Anyone?

I read some time ago (I forget where) that it was a mutual decision. Diane Ladd wanted to go back to film work, and supposedly she didn't get along with LL either.

Yes, I've heard many a time that Diane and Linda did not hit it off and Diane was very unhappy, so she asked to be let out of her contract.

Again!? Wow, the common denominator here is Linda. I guess we don't know Linda then. I find it hard to swallow that Linda had such feelings. I liked the Belle character, but if I had to go with Belle or Jolene, than give me Jolene. But up until Jolene came along, I was happy with Belle.

Linda should not have been allowed to have such pull like that.

Again!? Wow, the common denominator here is Linda. I guess we don't know Linda then. I find it hard to swallow that Linda had such feelings. I liked the Belle character, but if I had to go with Belle or Jolene, than give me Jolene. But up until Jolene came along, I was happy with Belle.

Linda should not have been allowed to have such pull like that.
They did give her pull and she, from what I understand, gave the producers an ultimatum regarding Polly Holliday.

Watching the Belle episodes you don't see much interaction between her and Alice. They are distant from each other in scenes.

Too bad she did not learn from Mary Tyler Moore, Bob Newhart, Dick Van Dyke, and Hal Linden. Their respective series were ensemble shows even though they were the "star" of their show. They allowed each cast member to shine in their own forthright. That's what made those shows what they were.

They did give her pull and she, from what I understand, gave the producers an ultimatum regarding Polly Holliday.

Watching the Belle episodes you don't see much interaction between her and Alice. They are distant from each other in scenes.

Too bad she did not learn from Mary Tyler Moore, Bob Newhart, Dick Van Dyke, and Hal Linden. Their respective series were ensemble shows even though they were the "star" of their show. They allowed each cast member to shine in their own forthright. That's what made those shows what they were.
:clap You put it perfectly!!! You think she would've learned from Hal Linden, as they worked together on Barney Miller.

Wow. Reading this makes me wonder if Linda had any resentment towards the actress that played Jolene.

Wow. Reading this makes me wonder if Linda had any resentment towards the actress that played Jolene.
I don't think so - Celia Weston was basically an unknown and therefore wouldn't pose a "threat" like the fan favorites (Polly Holliday) and the film actresses (Diane Ladd). That said, I think I did read somewhere that Linda and Celia got along fairly well.

Possibly because both Celia and Linda have theatrical backgrounds--Celia has gone on to a successful stage career and was nominated for a Tony a few years back.

Interesting posts people. Thank you. :wave:

Some stars get too much power. They are able to trade on their popularity to lord it over their co-stars, producers and writers. Recently, Executive Producer/Creator Donald Bellisario left J.A.G. because of tensions between him and series star Mark Harmon. Bellisario's name is still in the credits, as his company still produces the show, but he is no longer involved with the production.

I'm sure because Alice was a hit, Linda Lavin's ego grew a bit oversized and probably didn't like anyone who challenged or threatened her. It's too bad, because Flo was a great character and Belle wasn't a bad replacement. Jolene, however, was pretty good and passed muster with Lavin obviously, because she remained for the last four years of the series.

I don't think Jolene was a good fit for a replacement for Flo, she was just missing something that I couldn't put my finger on

In defense of Belle and Diane Ladd, she stepped into a situation where somebody had been excellent, so the pressure was on her. People wanted Flo, but she could only be Belle. But I think if she would have stuck around a little longer, viewers would have accepted her.

In defense of Belle and Diane Ladd, she stepped into a situation where somebody had been excellent, so the pressure was on her. People wanted Flo, but she could only be Belle. But I think if she would have stuck around a little longer, viewers would have accepted her.
As been stated many times here, Diane was the original Flo (in the movie) but for people like me who never saw the movie until after watching ALICE on television, it didn't matter to me. I loved Flo (Polly). Polly made the character her own. It would have been better to have Diane come in as Flo from the beginning of the series.

Why wasn't Diane on the show from the beginning anyways? They had the original Vera, why not the original Flo?

I don't think Jolene was a good fit for a replacement for Flo, she was just missing something that I couldn't put my finger on


I think it was because she was too bland...very vanilla.

As been stated many times here, Diane was the original Flo (in the movie) but for people like me who never saw the movie until after watching ALICE on television, it didn't matter to me. I loved Flo (Polly). Polly made the character her own. It would have been better to have Diane come in as Flo from the beginning of the series.

Why wasn't Diane on the show from the beginning anyways? They had the original Vera, why not the original Flo?

