where the family found a shell casing on the carpet, I forget the names of those involved.

I believe the Norman Ladner case had a similar story, with that strange "transmitting/radio" device discovered by Mr. Ladner near the scene.

As far as straight-up coverups are concerned, my vote goes to the Ives/Henry case. I don't believe that Clinton conspiracy garbage, but LE and the DA's office totally screwed that investigation. The more you learn about it, the sicker you become.

Most incompetent police work? Far and away the Kathy Bonderson case, with Sheriff Eddie Allmaras' wild theories on Kathy's "accident" and his refusal to work with State Patrol (remember how he was "forced" to sign the exhumation papers?). Apparently it was more important for him to be right than for Kathy to receive her rightful justice. I never knew what the hell he was trying to prove.

I don't think the investigators in the Russell Evans case were the brightest bulbs either.

Patty Stallings. The authorities did everything they possible could to pin her child's natural death on her and packed her off to prison. They didn't allow her to attend the baby's funeral. When the second child came down with the same symptoms and got a correct diagnosis, they still railroaded her, saying the first child's death was murder. The judge wouldn't allow the 2nd child's correct diagnosis (exactly what had killed his brother) to be admitted as evidence in the trial. Even though the father was not implicated at all, his parental rights were stripped, allowing him to see his surviving son only once a week. It took many doctors calling in to explain MMA (the killer disorder) to the officials before the prosector would finally drop the charges, let Patty out of jail, and offer one of the worst "apologies" I've ever heard regarding his conduct.

That prosecutor should have lost his job and been stripped of his ability to practice law. I remember watching that case when I was a kid and even at 10 years old I could see all the holes in his argument. For example, when he said that the accused woman had poisoned a baby bottle, there were many credible accounts that she was only in the room for a minute or two alone with the opportunity and he tried to say she was in there for much longer. Ridiculous! :mad: :mad:

Jacqueline Dowaliby. I just read the book "Gone in the Night" and it is just stunning how much the police and Cook County were out to get them. And I am a person who totally supports law enforcentment but really, David and Cindy got shafted big time by EVERYONE.

And the jury - sending a guy to prison because of the eyewitness account of a guy seeing the size of a nose across such a large distance?

Yep, the Jaclyn Dowaliby case and Patty Stallings... those are probably the top two worst, all around cases, with regards to the police work, the juries, the judges, the officials, the courts, the witnesses, everyone involved.

In both the Dowaliby and the Stallings cases, the family had to PROVE their innocence, rather than the state being required to prove their guilt.

I understand that when children are murdered or die under suspicious circumstances, the parents are often involved, which causes them to be the first to be suspected, but there is absolutely no excuse for the authorities, who are supposed to be helping the parents of murdered children by bringing the killers to justice, to instead railroad the grieving parents, refuse to conduct a thorough investigation, or consider other scenarios. Especially with overwhelming evidence of the parents' innocence, as in these two cases.

The people working in the "system" are trained to carry out justice and enforce the laws. Politics, politicians' careers, climbing the political ladder, cops looking for promotions, officials wanting recognition and their names and faces in the news, etc, should never be allowed to bring the corruption associated with that into finding true justice for the victims: the children and their families.

Well, this is quite common in child cases where people are convicted off of literally no evidence. I think this happens in a lot of cases but child cases have higher incidents of conviction than any other even when there is not any evidence. Look at Juan Rivera who was just convicted in Illinois of 1st degree murder of a 12 year old girl for the third time despite being excluded by DNA. I think it is because there is this desire in the public's psyche to want 'justice' even if there is no evidence to convict a person. Basically as long as SOMEONE pays for the crime than it makes everyone feel better psychologically and emotionally even if there is no evidence to suggest the person convicted actually did the crime.

The Dowaliby case was beyond ridiculous and easily on my personal top 20 sh*t list of terribly run investigations and rail road jobs. Basically the Blue Island Police and the Illinois State Police were under intense public pressure to arrest someone for this crime and they were getting egg on their faces because they could not find who did it. So when they could not find who did it within the first 48 hours they basically decided it must have been the Dowaliby's who did it. Personally, I do not think the cops even thought the Dowaliby's did it, but I think because they could not find anyone else to take the fall for it they went after the Dowaliby's and as the Dowaliby's found out, when the cops turn on you, so do the media and your 'friends' and neighbors and the community as a whole. They got thrown under the bus very badly.

Now another problem in the Dowaliby case and in the Stallings case and in many cases is that the suspects are being prosecuted by elected officials (District Attorneys or State's Attorneys) when these officials in my opinion should not be elected but should be appointed. The same goes for Sheriff's who are basically politicians but are elected positions under the guise of being a lead law enforcement officer. In the Dowaliby's case, the State's Attorney at the time the Dowaliby's were charged, Richard Daley used this case to basically propel himself to be elected Mayor of Chicago.

Across the country there are numerous instances of prosecutors and sheriff's using cases to propel themselves to higher office. In Montana, then assistant Attorney General Marc Raciot railroaded Barry Beach (who remains in prison on a life sentence for murder) and Raciot (pronounced Roscoe) went on to eventually be elected Governor of Montana in 1992, re-elected in 1996 and was actually President George W. Bush's top choice to be U.S. Attorney General but Raciot turned down the appointment. Raciot though did run President Bush's re-election campaign in 2004.

