Lucille Ball was a gorgeous woman, as we can see by Rick's generous photo contributions, and she was a slapstick clown who would stop at nothing to make people laugh. She was a convincing dramatic actress way before most of us were born.

One other thing people don't usually mention is what a great dancer she was. I really enjoyed her talented dance routines with Van Johnson and King Cat Walsh, as well as her many routines as a "wannabe" that loused things up! :)

One other thing people don't usually mention is what a great dancer she was. I really enjoyed her talented dance routines with Van Johnson and King Cat Walsh, as well as her many routines as a "wannabe" that loused things up! :)

I love watching her dance with Van Johnson. She was so graceful. As for the "blind" dancing with King Cat Walsh, to be able to do that sort of comical dancing, I think you first have to know how to do it right before adding the comic touches.

As for the "blind" dancing with King Cat Walsh, to be able to do that sort of comical dancing, I think you first have to know how to do it right before adding the comic touches.

Exactly.

We do get an idea of her jitterbug talent during the rehearsal before her eye exam.

Exactly.

We do get an idea of her jitterbug talent during the rehearsal before her eye exam.

Oh yes, that's true. I think it's hilarious watching her during that initial jitterbug as she's being slung around. :lol:

One of my favorite comical dances is in "Ricky's Life Story." Ricky wants to discourage Lucy from show biz, so he stages a challenge dance where he makes a few moves and then Lucy has to dance her brains out! She finally collapses. :lol:

One of my favorite comical dances is in "Ricky's Life Story." Ricky wants to discourage Lucy from show biz, so he stages a challenge dance where he makes a few moves and then Lucy has to dance her brains out! She finally collapses. :lol:

Oh yes! That cracks me up. I think that episode is underrated. It's one of my personal favorites, from beginning to end. :lol: And speaking of comical dances, I also like the scene at the end of "Dubarry Was a Lady" where Lucy, Red Skelton and Gene Kelly are dancing and singing to "Friendship," and Lucy's getting twisted up in the process. You can already see Lucy's keen sense of comic timing and physical comedy abilities on display at that early stage.

Oh yes! That cracks me up. I think that episode is underrated. It's one of my personal favorites, from beginning to end. :lol: And speaking of comical dances, I also like the scene at the end of "Dubarry Was a Lady" where Lucy, Red Skelton and Gene Kelly are dancing and singing to "Friendship," and Lucy's getting twisted up in the process. You can already see Lucy's keen sense of comic timing and physical comedy abilities on display at that early stage.

I haven't seen that movie yet (from 1943). Is the song "Friendship" the same one Lucy and Ethel sing in "Lucy and Ethel Buy the Same Dress?"

I haven't seen that movie yet (from 1943). Is the song "Friendship" the same one Lucy and Ethel sing in "Lucy and Ethel Buy the Same Dress?"

Yes, same song by Cole Porter.

Lucy was a fine dancer and what legs! She also had been a chorus girl, amongst other things, before she hit it big with comedy and TV. And, as long as we're talking about her many talents, let's not forget that she was an astutue businesswoman, who, after I.L.L., ran a big studio and grew it even more (much more1)

Heres a Q...on ILL Lucy was the worlds worst singer, my Q is, was she really a terrible singer, or was that just a part of the "Lucy Ricardo" persona; does anyone know?

i think that was just written into the character. After all she did movies like Mame and the broadway musical WildCat. I just watched a movie a couple days ago with her in it and she is singing and i though wow. the name of the movies escapes me but i will post it later when i remember it.

Thats pretty much what i figured

i think that was just written into the character. After all she did movies like Mame and the broadway musical WildCat. I just watched a movie a couple days ago with her in it and she is singing and i though wow. the name of the movies escapes me but i will post it later when i remember it.

Other than Mame, she usually had her voice dubbed in movies where there was singing involved. The only exception I'm aware of is when she and Desi sang "Singin' Along with the Breeze" in The Long, Long Trailer. Lucille Ball was an adequate singer. In Wildcat, she did just fine for what was required of her. But in the years that followed, the quality of her singing voice did deteriorate and was not good at all by the time of Mame. They tried to minimize her singing in that film as much as they could get away with by having her sing only a few bars, and then having a chorus or other cast members join in and pretty much take over. But for intimate songs, like My Best Boy, they couldn't do that, so she was on her own. And the result was not good. I'm not trying to knock the movie (enough people have already done that) -- I actually enjoy Mame -- but I cringe a bit when she sings solo. The fact is, she did not want to do her own singing in that film. She thought she could have her voice dubbed as had been done in her musicals back in the '40s. But Warner Brothers insisted that movie audiences in the '70s were too sophisticated for dubbing and insisted she had to do her own singing. And it terrified her. She claimed that on the days she had to sing, she would lock herself in her dressing room trying to avoid the whole ordeal. In November 1973, several months before Mame was released, she talked on The Merv Griffin Show about her singing in Mame and acknowledged that she couldn't sing, but somehow felt that the music in Mame lent itself to non-singers. Incidentally, in musical episodes of Here's Lucy, her voice was usually dubbed by Carole Cook.