Beth Howland wasn't in the movie. An actress named Valerie Curtin played Vera.

I think it was because she was too bland...very vanilla.
:lol:

Beth Howland wasn't in the movie. An actress named Valerie Curtin played Vera.
Oh sh*t, what was I thinking...or smoking??? :crazy: Sorry. I got carried away there.

Beth Howland wasn't in the movie. An actress named Valerie Curtin played Vera.
Valerie Curtin also shows up in the second season of Barney Miller, in an episode entitled "Fear of Flying". She plays one of Jack Riley's two wives. Yes, the same Jack Riley who played Mr. Carlin on the Bob Newhart Show. :lol:

Here's an early pic of Valerie Curtin, who ironically enough starred in another sitcom based on a movie - 9 to 5.

Here's an early pic of Valerie Curtin, who ironically enough starred in another sitcom based on a movie - 9 to 5.
Oh my, I had forgotten abt that sitcom.

She was also in one of the unaired Three's Company pilots, which is on one of the DVD sets (2nd season maybe? I don't have mine handy, and I know it wasn't on the 1st season set)

Linda and Diana did not get along How did Linda and Celia Weston get along

Although Flo was my favorite, I loved Belle. I wish she had stayed longer... I'm not crazy about Jolene but I don't hate her.

And I'm guessing that Beth (Vera) got along well with Linda since she was there the whole time?

Again!? Wow, the common denominator here is Linda. I guess we don't know Linda then. I find it hard to swallow that Linda had such feelings. I liked the Belle character, but if I had to go with Belle or Jolene, than give me Jolene. But up until Jolene came along, I was happy with Belle.

Linda should not have been allowed to have such pull like that.
I herd Linda was hard to get along with. Boy, she couldn't get along with anybody.

I herd Linda was hard to get along with. Boy, she couldn't get along with anybody.


That's basically the reason.

I heard Linda got along well with Celia Weston *Jolene* b/c she just basically silently filled the 3rd space, she had the Southern comedy thing down like her 2 predecesors but she didn't dominate the whole show like Flo and Belle did.

I herd Linda was hard to get along with. Boy, she couldn't get along with anybody.
Linda Lavin never really seemed like the star of the show to me. I always thought of Mel (Vic Tayback) as the star of Alice. I wonder if Linda even got along with Vic.

Linda Lavin never really seemed like the star of the show to me. I always thought of Mel (Vic Tayback) as the star of Alice. I wonder if Linda even got along with Vic.

From what I remember, I think everyone got along with Vic. It was said that he was a real nice guy.

Oh sh*t, what was I thinking...or smoking??? :crazy: Sorry. I got carried away there.

You were probably thinking that they had the original Mel (Vic Tayback), so why not the original Flo?

I prefer Belle over Jolene also. I wish Belle could have lasted longer than one season. It also would have been nice if Flo returned since Belle had left, and the spin-off, Flo got cancelled. That all said, Jolene was OK, I just found her to be my least favorite of the three.

I think the reason I like Belle the least of the 3 is because she was so much like Flo. I hadn't seen the movie until years after the tv show ended so to me Polly was the original Flo.

I prefer Belle over Jolene also. I wish Belle could have lasted longer than one season. It also would have been nice if Flo returned since Belle had left, and the spin-off, Flo got cancelled. That all said, Jolene was OK, I just found her to be my least favorite of the three.

I always prefered Jolene over Belle, basically b/c she did her own thing, when I watched the Belle episodes it was like watching Belle do Flo impressions a lot. Like when a costumer asked Belle, "Whats the best thing in the house?" And she replies, "Honey youre looking at it!" I was like.. "REALLY!?? You are kidding me with that line!" That line had Flo written all over it.

At least Jolene made the role her own and was something different. I think Linda got along with Celia b/c she basically sorta silently filled the 3rd postion without stealing the whole show.

I think the reason I like Belle the least of the 3 is because she was so much like Flo. I hadn't seen the movie until years after the tv show ended so to me Polly was the original Flo.


My point exactly!!

It felt like many times she was doing "Flo impressions" lol I was just waiting for her to say Kiss my Grits!! LOL

But its' funny when I was younger watching the show I remember Belle as being the LAST waitress. I thought Jolene came directly after Flo, then Belle came after Jolene, I dunno why lol

I liked the Belle character and thought she was just as sassy as Flo.