In Washington State, Dave Reichert, who was a long time member of the King County (Seattle) Washington Sheriff's Department used the fame he achieved in working the Green River killings to be elected Sheriff of King County in 1997 and re-elected in 2001 and he was then elected to congress in 2004 and re-elected in 2006 and 2008. Now I like Reichert and in this particular instance the suspect that was captured was/is guilty 100 percent. However Reichert's role in the investigation was overblown and there were plenty of other people who worked just as hard on that case that you never hear about. Reichert basically was given all of the credit for the case even though he was one of many investigators that worked it. I expect Reichert to eventually run for U.S. Senate or for Governor of Washington.

In Missouri, Kenny Hulshof was an Assistant Attorney General who it is well known put no fewer than 5 innocent people behind bars. One was exonorated from death row, another one was released last year after serving over 15 years in prison for a murder he did not commit and at least 3 others have strong innocence claims and I expect will eventually get their convictions overturned. Hulshof used his fame to gain election to congress in 1996 and was re-elected in 1998, 2000, 2002, 2004 and 2006. Hulshof ran for Governor of Missouri last year but lost to Attorney General Jay Nixon who has a terrible record in his own right and has used his fame in railroading people to not only gain 4 terms as Attorney General but to be elected Governor of Missouri last year.

Mike Arcuri in New York who later had at least two people that he worked to convict, exonorated used his fame to be elected Oneida County (Rome) New York District Attorney in 1992 and was re-elected in 1996, 2000 and 2004 and was elected to congress in 2006 and re-elected last year.

I could go on and on and on with these. But this is a big part of the problem is that these folks use their elected offices as a stepping stone to higher positions and a great way to do that is to draw attention to yourself by being overly sensational and dragging people through the mud. Look at DuPage County, Illinois State's Attorney Joe Birkett. This guy personally prosecuted Rolando Cruz and Alex Hernandez not once but twice and they were innocent and there is evidence that Birkett had serious doubts about their guilt but pursued the death penalty for them anyway. Birkett has since been elected DuPage County State's Attorney, he was just re-elected to his 4th term last year and he ran for Attorney General of Illinois in 2002, just barely losing to Lisa Madigan and he was the Lieutenant Governor candidate on the republican ticket in 2006 that lost. Birkett is running for Attorney General again next year.

Oh yeah...Patty Stallings got the shaft big time from Missouri as well.

In both the Dowaliby and the Stallings cases, the family had to PROVE their innocence, rather than the state being required to prove their guilt. Exactly. And in the Dowaliby case there were two jurors who believed David had NOTHING to do with it and were bullied/pressured to convict. Now it is on their shoulders for caving but it seemed to be a perfect storm of so many things: Overzealous prosecutors, Richard Daley, bad eyewitnesses, RIchard Daley, poor Blue Island police and bullying jurors. And Richard Daley.

As the one juror said, "David Dowaliby probably loved that girl more than anyone else yet he was in jail for killing her? Ridiculous!"

Well that is actually quite common where there are hold out jurors usually one or two that are hold outs and they get bullied into changing their vote to convict. Now that is gutless on their part but I do not totally blame them. Look at Tommy Zeigler's case, in his case, there was at least one hold out juror and eventually the trial judge called this woman's doctor and had him put the woman on large amounts of valium to make her more cooperative.

In fact there have been several instances where jurors did not want to convict but did so because they did not know that they could actually hold out! They were under the impression that because the verdict if a jury comes to a verdict has to be unanimous that they thought that because the majority wanted to convict that they had to vote to convict too even if they did not want to vote to convict. That has actually happened and is quite scary.

I'm bored, so I figured I may as well start a new topic. There are probably many cases that have been hampered by the police's incompetence. So, we should list some of them. :D

Eric Tamiyasu - Sheriff Joe Wampler's burning of Eric Tamiyasu's mattress has to be listed. Plenty of potential clues have possibly been lost. Though, some have argued he did it on purpose. Even if he did, he's now become one of the main suspects.

Gary Grant Jr - The police interrogation of Gary Grant Jr's friend was a hilarious mistake. For hours, they tried to get a confession from a mentally handicapped kid. Instead of focusing on other potential clues, they went off the beaten bath for nothing. I'm pretty sure this was early in the case, so that hurt any chance of finding any early clues on who killed Gary Grant Jr.

Yes to all the above. A few more come to mind......

1. Jack Jones, the IU student found in the stairwell. For sitting there 30 + hrs, he looked pretty good and nice and dry for being there during several hours of rain storms! Plus the coroner not checking the cranial vault. What a moron!

2. Kathy Bonderson. The Sheriff decided what it was and ignored evidence from a more experienced officer because his nose was out of joint. It's hard for a car to explode when the fuel line is intact after being hit.

3. Tony Lombardi. Enough said.

mphs95, I think you are referring to Jack Davis, Jr., who was the student found in the stairwell.

They thought that he had been in the stairwell for even more than 30 hours. They said he'd been there for 5 days, which if the facts as presented on UM are correct, would have been impossible.

And an autopsy of a young man who died in circumstances unknown not including a complete scientific examination of the body is unbelievable.

http://www.unsolved.com/ajaxfiles/une_jack_davis_jr.htm

Gary Grant Jr - The police interrogation of Gary Grant Jr's friend was a hilarious mistake. For hours, they tried to get a confession from a mentally handicapped kid. Instead of focusing on other potential clues, they went off the beaten bath for nothing. I'm pretty sure this was early in the case, so that hurt any chance of finding any early clues on who killed Gary Grant Jr.