Other than Mame, she usually had her voice dubbed in movies where there was singing involved. The only exception I'm aware of is when she and Desi sang "Singin' Along with the Breeze" in The Long, Long Trailer. Lucille Ball was an adequate singer. In Wildcat, she did just fine for what was required of her. But in the years that followed, the quality of her singing voice did deteriorate and was not good at all by the time of Mame. They tried to minimize her singing in that film as much as they could get away with by having her sing only a few bars, and then having a chorus or other cast members join in and pretty much take over. But for intimate songs, like My Best Boy, they couldn't do that, so she was on her own. And the result was not good. I'm not trying to knock the movie (enough people have already done that) -- I actually enjoy Mame -- but I cringe a bit when she sings solo. The fact is, she did not want to do her own singing in that film. She thought she could have her voice dubbed as had been done in her musicals back in the '40s. But Warner Brothers insisted that movie audiences in the '70s were too sophisticated for dubbing and insisted she had to do her own singing. And it terrified her. She claimed that on the days she had to sing, she would lock herself in her dressing room trying to avoid the whole ordeal. In November 1973, several months before Mame was released, she talked on The Merv Griffin Show about her singing in Mame and acknowledged that she couldn't sing, but somehow felt that the music in Mame lent itself to non-singers. Incidentally, in musical episodes of Here's Lucy, her voice was usually dubbed by Carole Cook.

Interesting, Rick. Thanks for the info! :wave:

Other than Mame, she usually had her voice dubbed in movies where there was singing involved. The only exception I'm aware of is when she and Desi sang "Singin' Along with the Breeze" in The Long, Long Trailer. Lucille Ball was an adequate singer. In Wildcat, she did just fine for what was required of her. But in the years that followed, the quality of her singing voice did deteriorate and was not good at all by the time of Mame. They tried to minimize her singing in that film as much as they could get away with by having her sing only a few bars, and then having a chorus or other cast members join in and pretty much take over. But for intimate songs, like My Best Boy, they couldn't do that, so she was on her own. And the result was not good. I'm not trying to knock the movie (enough people have already done that) -- I actually enjoy Mame -- but I cringe a bit when she sings solo. The fact is, she did not want to do her own singing in that film. She thought she could have her voice dubbed as had been done in her musicals back in the '40s. But Warner Brothers insisted that movie audiences in the '70s were too sophisticated for dubbing and insisted she had to do her own singing. And it terrified her. She claimed that on the days she had to sing, she would lock herself in her dressing room trying to avoid the whole ordeal. In November 1973, several months before Mame was released, she talked on The Merv Griffin Show about her singing in Mame and acknowledged that she couldn't sing, but somehow felt that the music in Mame lent itself to non-singers. Incidentally, in musical episodes of Here's Lucy, her voice was usually dubbed by Carole Cook.

Oh, I just remembered she was not dubbed when she did "Friendship" in DuBarry Was a Lady. However, she was singing along with Red Skelton and Gene Kelly, and that's sort of a goofy, comical song not intended for beautiful voices. So there was no need to dub her there. If you want to know what her singing voice was actually like during the I Love Lucy years, check this out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17ARYV_wG8c

ok thx for the info Rick....so she really couldnt sing
oh well, she had plenty of other talents!

Interesting, Rick. Thanks for the info! :wave:

No prob. I'm already indebted to you anyway for all those interesting screen shots and astute observations. Speaking of which . . . probably not the right thread for this, but I've been wondering about Bart Andrews' claim that, in the episodes filmed at little General Services Studios, the Mertzes' apartment was actually the Ricardos' bedroom dressed up. If you get a chance, it would be cool to compare the two because I'm curious how they did that. Do the doors even match? I'm not trying to give you homework, just if you have time that would be cool to see. Thanks. :wave:

ok thx for the info Rick....so she really couldnt sing
oh well, she had plenty of other talents!

Well, personally speaking, I can't sing, I can't dance, I can't act, I couldn't do anything with an audience full of people watching me, and I sure as hell couldn't run the biggest studio in Hollywood, or any studio for that matter. Lucille Ball had a lot of diffent talents, and she was smart. So what if she couldn't sing. It obviously didn't matter.

