I've been watching seasons 2-4 on DVD and noticed that the fourth season exterior shots of the house of Mary, Rhoda and Phyllis seem to be a different location than the first three seasons. Does anyone know anything about this house? It looks similar to the original, but Mary's apartment is now only on the second floor. I assume this is because when they went to film more on-location Minneapolis shots while making the new season four opening credits, the original house owners were being less than cooperative (as shown in the documentary "Moore on Sunday" found on the season two DVDs). Sorry if this has been brought up before, but I couldn't find anything about it on the boards here.

The people agreed to let them use the house shots in the first place (you can still go visit the house...), but after awhile people started coming non-stop and they put like political signs or something all over the house.
Now, the house is for sale and I want my parents to buy it SOOOOOOOOOO bad lol. It's colder up in MN and we don't like the heat where we live, but I don't think it will happen. My dad says that if he ever gets a job offer in Minneapolis we can move there and buy it!!

When DID Mary move to the new apartment - Season 5??

That was the second episode of the sixth season, "Mary Moves Out."

It was speculated in "Love Is All Around, The Making of the Mary Tyler Moore Show" that director Jay Sandrich pushed for the new digs because he was tired of the old set.

The book also states that it was thought that Mary's new neighbors could become part of the show, generating some plots. But that didn't happen, and the show stayed focused on Mary's job at WJM (which still created plenty of good material).

Also, Mary re-hangs the famous wooden "M" in this episode.

That was the second episode of the sixth season, "Mary Moves Out."

It was speculated in "Love Is All Around, The Making of the Mary Tyler Moore Show" that director Jay Sandrich pushed for the new digs because he was tired of the old set.

The book also states that it was thought that Mary's new neighbors could become part of the show, generating some plots. But that didn't happen, and the show stayed focused on Mary's job at WJM (which still created plenty of good material).

Also, Mary re-hangs the famous wooden "M" in this episode.
Well, they did get a couple plots out of Penny Marshall's character, who was Mary's neighbor in the new place. Her name was Paula, and she and her friend were nurses. But they didn't really ever get anybody as good as Rhoda or Phyllis.

- Kristen

That was the second episode of the sixth season, "Mary Moves Out."

It was speculated in "Love Is All Around, The Making of the Mary Tyler Moore Show" that director Jay Sandrich pushed for the new digs because he was tired of the old set.

The book also states that it was thought that Mary's new neighbors could become part of the show, generating some plots. But that didn't happen, and the show stayed focused on Mary's job at WJM (which still created plenty of good material).

Also, Mary re-hangs the famous wooden "M" in this episode.
Thanks for clarifying!! :D

oh, that's right kristen, i'd forgotten about penny marshall and the neighborly nurses!
perhaps if 20th century fox home entertainment had gotten seasons 5-7 out by now, it would have jogged my memory (i'm not bitter, am i?)

but i don't remember anybody else, and you're right, nobody worked out even remotely close to rhoda or phyllis

heck, if the penny mary neighbor character HAD worked out, do you think we still would have had laverne and shirley, or would the space time continuum have changed too much????

Here are comparison pictures of the two houses I mentioned in my first post:

Original house exterior seen seasons 1-3:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v346/schmoe56789/vlcsnap-97492.png
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v346/schmoe56789/vlcsnap-97257.png

Original house with Impeach Nixon banners in 1973:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v346/schmoe56789/vlcsnap-100859.png

New house exterior seen season 4 (I only have up to season 4 on DVD, so I don't know if it was still used after that. I hope the last three seasons come soon!):

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v346/schmoe56789/vlcsnap-92105.png
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v346/schmoe56789/vlcsnap-93253.png

that looks like an entirely different house!
when does this "second house" appear during season 4?
in the opening? in a particular episode?

our very own edition of Hocus-Focus, The Mary Tyler Moore Show style!

It appeared throughout the fourth season in multiple episodes (I got these two shots from disc 2 of the DVDs I think), but never in the opening credits. Besides these two shots above, there were also close-ups of Mary's window, Rhoda's tower and one time where the camera panned from Mary's window to Rhoda's. I never saw any shots used of the original house in season 4.

After looking at the second house for a long time, it's almost starting to look like the Munsters' house!

it's definitely not the same house from seasons 1-3
they probably just got fed up with the static they were receiving from the house's owners and found a house that looked almost the same

i've actually been to the house in minneapolis, but i didn't notice the season 4 switch!