50/50 on that

1.While Boo Mason may not have been a suspect, there is a strong possibility that Boo was a witness of some sort or may have been indirectly connected to what Gary Jr.s death

2. I think the cops felt too much pressure in this case and saw a ******** kid's confession as a win-win for all parties. The case would be closed and most likely Boo would get off easy due to his age and condition. That still does not excuse them for trying to get an easy confession. I also would;t rule out that the cops were told to get the confession from Boo in order to end this case quickly.

3. The wounds inflicted on Gary Grant were not beyond the capability of Boo Mason.

Yes the Jack Davis Jr case, that is a classic blunder. In this case it was a combination of an autopsy that was a hatchet job at best. I mean the coroner that did this autopsy originally in 1987 claimed that Jack Davis Jr's cause of death was that he in essence choked to death on his own vomit. However the problem with that ruling was there was no evidence of vomit or food particles in Jack's lungs, none. That means he did not die from that, yet the coroner seemed to be picking causes of death out of a hat in this case.

Plus the coroner never examined the head even though according to the authorities Jack allegedly fell down a flight of stairs yet they do not check out the head? Personally, I think the Coroner's officev just figured that the Davis's would forget about this whole thing, their son was dead, that they would just be quiet and move on and not question anything. I mean the autopsy was a joke and it really makes you wonder if the coroner in the first autopsy even really looked at Jack's body.

Dr. Wecht did a wonderful autopsy and with some good old fashioned detective work was able to find the cause of death. I liked how Wecht helped the Davis's out and held the authorities feet to the fire. But of course the police wrote it off and continue to write it off as just being a drunk college kid that fell down the stairs. The cops do that a lot in cases like this where they really do not do any investigation and just write it off as a drunk college kid falling down the stairs as they do not care what happens to these kids. Sad but true.

Just thought of another. It wasn't mentioned in the segment, but a 1990 article I found in the Cleveland Plain Dealer (which I believe posted in a Sova thread here) describes how the Newburgh Heights PD apparently thoroughly bungled the Kurt Sova investigation through sheer incompetency--moving the body before pictures could be taken, poor record keeping, not being cooperative with Cleveland PD, etc. Detective Carras, who was interviewed in the segment, was fired from the NHPD shortly after the filming of the segment after it was discovered he was abusing and dealing Percocet, and had beaten a suspect involved in an unrelated case during informal "questioning" in 1988. Curiously, the site of this questioning was the very ravine Kurt was found in seven years prior.

50/50 on that

1.While Boo Mason may not have been a suspect, there is a strong possibility that Boo was a witness of some sort or may have been indirectly connected to what Gary Jr.s death

2. I think the cops felt too much pressure in this case and saw a ******** kid's confession as a win-win for all parties. The case would be closed and most likely Boo would get off easy due to his age and condition. That still does not excuse them for trying to get an easy confession. I also would;t rule out that the cops were told to get the confession from Boo in order to end this case quickly.

3. The wounds inflicted on Gary Grant were not beyond the capability of Boo Mason.Let's keep in mind, this is a kid, and he's ******** as well. If he has any confession to make, he'd give it right off the bat. The cops were absolute idiots by acting as if he was some criminal mastermind. Why spend countless hours trying to get a confession from a kid? The cops weren't dealing with an adult suspect. It's not like Boo was some genius who could come up with the perfect lie.

Let's keep in mind, this is a kid, and he's ******** as well. If he has any confession to make, he'd give it right off the bat. The cops were absolute idiots by acting as if he was some criminal mastermind. Why spend countless hours trying to get a confession from a kid? The cops weren't dealing with an adult suspect. It's not like Boo was some genius who could come up with the perfect lie.

True, but it's also possible that Boo may not have enough sense to explain what he did. If he did kill Gary, Boo may not really know that he did anything serious or that Gary was even hurt in anyway.

True, but it's also possible that Boo may not have enough sense to explain what he did. If he did kill Gary, Boo may not really know that he did anything serious or that Gary was even hurt in anyway.That's the problem. The cops seem to think they were dealing with a rational person. Like I said, I'm sure Boo would have confessed right off the bat since he wouldn't have realized how serious murder is. The cops were fools by acting as if he was some secretive adult.

The ones I remember are...

Mark Nichols-polygraph came back inconclusive, the police figured we've done all we could with that, AND the police made no significant effort to seize the two vehicles he sold almost immediately around the time Christi disappeared...

Chad Noe and family-don't know if this was a police blunder, but rather sheer incompetence!

Eric Tamiyasu-I really think this is a cover up with all the parties suspected knowing something

Maybe we should put down the worst police work ever done in the history of UM.....

The failure to stop 9-11 and capture Osama Bin Ladin. (by all prior and current presidential administrations)

Steve Page in Vidor, Texas who to this day, in my opinion continues to get away with the murder of his wife. He covered himself though by explaining away his DNA presence on his wife as being that of a sexual encounter that was consentual despite the fact that he and his wife were estranged and did not get along. He at first denied seeing her that night and then changed his story to fit the evidence. So basically he was covered in that there was no conclusive physical evidence tying him to the murder and that there were no witnesses. Plus having your parents be friends with the Chief of Police does not hurt. Page has never been charged in connection with his wife's death but his wife's family filed a wrongful death civil suit against him. The first two trials were mistrials but in the third civil trial he was found to be responsible for his wife's death.

You can thank Bill Clinton for both of those.

