I was aware that Vivian Vance and William Frawley (Ethel & Fred Mertz) did not get along at all on the I Love Lucy set. I heard a tale that when Vivian heard of William Frawley's passing she said something along the line of "where's the champagne?" or "pass the champagne."

Is this true or is it an urban legend of a sort?

I did read somewhere that Vivian and William Frawley did not get along at all. He was something like 20 years older than her and she always wondered why they put her with someone who was that much older. She was not happy with that at all.

No one knows (apparently) whether this is really true or not, but it has been discussed in several threads before, such as:
http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showthread.php?t=60173&highlight=vance

i heard that viv and her new husband were at a diner eating and when she heard she yelled, "Thank God, Champaigne for Everyone"

I am sure it is a rumor. I haven't never heard anything concrete as far as that actual statement.

The aforementioned thread goes into a lot more detail about this matter, but I recently saw a show about Lucy on PBS, where the narrator basically just said, that both Vivian and William thought that he/she should have been paired with someone younger and more glamourous.

The aforementioned thread goes into a lot more detail about this matter, but I recently saw a show about Lucy on PBS, where the narrator basically just said, that both Vivian and William thought that he/she should have been paired with someone younger and more glamourous.
:rofl:

Don't forget Desi Arnaz offered to spin the Mertzes off into their own series after the Ricardos moved to Connecticut, but Vivian Vance refused. She would not work in a series with just William Frawley. Had the show been produced and been a hit, it would have made both Vance and Frawley very wealthy, but since Viv refused to do it Bill resented that and would never speak to her again unless working in a scene with her.

The fact they hated each other off camera just goes to show what wonderful actors they were in front of the camera.

I was aware that Vivian Vance and William Frawley (Ethel & Fred Mertz) did not get along at all on the I Love Lucy set. I heard a tale that when Vivian heard of William Frawley's passing she said something along the line of "where's the champagne?" or "pass the champagne."

Is this true or is it an urban legend of a sort?

I heard that story a few times. I can't recall the exact words, but they were along the same lines. I only hope it wasn't true. I have a hard time thinking that she could be that harsh and hate someone to the degree of celebrating their death. Regardless of their feelings for each other, they worked closely for several years and I just can't believe she held that much resentment and if she did, she was obviously wounded somehow in her own exsistance. Not trying to be a "head doctor" here folks, just observant. I suppose I shouldn't talk though because I did celebrate when Saddam Hussein was hung. We all know Bill Frawley couldn't have been THAT bad.

I also read that when Desi was shooting The Untouchables, Viv asked him how much the mob would ask for to RUB out Bill, i wonder of it's true, LOL!

:lol: Well I hope you're kidding about that one Splain!

I think a spin off of Ethel and Fred would have been pretty boring unless they came up with some pretty good costars.

Not only that but she wanted his dead body ground up and then served on crackers to his family and friends, which i thought was a mite OVER THE TOP, dontcha thin? That's the thing Lodee, these stories get embellished over the decades, and people tell them to impress people and they add to them . . . I just don't see Viv doing that when hearing he passed away.

I don't know, but at the same time I wouldn't be surprised if Vivian did do some celebrating when Bill died. Afterall, several people have said that she use to call him an "old coot" and he would call her a "dried up old $&!@!" Being called that, I could see some celebrating being done!

And there are also many stories that would validate that. Like Bill getting the kids from My Three Sons to make noise when she was doing scenes on The Lucy Show, i can see Bill doing that.

I forgot about that story, with Bill and the kid throwing empty film cans! Mean or not, when I first read about that it did make me laugh!!!

Same here, i can see this old man getting a big laugh at her expense like that and then blaming it on the kids, so bonus points for that, LOL! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Same here, i can see this old man getting a big laugh at her expense like that and then blaming it on the kids, so bonus points for that, LOL! :lol: :lol: :lol:

LOL! Their rocky "relationship" always reminded me of being in school and my daddy always telling me that when little boys picked on me more than the other little girls it was because they liked me alot and teasing me was the way they showed it. I sometimes wonder if the same wasn't true for them!:lol:

Don't forget Desi Arnaz offered to spin the Mertzes off into their own series after the Ricardos moved to Connecticut, but Vivian Vance refused. She would not work in a series with just William Frawley. Had the show been produced and been a hit, it would have made both Vance and Frawley very wealthy, but since Viv refused to do it Bill resented that and would never speak to her again unless working in a scene with her.