But she could to sing, not as well at the end but how do you land a musical broadway show and all and do all those variety shows where you sing and sing on so many of her own shows and not be a good singer? LOL! I think she could do anything, by her own admission, she had to rehearse a lot, but she did it all. Main thing was realizing certain things, like the fact that she performed better in front of a live audience, watch her on a ny of her shows without an audience and see how the material suffers. For a woman who was told at school that she had no talent, then she got fired from chorus jobs, got saddled with below par movie assignments for decades but finally showed what she had learned after all those years, she let it all out on those 500 plus tv shows and quite a few other appearances over the years that proved that she indeed had learned her craft very well. She has all the awards to prove it was no fluke.

Well, personally speaking, I can't sing, I can't dance, I can't act, I couldn't do anything with an audience full of people watching me, and I sure as hell couldn't run the biggest studio in Hollywood, or any studio for that matter. Lucille Ball had a lot of diffent talents, and she was smart. So what if she couldn't sing. It obviously didn't matter.
Right, thats what i was saying :)

But she could to sing, not as well at the end but how do you land a musical broadway show and all and do all those variety shows where you sing and sing on so many of her own shows and not be a good singer? LOL!

How do you do it? If you're Lucille Ball, you can do whatever you damn well please. She wasn't doing that stuff prior to rocketing to superstardom in I Love Lucy. And she only got away with it afterwards because of who she was. Who was going to stop her? But she still recognized her limitations enough to let most of her singing on The Lucy Show and Here's Lucy be dubbed by Carole Cook. And she wanted her voice dubbed in Mame as well (as had been done in her 1940s movie musicals), but the powers that be at Warner Brothers felt that movie audiences at that time were too sophisticated for them to get away with dubbing her voice. She went on Merv Griffin's show several months before Mame was released and said, in effect, "I can't sing and I can't dance, but I did what they told me to do." She went on to explain that she thought that the style of music in Mame didn't require one to be a good singer. Obviously, many critics have disagreed.

Other than Mame, she usually had her voice dubbed in movies where there was singing involved. The only exception I'm aware of is when she and Desi sang "Singin' Along with the Breeze" in The Long, Long Trailer. Lucille Ball was an adequate singer. In Wildcat, she did just fine for what was required of her. But in the years that followed, the quality of her singing voice did deteriorate and was not good at all by the time of Mame. They tried to minimize her singing in that film as much as they could get away with by having her sing only a few bars, and then having a chorus or other cast members join in and pretty much take over. But for intimate songs, like My Best Boy, they couldn't do that, so she was on her own. And the result was not good. I'm not trying to knock the movie (enough people have already done that) -- I actually enjoy Mame -- but I cringe a bit when she sings solo. The fact is, she did not want to do her own singing in that film. She thought she could have her voice dubbed as had been done in her musicals back in the '40s. But Warner Brothers insisted that movie audiences in the '70s were too sophisticated for dubbing and insisted she had to do her own singing. And it terrified her. She claimed that on the days she had to sing, she would lock herself in her dressing room trying to avoid the whole ordeal. In November 1973, several months before Mame was released, she talked on The Merv Griffin Show about her singing in Mame and acknowledged that she couldn't sing, but somehow felt that the music in Mame lent itself to non-singers. Incidentally, in musical episodes of Here's Lucy, her voice was usually dubbed by Carole Cook.
I also remember that she did a number in The Lucy Show and her own voice was used. She sang, but it was more like talking. She did the number with Mel Torme'. I really liked the episode.

Ok, there was the fact that on I Love lucy, they wanted her singing to be bad for the jokes on the show. Secondly, in the movies, she was considered an actress, not a singer, and it was common to have real singers do the numbers instead of the actresses. Also, people like Rex Harrison and Maurice Chevalier for example, could not sing either, but they had so much charisma in Chevalier's case or talked threw the songs as in Harrison's case that they did musicals any way. So Lucy decided to talk threw the songs in Mame as Harrison had done, at that point her vocal range was very limited due to her three pack a day cigarette habit. But she sang on her own shows and did this very well, either for comic effect like in Queen of the gypsies or Vancing with Dan Johnson, or showing off her real skills doing Wildcat numbers on The Steve Lawrence show or Ed Sullivan, there aws nothing this woman could not do and even later on in her career she cavorted on stage with Shirley MacLaine, Carol Burnett or in Bob Hope tributes and did a beautiful job, look at the clips on YOUTUBE.

So Lucy decided to talk threw the songs in Mame as Harrison had done, at that point her vocal range was very limited due to her three pack a day cigarette habit.