Tommy Burkett for sure. The note that said "I want to be cremated" made no sense and the 911 call disappearing didn't either. The guy interviewed seemed more like a spokesman and was only telling what he was told to say.

I'll have to second Chad Mauer as well. For some reason, the Chicago PD wanted nothing to do with this case. I suspect because they found him on the south side, they assumed it was drug or gang related, found no reason to put anymore resources into it and washed their hands of it.

No, not Bill Clinton! It's Bush's fault! lol

Next year, it'll be Obama's fault. :D

No, not Bill Clinton! It's Bush's fault! lol

Next year, it'll be Obama's fault. :D

Agreed. The person to blame is always the one whose politics don't agree with your own. :-P

Your post is hilarious as that is exactly how many people think. But my post is based in fact. While President, Bill Clinton had Bin laden' head offered to him on a silver platter at least twice and each time turned down the offer. He also ordered the wall of silence which disallowed communication between the FBI and CIA. This was a huge hindrance on national security.

Your post is hilarious as that is exactly how many people think. But my post is based in fact. While President, Bill Clinton had Bin laden' head offered to him on a silver platter at least twice and each time turned down the offer. He also ordered the wall of silence which disallowed communication between the FBI and CIA. This was a huge hindrance on national security.

I'm assuming the "hilarious" post is mine. This forum is not a political one, and trust me, doing what I do for a living, who-started-what is really the last thing I want to discuss at the end of the day, but I'll go ahead and say it: neither of those two administrations did a damn thing about Bin Laden because it wasn't in either's interest. Nothing you have mentioned is enlightening to me: I know how that "went down" during the Clinton years, and I know how the Bush administration sat on its hands and did nothing to resolve the issue because it wasn't at all in its interest to do so. THAT'S fact.

But that's fine. I only have two degrees in the field and am a military officer that's been deployed twice to the Middle East. What do I know?

I hate all politicians equally.

Well, I guess what I mean to say is
that I hate 99% of them and
I'm suspicious of the other 1%. lol

I'm assuming the "hilarious" post is mine. This forum is not a political one, and trust me, doing what I do for a living, who-started-what is really the last thing I want to discuss at the end of the day, but I'll go ahead and say it: neither of those two administrations did a damn thing about Bin Laden because it wasn't in either's interest. Nothing you have mentioned is enlightening to me: I know how that "went down" during the Clinton years, and I know how the Bush administration sat on its hands and did nothing to resolve the issue because it wasn't at all in its interest to do so. THAT'S fact.

But that's fine. I only have two degrees in the field and am a military officer that's been deployed twice to the Middle East. What do I know?

Thank you for your service.

I do not hate any politicians although I dislike certain members of both parties immensely. I am a republican but I personally thought Bush was an awful President (full disclosure I voted for him in 2004) and I also think that Bush was very much at fault for not getting Bin Laden or for that matter not even really trying all that hard. I mean yeah Clinton had huge blunders and yes it is well known that he was offered Bin Laden on a silver platter on a couple of occasions but turned it down. I will say though that democrats are pretty well known for being inept when it comes to running the military so that is not a shock.

However Clinton really sat on his hands, be it the World Trade Center bombing, the Kobar Towers bombing (those were U.S. Air Force dormitories over in Saudi Arabia I believe), the U.S. Embassy bombings in Kenya and Tanzania and the USS Cole bombing all occurred on Clinton's watch. How did Clinton respond? He bombed a vitamin factory in the Sudan and a small camp in Afghanistan. However Clinton alone is not to blame for the events of 9/11, that was just a massive intelligence failure, both Clinton and Bush Jr in his first few months of his first term really minimized the seriousness of that whole situation because to be honest it was easier to do so.

Bush Sr also screwed up heavily in ended the Gulf War without taking out Saddam Hussein but of course that was a brilliant little UN recommendation, another bunch of incompetent, gutless turds in that organization. Hence why I feel the US should withdraw from the UN. However someone mentioned the FBI and the CIA, I am not a fan of either, particularly the CIA which I feel should be done away with altogether. But both of those agencies are notorious for botching numerous cases and sticking their noses into everyone else's business much of which does not concern them.

Hey Meg the Egg are you supporting Congressman Zach Wamp for Governor of Tennessee next year? He is from East Tennessee albeit not Knoxville, Wamp is out of Chattanooga, I like Wamp, good guy. I also like your Congressman, Jimmy Duncan, both Duncan and Wamp are members of the Liberty Caucus in the U.S. House, although Duncan is more libertarian than Wamp is.

Also thanks for your military service Meg the egg. As for Obama, well he is already a disaster but that is another story for another time. Interestingly, so far Obama's disasters are not military though, it is more of the fact that he just in general does not know what he is doing but that will happen when you elect a guy who basically not done anything of consequence in his life yet we trust him to run the country because he talks all positive and talks about 'hope'? Just more of Obama's narcissism dripping through and people fell for it.

Anyway that is my two cents or in this case, one dollar, I went way overboard so no one take offense the above are my personal opinions and not necessarily fact.

offtopic:
Back on here......I do feel the case...can't remember the name of course, but the teen/young adult boy was found sitting upright and the cops said he killed himself case closed, but I thought that the parents presented a compelling argument otherwise. At the very least, something was being covered up.

The case with the (again, no names are coming to my mind, I need to search around again) boy who was a hit and run but his shoelaces were somehow out of his shoes and it looked like he had been beaten up first. I don't know if this is really a case of shoddy police work per se though, but something that I think should have been looked at closer.