Here are comparison pictures of the two houses I mentioned in my first post:

Original house exterior seen seasons 1-3:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v346/schmoe56789/vlcsnap-97492.png
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v346/schmoe56789/vlcsnap-97257.png

Original house with Impeach Nixon banners in 1973:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v346/schmoe56789/vlcsnap-100859.png

New house exterior seen season 4 (I only have up to season 4 on DVD, so I don't know if it was still used after that. I hope the last three seasons come soon!):

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v346/schmoe56789/vlcsnap-92105.png
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v346/schmoe56789/vlcsnap-93253.png
Great pics!! I just love the old Victorian look. :cool: :D

OK, in the first pics (Seasons 1-4), where did Rhoda live? She allegedly lived upstairs from Mary in the 'attic apartment', but there seems to be no upstairs from Mary - she's on the third floor. And where did Phyllis live - on the first floor or second floor?

In the second pic (Seasons 5+) it makes sense that Mary's apt is on the second floor, and Rhoda lived upstairs.

OK, in the first pics (Seasons 1-4), where did Rhoda live? She allegedly lived upstairs from Mary in the 'attic apartment', but there seems to be no upstairs from Mary - she's on the third floor. And where did Phyllis live - on the first floor or second floor?

In the second pic (Seasons 5+) it makes sense that Mary's apt is on the second floor, and Rhoda lived upstairs.
Good catch!! I never even thought about that.

That explains it! I had always been impressed that they managed to build a window for the set of Mary's apartment that closely matched the window from the exterior shot, but then recently while watching season five, noticed the window in the apartment isn't that similar to the one in the exterior shot. So it turns out it was similar to the window in the first house, but not to the one in the second. Specifically, notice how the window in Mary's apartment is divided into three main sections: the central section with the high arched window, and the two sections on each side. And those side sections are divided into what look like three panes. Well in the original house, those side windows also appear to have three panes (compare to the first pic posted by Schmoe56789). But in the second house, the side windows have just a single pane (compare to the bottom pic posted by Schmoe56789).

that looks like an entirely different house!
when does this "second house" appear during season 4?
in the opening? in a particular episode?

our very own edition of Hocus-Focus, The Mary Tyler Moore Show style!


My explanation- Remember the fire that they had in the episode, "Where there's smoke, there's Rhoda"? We never saw the damage but there was considerable enough to make for building renovations. Maybe they had the exterior changed for that reason. I don;t know, that's must my opinion on the matter.

My explanation- Remember the fire that they had in the episode, "Where there's smoke, there's Rhoda"? We never saw the damage but there was considerable enough to make for building renovations. Maybe they had the exterior changed for that reason. I don;t know, that's must my opinion on the matter.
I think that's a great explanation - and it totally makes sense! :nod:

My explanation- Remember the fire that they had in the episode, "Where there's smoke, there's Rhoda"? We never saw the damage but there was considerable enough to make for building renovations. Maybe they had the exterior changed for that reason. I don;t know, that's must my opinion on the matter.

Considering the fire in Rhoda's apartment happened during Season 2 and we start seeing photos of the alternate house in Season 4, I'd say that's a bit of a stretch.

Actually there aren't many episodes showing the full view of the alternate house... later episodes during Seasons 4 and 5 usually use a closeup shot of Mary's balcony as the establishing shot.

My explanation- Remember the fire that they had in the episode, "Where there's smoke, there's Rhoda"? We never saw the damage but there was considerable enough to make for building renovations. Maybe they had the exterior changed for that reason. I don;t know, that's must my opinion on the matter.

That must have been one heck of a fire because the house shrunk! And Mary's apartment fell from the third floor to the second floor, but typical of Mary, nothing broke inside her apartment. :lol:

It is amazing to all the reruns of shows we can discuss situations like this. I get a kick of this.

It is amazing to all the reruns of shows we can discuss situations like this. I get a kick of this.

For real! Reruns + DVDs (so we can freeze frame, replay or whatever, as much as we want) + Internet discussion boards = no secrets! It never even occurred to me there were two houses until it was brought up in this thread. This got me thinking about how the house change affected the opening. Look at the seasons 2 and 3 openings:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPdh7aLJVDE&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sc2ttE14mJ8&feature=related

About 15 seconds into the opening, the house is shown. But starting in Season 4, no more house:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=extse_Pl6TM&feature=related

I guess they would have either had to re-shoot the opening with the second house, or if they kept the old opening, risk being inconsistent with the exterior house shots that appeared during the actual show. But people probably would have noticed that! Then again, why couldn't they have just ended the exterior shots altogether in the fourth season? They aren't really necessary, are they? After all, while some sitcoms like TMTMS, All in the Family, The Bob Newhart Show, The Brady Bunch, Happy Days, and Laverne & Shirley used them, many others didn't; e.g., The Dick Van Dyke Show, I Love Lucy, The Andy Griffith Show. Maybe inserting the exterior shots was a '70s thing?