We talked about this in that thread about Lucy's smoking habit that the smoking was not the only factor that ruined her voice. According to NIH, there are several factors that can damage the vocal chords, and she did ALL of them. Besides smoking, she drank scotch which, like cigarettes, dries the natural lubricant in the vocal chords; she used that unnaturally high voice on I Love Lucy causing stress on the vocal chords; she used damaging voice projection on her TV shows, further stressing them; she projected her singing voice improperly in Wildcat, and probably in Mame as well, causing even more stress; and she surely talked incessantly on the set of her shows (It's well established that she pretty much took charge of everything and was even directing the directors. So while she was out there rehearsing her lines in her loud projection voice, she was also yelling directions all over the set).

But she sang on her own shows and did this very well, either for comic effect like in Queen of the gypsies or Vancing with Dan Johnson, or showing off her real skills doing Wildcat numbers on The Steve Lawrence show or Ed Sullivan, there aws nothing this woman could not do and even later on in her career she cavorted on stage with Shirley MacLaine, Carol Burnett or in Bob Hope tributes and did a beautiful job, look at the clips on YOUTUBE.

I think she sounded fine in Wildcat, but after that, not so good. I cringe listening to her sing in some of those songs in Mame, like "My Best Beau" and "It's Today." No, she was not as bad as Lucy Ricardo, but she still had difficulty hitting and holding certain notes, and her range was very limited. She went on the air a few months before Mame on Merv Griffin's show and acknowledged to the world that she couldn't sing. This real mystery is why, knowing that, was she so gung ho about doing a musical.

Yeah, i agree with you on some of that, Lucy claimed she could not sing and dance, but as she told Joan Rivers on The Tonight show, she did do a lot of it over the years because she rehearsed forever to get the numbers right. It wasn't natural in her. Unfortunately, it was her all time favorite type of entertainment, Astaire and Rogers was her idea of PURE ENTERTAINMENT. So she did it constantly, in spite of her limited range. You mention Mame, she even wanted to do Dolly but Merrick had already signed Streisand, so she wanted to do Mame even if she knew she would not do justice to those great musical numbers. The thing is, Musicals were by then PASSE, we would not see them be a hit again until CHICAGO decades later. So, nobody would have gone to see Angela doing that movie, they would however go to see Lucy, it wasn't the hit she hoped it would be but it still played very well on her own medium of television and eventually made it's money back, it was not a turkey as some state. The soft focus filming ruined it for some and others were turned off by her singing those songs. I always loved what Lucy herself said about that in defence, that Mame was boozing and partying all night, how could her voice be like Julie Andrews? LOL! Typical Lucy!

Yeah, i agree with you on some of that, Lucy claimed she could not sing and dance, but as she told Joan Rivers on The Tonight show, she did do a lot of it over the years because she rehearsed forever to get the numbers right. It wasn't natural in her. Unfortunately, it was her all time favorite type of entertainment, Astaire and Rogers was her idea of PURE ENTERTAINMENT. So she did it constantly, in spite of her limited range. You mention Mame, she even wanted to do Dolly but Merrick had already signed Streisand, so she wanted to do Mame even if she knew she would not do justice to those great musical numbers. The thing is, Musicals were by then PASSE, we would not see them be a hit again until CHICAGO decades later. So, nobody would have gone to see Angela doing that movie, they would however go to see Lucy, it wasn't the hit she hoped it would be but it still played very well on her own medium of television and eventually made it's money back, it was not a turkey as some state. The soft focus filming ruined it for some and others were turned off by her singing those songs. I always loved what Lucy herself said about that in defence, that Mame was boozing and partying all night, how could her voice be like Julie Andrews? LOL! Typical Lucy!


I actually like Lucy's Mame. I admit I have to cover my ears during a couple of those songs, but otherwise I find the film very enjoyable. A lot of the criticism has been that Lucy was too old for the part. But before I ever read any of those critiques, I just assumed Mame was an older aunt, just like I have. Even though Angela Lansbury is a far superior singer, I don't think she would have had the right presence on the big screen. With no disrespect to her, I find her features sort of odd and not glamorous the way I envision Mame. Lucy, on the other hand, had very beautiful facial features that, in my opinion, fit the character, even if it required a bit of soft focus. And I agree that the Lucy's speaking fit the character. And, of course, as this is a musical COMEDY, neither Angela Lansbury or anyone else could have been as adept with the comedy bits as Lucy. I've seen that movie many times and always enjoy it.

Yeah, but that was the main problem right there, Lucy gave the world a great musical with tiny bits of comedy here and there but the public always only wanted to see her clowning around as there was nobody better at that. There's not enough comedy to fit Lucy, but you're right, i think it's one of the best things she ever did, she looks glamorous, bigger than life which she always was and surrounded by great performers and a score to die for. And that wardrobe, a quarter million dollars for those outfits and she looks sensational.