Pinky,

Tommy Burkett was the kid whose parents found him sitting upright, dead from a gunshot wound, with the gun in his lap in a condition which would have prevented it from firing. The mother later found something that looked like high impact blood spray on the staircase, but the cops never followed up on that info.

Russell Evans was the 13 year old boy in the hit and run with the missing shoe laces. Both cases are on the unsolved.com site. Some of the stupidity that went on in those cases is unbelievable.

I do not hate any politicians although I dislike certain members of both parties immensely. I am a republican but I personally thought Bush was an awful President (full disclosure I voted for him in 2004) and I also think that Bush was very much at fault for not getting Bin Laden or for that matter not even really trying all that hard. I mean yeah Clinton had huge blunders and yes it is well known that he was offered Bin Laden on a silver platter on a couple of occasions but turned it down. I will say though that democrats are pretty well known for being inept when it comes to running the military so that is not a shock.

However Clinton really sat on his hands, be it the World Trade Center bombing, the Kobar Towers bombing (those were U.S. Air Force dormitories over in Saudi Arabia I believe), the U.S. Embassy bombings in Kenya and Tanzania and the USS Cole bombing all occurred on Clinton's watch. How did Clinton respond? He bombed a vitamin factory in the Sudan and a small camp in Afghanistan. However Clinton alone is not to blame for the events of 9/11, that was just a massive intelligence failure, both Clinton and Bush Jr in his first few months of his first term really minimized the seriousness of that whole situation because to be honest it was easier to do so.

Bush Sr also screwed up heavily in ended the Gulf War without taking out Saddam Hussein but of course that was a brilliant little UN recommendation, another bunch of incompetent, gutless turds in that organization. Hence why I feel the US should withdraw from the UN. However someone mentioned the FBI and the CIA, I am not a fan of either, particularly the CIA which I feel should be done away with altogether. But both of those agencies are notorious for botching numerous cases and sticking their noses into everyone else's business much of which does not concern them.

Hey Meg the Egg are you supporting Congressman Zach Wamp for Governor of Tennessee next year? He is from East Tennessee albeit not Knoxville, Wamp is out of Chattanooga, I like Wamp, good guy. I also like your Congressman, Jimmy Duncan, both Duncan and Wamp are members of the Liberty Caucus in the U.S. House, although Duncan is more libertarian than Wamp is.

Also thanks for your military service Meg the egg. As for Obama, well he is already a disaster but that is another story for another time. Interestingly, so far Obama's disasters are not military though, it is more of the fact that he just in general does not know what he is doing but that will happen when you elect a guy who basically not done anything of consequence in his life yet we trust him to run the country because he talks all positive and talks about 'hope'? Just more of Obama's narcissism dripping through and people fell for it.

Anyway that is my two cents or in this case, one dollar, I went way overboard so no one take offense the above are my personal opinions and not necessarily fact.


Well stated. I agree with you on about 99.9% of that. I am a registered Republican but dislike a huge majority of members of both parties.

Speaking of politics and political families, was the Martha Moxley case ever rerun on Spike? If so, how much did they butcher the segment. If they released UM on disc season by season or even just every segment (uncut) and boxed them by category (similar to the new releases), I would buy them in a second. The format of UM was never really conducive for a season-by-season release.

Pinky,

Tommy Burkett was the kid whose parents found him sitting upright, dead from a gunshot wound, with the gun in his lap in a condition which would have prevented it from firing. The mother later found something that looked like high impact blood spray on the staircase, but the cops never followed up on that info.

Russell Evans was the 13 year old boy in the hit and run with the missing shoe laces. Both cases are on the unsolved.com site. Some of the stupidity that went on in those cases is unbelievable.
Thank you!!!!!! This is what having children does to you....sucks your brain right out of your head...and your memory. I think Tommy B was already mentioned in this thread. It bugs me that the clues don't add up....that families are ignored and it's felt they aren't wanting to accept the truth, or that blatant logic and evidence are ignored. I think that's definitely true that some families cannot accept the truth of circumstances, but there's enough to showcase reasonable doubt on both these cases, especially Burkett's!

Hey Marlins, well it is nice to see you and I agree on something for a change as we tend to disagree on the death penalty and crime and punishment and that sort of thing. Down in your state you have Charlie 'Chain gang' Crist running for Senate. Boy that guy, while I like him overall he is an opportunist big time. One term as Education commissioner, one term as Attorney General, run term as Governor and now running for U.S. Senate. I fully expect Crist will run for President someday, well, that is if his personal life does not catch up with him first. So now Bill McCollum running for Governor. McCollum I think has the edge but I would say he is not a shoo-in against Alex Sink, she has been out fundraising McCollum which I am concerned about. Then again Sink is much more personally wealthy than McCollum is. Sink and her husband Bill McBride are millionaires many times over.

Okay wiseguy.. Sorry, I was responding to a point but okay, I will respond to Marlins messages in PM if that would make you more comfortable?

However I do have a question. Before that post wiseguy you had never posted on this thread before. So I am curious whether you want to respond to the topic at hand which is (in your opinion) worse police blunders or whether you just posted in here because you happen to disagree with my politics?

Well, all you had to do was ask that we stop talking about politics in the thread. I was talking about politics, marlins was talking about politics, I was not the only one yet I get singled out. Strange to me but as I said, I will talk with Marlins via PM about our political views. Again, do you have anything to offer about the topic at hand? You can go back through the thread and you will find that I offered other stuff besides the political stuff. That was mostly based in one post, the other post where it was prominent was in response to some points that Marlins brought up and it was hard to respond to it without bringing my own politics into it.