The fact they hated each other off camera just goes to show what wonderful actors they were in front of the camera.
I never heard that.

Well, maybe you should get out more, because it's all true, it's been written about in many books.:lol:

It could be true, but I never believed it. Sounds like a publicity stunt to me. Does anyone know if Vivian ever commented on it?

I heard that story a few times. I can't recall the exact words, but they were along the same lines. I only hope it wasn't true. I have a hard time thinking that she could be that harsh and hate someone to the degree of celebrating their death. Regardless of their feelings for each other, they worked closely for several years and I just can't believe she held that much resentment and if she did, she was obviously wounded somehow in her own exsistance. Not trying to be a "head doctor" here folks, just observant. I suppose I shouldn't talk though because I did celebrate when Saddam Hussein was hung. We all know Bill Frawley couldn't have been THAT bad.
It has been stated in books (one of them being one that I have) that Vivian was in therapy once a week during the run of the series (ILL) and part of it was because of having to work with William. Viv was not happy being paired up with him and she wondered who would really believe that her character would marry such an old, grumpy man? He was known to call Viv a "bitch" and she called him names as well. Frawley was known to say things abt a few people on the set, including Desi, but all Desi asked of him was to do his job of playing Fred Mertz and do it well.

Viv and Bill played their parts very well because seeing them on screen, you'd never know they hated each other. But back to the topic, I never read or heard anything that Viv said anything like that abt Bill. It was known she didn't care for the man, whether she said anything out loud like that is something else.

from what I heard Vivin and Vance did not get along the same with Lucy and Ethel as well

Vivin and Vance? Is this Twilight Zone or I Love lucy we're talking about? LOL!

I know what you Mean

I know what you Mean Well, then, please SPLAIN your comment?:confused:

I mean it Felt like The Twilight Zone

I know but what did you mean to say in your original post, Vivin and Vance and Lucy and Ethel?

well I heard from my mom that Lucy and Erthel used to fight on Set

But they fought like sisters, you know all angry one minute and then all lovey dovey the next. Lucy admired Viv's strength as a show doctor, she could deliver the lines in one way or another and could even doctor it to sound funnier which Lucy loved. It was a high pressure business delivering a new show in only four days so tempers sometimes flared but the basic love for one another never diminished. As a matter of fact, Lucy told Carson one time that they had so much fun on the set that they would refuse going to parties later at night because they could not top the fun they had already enjoyed there.

my mom did not tell me that Lucy and Elther fought like Sisters she left that part out

my mom did not tell me that Lucy and Elther fought like Sisters she left that part out

My mom is like that too scoobie ;) Alway's leaving parts out :lol: :)

Yeah, they were the Zsa Zsa and Eva of television, LOL!

Yeah, without the Opera Gloves :lol:

Or if they ever wear the exact same opera gloves, they'll need boxing gloves too, LOL!

They both played their parts well. It was unfortune that they were years apart and felt odd about it. You alway wonder how Bea Beneret and Gale Gordon might have worked out for they were thought of as playing the Mertz'. Both were under contract for other shows and couldn't play the parts.

Well, apparently, Viv was used to playing OTHER WOMAN roles and the femme fatale, so she could not stand the thought of people thinking she was actually married to that old coot, her words, not mine.

They both played their parts well. It was unfortune that they were years apart and felt odd about it. You alway wonder how Bea Beneret and Gale Gordon might have worked out for they were thought of as playing the Mertz'. Both were under contract for other shows and couldn't play the parts.
I think Bea would have seemed too old to play Lucy's best friend.

Yeah, but Lucy might have liked that, LOL! I think Bea was one of those who could play young or old, it would depend on how they fixed her up. Gale definitely would have looked much younger though.

Well, apparently, Viv was used to playing OTHER WOMAN roles and the femme fatale, so she could not stand the thought of people thinking she was actually married to that old coot, her words, not mine.

To be fair, if she would have never complained about William being old there wouldn't have been resentment on his part. I'd be upset too if I heard someone make that comment about me. It was a T.V. role not real life so I think she was responsible for the friction on the set.