Linda Lavin could have taken a lesson from people like Mary Tyler Moore & Andy Griffith. Surround yourself with funny character actors, a strong supporting cast and that helps the show succeed and it makes you, the star, a very wealthy person. Ego aside, just be glad you have a hit show and know you never have to work again after it.

Linda Lavin could have taken a lesson from people like Mary Tyler Moore & Andy Griffith. Surround yourself with funny character actors, a strong supporting cast and that helps the show succeed and it makes you, the star, a very wealthy person. Ego aside, just be glad you have a hit show and know you never have to work again after it.
Andy Griffith might not be a good example. He didn't get along with Frances Bavier (Aunt Bee), but that's a whole 'nuther story.

Andy Griffith might not be a good example. He didn't get along with Frances Bavier (Aunt Bee), but that's a whole 'nuther story.


I heard that Frances Bavier was really hard to get along with though.

I heard she was really REALLY high society and sorta looked down her nose at Andy. I heard she felt he was low class.

I dunno how true it was, but just what i heard.

I prefer Belle over Jolene also. I wish Belle could have lasted longer than one season. It also would have been nice if Flo returned since Belle had left, and the spin-off, Flo got cancelled. That all said, Jolene was OK, I just found her to be my least favorite of the three.

I thought Belle was fine. She wasn't as fun as Flo, but decent enough. But I never could stand Jolene AT ALL. From the time she joined the show, I found it unwatchable. I also thought Vera was very annoying.

By the time Jolene was brought on, the show was hanging on only due to its time slot (it was surrounded by several hit shows). I remember at one point early during the Jolene era, CBS moved the show to another night and it suddenly dropped to the very bottom of the ratings and was nearly cancelled. They had to bring it back to it's old time slot to save it. It probably would have helped the show succeed better in syndication had it been cancelled at that point, but unfortunately it wasn't and, consequently, there are as many Jolene episodes as Flo episodes.

I think Diane Ladd was a mistake. She was always over acting and simply did not fit in with the other characters. I think to the other actors and the shows producers this was obvious and therfore she was pushed out.

I think it makes for great discussion!http://smith.blogdet.com/1.jpg
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I think Diane Ladd was a mistake. She was always over acting and simply did not fit in with the other characters. I think to the other actors and the shows producers this was obvious and therfore she was pushed out.
Diane wasn't "pushed out"--her contract was for one year only and when the year was up she chose to leave due to the ALICE set being a rather unhappy environment according to her.

According to other people on the set she was notoriously late and was extremely unprofessional...which has been said about her many times before from many different people.

According to other people on the set she was notoriously late and was extremely unprofessional...which has been said about her many times before from many different people.
She's used to the movie industry. She'd never worked in television before. Probably was quite an adjustment.

I think it makes for great discussion!http://smith.blogdet.com/1.jpg
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I herd Linda was a hard person to work with.

Some of Diane's movie directors have said in the past she was extremely often difficult on the sets. I don't think Linda deserves to be portrayed as an evil woman who chased off actresses...this has always been supposition from fans and rumor mills.

Some of Diane's movie directors have said in the past she was extremely often difficult on the sets. I don't think Linda deserves to be portrayed as an evil woman who chased off actresses...this has always been supposition from fans and rumor mills.

Well, I can tell you of three cast members of "Alice" and several members of the crew who said Lavin was the issue. She was very insecure and very egotistical.

Oh plz anyone can claim they knew someone on the set...Google it...there is no documented evidence...I'm not here to argue...it's your choice to believe whatever u want

I know there are those on this site who think they know it all. They act as though they have the inside scoop on Hollywood, and they live in Ohio or some place worlds away from Hollywood. I am accustomed to being challenged on here, but believe me....I know :)

I know there are those on this site who think they know it all. They act as though they have the inside scoop on Hollywood, and they live in Ohio or some place worlds away from Hollywood. I am accustomed to being challenged on here, but believe me....I know :)
I believe you; if you watch those TV Legends interviews with esteemed directors and writers such as William Asher and Madelyn Pugh, you will notice they evade the issue and state Linda was "very talented" but would not say much else about her.

when I watched the Belle episodes it was like watching Belle do Flo impressions a lot. Like when a costumer asked Belle, "Whats the best thing in the house?" And she replies, "Honey youre looking at it!" I was like.. "REALLY!?? You are kidding me with that line!" That line had Flo written all over it.

At least Jolene made the role her own and was something different.