I am not arguing with myself wiseguy. Again if you have problems with my politics or Marlins or anyone else's politics whatever than fine, that is your personal opinion. However what is with the whole threatening to ban me? You are not the moderator. I do not have a problem with you, I was merely asking why, if you had a problem with myself or anyone else discussing politics why you did not just politely ask us to stop? That is all you had to do. I am not a sad person and I know you know that which begs the question, what is with the name calling? I am not upset but yeah it irritates me when someone makes baseless allegations. Truth be told I am not going to be banned or at least do not expect to be unless you are aware of something that I am not? You started this, not me. You have yet to post anything in relation to the topic at hand and for some reason chose to make personal attacks against me.

Again wiseguy, I did not know that I violated the rules. I was not aware that was a rule, no politics allowed. Now I know. I was not aware I came close to being banned, I do not need you to submit pm's to me as proof, I will take your word for it although for the record I was not told I was close to being banned. I was told that I needed to stop being so rough on people and so I lightened up my act and usually stay that way unless someone gives me a reason not to be. Wiseguy, the reason I said you brought this up is because all you did was post a link and rub my nose in it when you could have simply said hey, I do not want to talk to politics because it is against the rules, fine, excellent, whatever, that is all you had to do. I also said in my opinion I would not be banned, I also said that I did not expect to banned. That is the moderators decision to make whether or not I am banned. I knew you knew that you were not the moderator, the reason I pointed out in the first place was because you were rubbing my nose in the fact that I broke the rules when I did not even know the rules were even in existence. I simply had no idea. I am sorry for all the offense I caused you, if I get banned for a mistake that I did not even know was a mistake until you pointed it out then so be it. I wish you the best either way.

But again Wiseguy you meant a certain thing and I misinterpreted it. That is easy to do online. I am not perfect or particularly smart and am not claiming to be. I just misinterpreted it, you wanted me to be quiet about politics and I took it the wrong way. Again, I was not aware of the rules on that and that was ignorance on my part. I do not know what to say, I guess I am sorry for the trouble caused, if I get banned, I get banned, I do not want to be banned but if it does happen I will not lose sleep over it. It is out of my hands regardless. But I do wish you the best and if I get to stay around I will talk to you about other threads and other topics. Take care.

This thread has gotten WAY off topic! There is a politics board for those that want to discuss/argue about all of that. Here we are disucssing worse police blunders on a case featured on UM.

Sorry I blame myself. I knew I should never have posted the 9-11 thing.

I will make amends by bringing this back to topic.I have to say the boat hit and run has to go down as being bad policework. I just don't see how they could not have tracked or found that boat.

boat hit and run has to go down as being bad policework. I just don't see how they could not have tracked or found that boat.[/QUOTE]

Didn't I read on this forum that there is evidence that the hit and run boater was Dennis Rodman??? If it wasn't this forum, it was one like it.

I remember reading it and totally being shocked that it could be him. (I guess because he was someone well known and not just a drunken guy with bad boating skills)

I will look for the link to the thread and if I find it I will edit this and post it here.

http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showthread.php?t=128635&page=2

Thank you!!!!!! This is what having children does to you....sucks your brain right out of your head...and your memory. I think Tommy B was already mentioned in this thread. It bugs me that the clues don't add up....that families are ignored and it's felt they aren't wanting to accept the truth, or that blatant logic and evidence are ignored. I think that's definitely true that some families cannot accept the truth of circumstances, but there's enough to showcase reasonable doubt on both these cases, especially Burkett's!

Yeah, there was a lot of weird stuff in Burkett's case. I think one of the unusual things was that his mother was an instructor at the college he went to, and there was suspicion about her students being involved.

And iirc, the reason Tommy was found sitting upright was that his body had been propped up with towels and/or blankets to keep him from slumping over. I think there was speculation that he was almost posed, to create shock value, for when his parents found his body.

I need to see the segment again... It's been a few months and my memory is faulty on the details....

Mysteryphile, I also remember reading something about Dennis Rodman being connected to the Boat Hit and Run case. I don't recall where I read it though. I think it was on this board...

Tracey your right, it was. I dug around a little bit and found the thread. :)

Wonder why they never charged him with it?

Not sure if this constitutes as a blunder, but having just watched the Paul Stamper case for the first time, I hated how he kept being not charged based on technicalities every time the police picked him up.

Besides that, I think these are highest on my list:

Michael Rosenbaum
Tony Lombardi
Kathy Bonderson
Tommy Burkett
Johnny Lee Wilson

Basically anything where the officers or detectives get deadlocked on what happened, and refuse to see it any other way is dangerous (i.e. thinking someone commited suicide when there's compelling evidence to murder).

Yes I agree on all of those cases. Mastermind, naw it was not your fault, it was mine and mine alone. Yes the Michael Roesnblum case is just incredible in terms of incredible amounts of bungling and covering up. Obviously it will never really be known what happened there. In terms of the boat hit and run, I was not aware of Dennis Rodman being possibly involved so that is interesting. But yes, lots of cover ups, Charles Morgan, Tommy Burkett, Danny Casolaro, Ralph Zeigler, to name a few.

boat hit and run has to go down as being bad policework. I just don't see how they could not have tracked or found that boat.

Didn't I read on this forum that there is evidence that the hit and run boater was Dennis Rodman??? If it wasn't this forum, it was one like it.