Yeah, but to be fair, Bill was no prize either. He thought he was the only one of the four who could sing and you read that thing where he only studied his own dialogue and only tore out HIS part of the script so he never knew what the show was about or what was funny whereas Viv was a pro who even helped DOCTOR the show sometimes. As Lucy stated, he was more interested in going to ball games than working on the show, the work was secondary to him, so Viv cared more than he did, that had to be a factor in their work relationship. I was thinking just the other day as i watched a show where Viv is totally off key to try and sing with him and it hurts the ears, was it because she HAD to sing it in his key and couldn't? But it just shows how people working TOGETHER on a set is very important at times. But i LOVED both and i can't see anybody else doing as good a job as either.

...Bea Benaderet and Gale Gordon originally played the couple who were the forerunners of "Fred" and "Ethel Mertz" on Lucy's radio show, "MY FAVORITE HUSBAND" (1948-'51) . As "Rudolph" and "Iris Atterbury", they were quite good at being counterparts to Lucy's "Liz Cooper" and Richard Denning's "George". That's why Lucy originally wanted them on the TV show- but Bea was already co-starring on "THE GEORGE BURNS AND GRACIE ALLEN SHOW" every other Thursday night, and Gale was tied up in working with Eve Arden on "OUR MISS BROOKS" and several other radio shows. But both of them were young- they specialized in playing "older people" on radio; Bea could play "matrons" and "old ladies" and appear as such on TV with special make-up, which she did- not only in that January 1952 "I LOVE LUCY" episode, but in an unaired 1949 attempt to bring Dennis Day's radio show to TV, she appeared as Dennis' nemesis and landlady, "Mrs. Anderson" (as she did on radio), and her "matronly" appearance was quite convincing. And Gale Gordon's hair was greyed up a bit so he could play "Osgood Conklin" on the TV version of "OUR MISS BROOKS". Yes, they COULD have appeared as the "Mertzes" if they weren't involved with their other series.......

:tv:

just a side note-Bea Benederett also first auditioned for the role of Granny on "THE BEVERLY HILLBILLIES". In fact, when she didn't get it, she recomended Irene Ryan for the role.

Off topic, but I'm curious. Do they ever make references to the age difference between Fred and Ethel, on the show? I've never heard it mentioned, even as a joke.

Off topic, but I'm curious. Do they ever make references to the age difference between Fred and Ethel, on the show? I've never heard it mentioned, even as a joke.
Maybe they did, i don't recall, but they should have just to please Viv, LOL!

I don't remember them making a reference to it either.

There was an ep where Lucy called Fred an "old goat", and Viv got mad. Lucy wondered why, since viv called him that all the time. Viv said something like, "well he's an old goat, but he's my old goat."

There ya go, sort of like me on the boards, i can criticize some things Lucy did but can't stand it when others do and i defend her, LOL!:lol:

Same thing as in the ep where Mrs. Trumbull is introduced... Ethel keeps telling how she protected Lucy from Mrs. T's threats, Fred mentions that Ethel can become "sickening," Ricky uses that same word, and Fred gets mad.

Moral: Don't talk about somebody else's spouse/children/relatives in the same uncomplimentary way you have heard the first person talk. Could be dangerous.

There ya go, sort of like me on the boards, i can criticize some things Lucy did but can't stand it when others do and i defend her, LOL!:lol:
That's true, of you and a few others. :lol: You have to work on that.

Moral: Don't talk about somebody else's spouse/children/relatives in the same uncomplimentary way you have heard the first person talk. Could be dangerous.
It's true. I can complain about my husband all day long (I don't), but let someone else say one thing, and it goes over like a lead ballon, lol.

That's true, of you and a few others. :lol: You have to work on that.
Not at all, it means that we are her BIGGEST fans and protect her and put her on a pedestal like all fans do of their idols however we also state FACTS and admit her failings as all human beings have but sometimes people go too far, believing gossip or lies that have been repeated over and over by disgruntled employees or men who could not stand a woman in power or even people who want to sell books or make a story funnier or more interesting, LOL!

I don't think Vivian celebrated when he died, but I can see why she would, I can't say I wouldn't celebrate if I were in her shoes. An about the thing about not being able to talk about someone else's loved ones, I'm really big on that, I trash my sister all the time, but the second I hear someone else say something, I have to put them in their place. In fact, I just recently got kicked out of school for beating up a little kid who was making fun of my sister.