In all fairness, Diane Ladd was only speaking the lines the writers gave her to speak. If she didn't do that, she wouldn't have been doing her job. And the fact that the writers developed her character that way by giving her those lines may be part of the reason Linda Lavin didn't get along with her: she didn't want another Flo-type character getting funny lines and taking the spotlight away from her again. So they bounced Diane and brought in Celia Weston to play a totally bland character, which would have been no threat to LL. I wonder if all these years later, LL is changed? She's now appearing in Sean Hayes' new show. She clearly isn't the star of that show. I guess that is okay with her?

Beth Howland wasn't in the movie. An actress named Valerie Curtin played Vera.

Valerie Curtin is Jane Curtin's cousin.

I wonder if Linda would be up for an Alice reunion. Though Vic Is gone, I wonder if Linda, Polly, Beth, Diane, Celia, and Phillip would be open to getting together, so Linda & Polly, and Linda & Diane, can bury the hatchet!

I think that it would be a great idea. With the exception of Vic Tayback, the other cast members are still alive and it would be intersting to hear memories of the long-running sitcom as well as what they are up to today.

I wonder if Linda would be up for an Alice reunion.

I doubt it since she's just now starting a new show.

Belle's first episode hyped up her character like she was the main draw. I would understand if Linda Lavin felt this was a bad move, considering Alice was the main character. And they had Belle wanting to be involved in the music business, just like Alice. Perhaps that was done to foster a bond between the characters. But who could blame Linda for feeling that her character was being put in the background.

It's fairly standard to build up a new main-supporting character when they join a show, especially a hit show. Diane Ladd was not a super-star, but she was an award winning actress, having won a BAFTA and a GOLDEN GLOBE for the role of FLO in ALICE DOESN'T LIVE HERE ANYMORE.

Linda, by all accounts, could be VERY difficult. Indeed, Polly was forced into her own spin-off. Diane Ladd, whatever her own faults, was not going to put up with any crap. Also, to be fair, Diane did NOT immitate FLO. She was however, dropped into several scrips that were written with Flo in mind. I also do not feel that she aped her own performance from the feature film, anymore than Polly did. Belle was deep fried southern, brassy and bold. The similarities end there. It also should be remembered that she won a Golden Globe as Best Supporting Actress for ALICE.


I love Linda's work, but as great of an actress as she is, you can see through it in many episodes of the fourth season, especially: she HATED that Polly received as much attention as she did. After things went sour between her and Ladd, it's obvious. No love lost there. Beth Howland was playing a character, every bit as much as Holliday and Ladd did. She was NOTHING like Vera in real life. But her character was still more of a woman child, well loved, and no threat to Lavin's ego.

Diane quit. Period.

I liked Jolene just fine, but the show went on for two years longer than it should have, in my opinion.

I agree. Diane Ladd did break it down in an interview about the lie which pertained to Polly leaving the show. Diane did state that it was the tension that caused Polly to leave the show. I wish Linda had not been so difficult as much as I love her. Now, I do remember an "E" interview Diane did back in 1995. She stated that she hugged Polly and told her "goodbye". Polly responded with indication "Good luck". Diane then thought in her mind "Oh my God. What now?!!" She knew that something was up.

Andy Griffith might not be a good example. He didn't get along with Frances Bavier (Aunt Bee), but that's a whole 'nuther story.
I herd a lot of people found Andy Griffith hard to get along with.

I herd a lot of people found Andy Griffith hard to get along with.


That's what I have heard from a source as well about Andy.

I'm enjoying Diane Ladd as Belle more than I did way back when. She's great at little gestures that make the character interesting, and she fits in well with the other actors.

And her character and Alice have a lot in common. That could've been a wonderful relationship. Very warm, a little wistful, like first season Flo and Alice. But the writers went with broad comedy, which is fun, but the potential of Belle was not realized.

In all fairness, Diane Ladd was only speaking the lines the writers gave her to speak. If she didn't do that, she wouldn't have been doing her job. And the fact that the writers developed her character that way by giving her those lines may be part of the reason Linda Lavin didn't get along with her: she didn't want another Flo-type character getting funny lines and taking the spotlight away from her again. So they bounced Diane and brought in Celia Weston to play a totally bland character, which would have been no threat to LL. I wonder if all these years later, LL is changed? She's now appearing in Sean Hayes' new show. She clearly isn't the star of that show. I guess that is okay with her?


.


Doesn't sound like it
http://www.gossipcop.com/sean-hayes-linda-lavin-feud-feuding-fight-saves-the-world-show/

Doesn't matter cause the show (Sean Saves the World) was not funny IMO and has been cancelled.