WTF???

All been mentioned before, but I have to add my top 3 votes:

1. Keith Warren
2. Russell Evans
3. Norman Ladner

Oh, hell... since I have a good list going: :D

4. Chad Mauer
5. Ralph Ziegler
6. Eric Tamiyasu
7. Steve Sandlin
8. Doyle Wheeler

I think Crystal Spencer's case is a little suspicious too. What's the deal with the autopsy report? And of course Anton didn't get to see it until long after the body had been cremated.

Jeremy Bright. The cops said that the missing 14 year old boy had "run off with the circus", which according to his family, would be out of character for him.



The police who originally had the case were useless. Not only was it out of character for Jeremy, his best friend was terrified about "someone" coming to get them (his family) and his best friends sister saw someone covered in blood and reported it to police. The police did NOTHING for an entire WEEK because they said he was a runaway. By the time they decided that something probably did happen it had been a week and the suspects had plenty of time to discard evidence and and cover things up.

Gary Grant Jr - The police interrogation of Gary Grant Jr's friend was a hilarious mistake.
yep, that is one case, there are many like Jacqlene Dowalaby, but here are two cases i can't stand one is Russell Evans, why did they not look for this Brian kid???? but the biggest one is Keith Warren, first they cut the tree down after saying the case is closed, 2nd they did NO investigation, 3rd someone called Mark Findley also dies of mysterious circumstances, this case NEEDS another look into it, i feel that it was some type of drug or gang deal and the police may even be involved, and the fact that no one investigated the pictures sent to Keith's mother bothers me worse!!

Gary Grant Jr - The police interrogation of Gary Grant Jr's friend was a hilarious mistake.

While I don;t think Boo was Gary Grant's murderer, I;m not sure the police were completely in the wrong here. They may made mistakes, but there was some rationality behind this.

1. The damage done to Gary Grant Jr was not beyond the capability of a someone Boo's age.

2. Boo was the only real witness at the time. He had to interrogated intensively
There is a lot that points to Boo Mason knowing what happened that day.

3. Because the case involved a fellow police officer and a child, the pressure on the detectives to close the case had to be unusually high. I could easily see in the heat of the moment that the detective's interrogation that they instictively jumped at the moment that Boo was amenable to confession.

4. This is my opinion, but i do feel that a supervisor upon learning about Boos handicap, may have told the detectives to get a confession from Boo to end the case. Realizing that Boo as a ******** minor, they probably knew that Boo would not see any real time. They get a closed case, Gary Grant gets closure, Boo spends a year in a special juvenile hospital. They probably saw it as a win-win-win scenario.

Keith Warren, first they cut the tree down after saying the case is closed, 2nd they did NO investigation, 3rd someone called Mark Findley also dies of mysterious circumstances, this case NEEDS another look into it, i feel that it was some type of drug or gang deal and the police may even be involved, and the fact that no one investigated the pictures sent to Keith's mother bothers me worse!!


1.This is more likely a police coverup than an intentional blunder.

2.The cover up may have been done to protect undercover agents, indformants and special investigations. As crazy as it sounds, the coverup may have been done for good reasons.

1.This is more likely a police coverup than an intentional blunder.

2.The cover up may have been done to protect undercover agents, indformants and special investigations. As crazy as it sounds, the coverup may have been done for good reasons.
yeah i could see that, but still, my guess is it is some kind of gang or drug issue and that is why it was a coverup.

yeah i could see that, but still, my guess is it is some kind of gang or drug issue and that is why it was a coverup.

If it;s a simple drug or gang issue, why would they need to coverup? Keith Warren's death is a murder which would be valuable to prosecuting the gang or drug dealers. Wouldn't they want that fully investigated?

If it;s a simple drug or gang issue, why would they need to coverup? Keith Warren's death is a murder which would be valuable to prosecuting the gang or drug dealers. Wouldn't they want that fully investigated?

yeah, true too, i don't know, this case is just very odd and the fact that is was such a cover up is why everyone wishes it was solved?? and not one boy died, two did, Keith Warren and Mark Findley, the reason i want this solved is the mom, she was sent pictures of her son hanging, that is even more scary.

Hmm, I will consider both coverups and blunders under the same roof for purposes of this debate. In the Tony Lombardi thread I was ripping on police for how they investigated possible suicides. Well here are a few on my crap list. The Westerville, Ohio Police Department in the Tony Lombardi case, the Galesburg, Illinois Police Department in the Danny Williams case, the Riverside County, California Sheriff's Department in the Jeff Digman case, the Fairfax County, Virginia Police Department in the Tommy Burkett case, the Maryland State Police in the Ralph Seigler case, the Roanoke, Virginia Police Department in the Rae Ann Mossor case, the Cook County, Illinois Sheriff's Police in the Michael O'Meara case, the Chicago, Illinois Police Department in the Chad Mauer case. Basically in all those investigations, the cops in my opinion got tunnel vision. Hell, it was very obvious that Chad Mauer was murdered yet they tried to write it off as a suicide. His parents even believed it at first until they saw his body and realized he had been beaten as his knuckles were skinned and he had bruises on his face.

In terms of other blunders, well again, it is easy to play Monday morning quarterback. However in the Michael Rosenblum case, the police department knew something more, they were covering up that death for some reason. The Miami Police Department in what they did to Luis Diaz. The DuPage County, Illinois Sheriff's Department for what they did to Rolando Cruz and Alex Hernandez. The Lawrence County, Missouri Sheriff's Department for what they did to Johnny Lee Wilson. The Garland, Texas Police Department for allowing a detective that had previously arrested Michael Scott Martin and who was obviously very biased against the defendant due to his personal dislike of the defendant, he should not have been allowed to work on the case. The Orange County, Florida Sheriff's Department and that piece of crap Judge Maurice Paul, for what they did to Tommy Zeigler. That little twerp Jeff Ashton deserves dishonorable mention too but because he was not the original prosecutor he gets more of a pass. However Maurice Paul is still on the bench! Albeit he is now a federal district court judge in Gainesville, Florida but this guy is still hearing cases when he should have been disbarred and imprisoned himself a long time ago. Also, the Cumberland County, North Carolina Sheriff's Office for covering up Debbie Wolfe's death. I mean did they not try to claim she stuck herself in a barrel and tried to drown herself and then incredible the barrel goes missing and then the cops start lying and claiming a barrel was never there?

Eh I'm gonna go mad old for this one but in the Doreen Piccard/ Susan Laferte case from 1979 the killer's brother was involved in the police investigation and tried to cover up the murder. One of the women died but the other survived and the killer his name was either Raymond or Gordon Tempest(I forgot. One was the cop) was never charged for the assault on Susan Laferte because the statute of limitations expired

Eh I'm gonna go mad old for this one but in the Doreen Piccard/ Susan Laferte case from 1979 the killer's brother was involved in the police investigation and tried to cover up the murder. One of the women died but the other survived and the killer his name was either Raymond or Gordon Tempest(I forgot. One was the cop) was never charged for the assault on Susan Laferte because the statute of limitations expired

There's actually quite a bit of evidence that points to Beaver Tempest being innocent.

http://www.caught.net/cases/beaver1.htm

The case was blundered from the beginning, but I'm of the belief that Beaver Tempest didn't do it.

I am going to say the Jon Bonet Ramsey case was a cop screw up, when you look for a missing kid you look in ALL roomes locked or not although it might not have made a difference but any DNA and other evidence could have been saved.

Stanley Gryziec - The Bar owner from Rome, 120 miles north of New York.

Shot and killed after a burglary on his home in 1979.

The autopsy said he was killed by a single stab wound to the heart, yet his wife clearly seen a pearl handled small calibre weapon - his brother also found a used shell casing from such a weapon on the carpet/rug which he handed to the police department and they told him "don't mention this to anything".

Don't know if it's as much a screw-up as a cover-up, it's hard to tell.


Tommy Burkett for sure. The note that said "I want to be cremated" made no sense and the 911 call disappearing didn't either. The guy interviewed seemed more like a spokesman and was only telling what he was told to say.

Again, seemed to be more cover-up than screw-up. Why they ever allowed that guy airtime I don't know, he was an obvious tw*t strategically positioned to spew police propaganda crap about the case.

The Bobby Fuller case as the police didn't tape off the area nor did they take finger prints and some eyewitnesses saw a cop toss the gas can into the trash.

Yes the Jack Davis Jr case, that is a classic blunder. In this case it was a combination of an autopsy that was a hatchet job at best. I mean the coroner that did this autopsy originally in 1987 claimed that Jack Davis Jr's cause of death was that he in essence choked to death on his own vomit. However the problem with that ruling was there was no evidence of vomit or food particles in Jack's lungs, none. That means he did not die from that, yet the coroner seemed to be picking causes of death out of a hat in this case.

Plus the coroner never examined the head even though according to the authorities Jack allegedly fell down a flight of stairs yet they do not check out the head? Personally, I think the Coroner's officev just figured that the Davis's would forget about this whole thing, their son was dead, that they would just be quiet and move on and not question anything. I mean the autopsy was a joke and it really makes you wonder if the coroner in the first autopsy even really looked at Jack's body.

Dr. Wecht did a wonderful autopsy and with some good old fashioned detective work was able to find the cause of death. I liked how Wecht helped the Davis's out and held the authorities feet to the fire. But of course the police wrote it off and continue to write it off as just being a drunk college kid that fell down the stairs. The cops do that a lot in cases like this where they really do not do any investigation and just write it off as a drunk college kid falling down the stairs as they do not care what happens to these kids. Sad but true.
I agree, once they were proven wrong by dr. wecht the detective in turn insults the real evidence. And as you say then insults the family referring to Jack and others as drunks. What an unprofessional thing to do especially after you get taken to the cleaners. Dude should of stayed home for that segment. I'm glad I found your post. I always cringe when I see the detective say that.

I keep coming back to the Jeremy Bright case. If a kid goes missing, you look for him. You do not sit around twiddling your thumbs for two weeks. This is basic Police Work 101. Even if you had fairly solid evidence pointing to him running off and joining the carnival, you still ask around and try to find him. I hope Jeremy’s mom and sister got every penny they could out of those SOBs.

I keep coming back to the Jeremy Bright case. If a kid goes missing, you look for him. You do not sit around twiddling your thumbs for two weeks. This is basic Police Work 101. Even if you had fairly solid evidence pointing to him running off and joining the carnival, you still ask around and try to find him. I hope Jeremy’s mom and sister got every penny they could out of those SOBs.

That's a perfect example. I think it's a combination of bad luck (Myrtle Point being a blink and you'll miss it town with a very small police force) and a time period where the immediate thought from police when a child went missing was to write them off as a runaway.

Still....them thinking he ran away to join the carnival is absurd to the point of embarrassment.