View Full Version : Keith Warren Case -- My Thoughts
Thiussat 03-16-2007, 01:41 AM I had seen this case years ago and I am glad I got to catch it again.
In a nutshell, it is obvious to me that the police (or maybe one crooked cop) was involved, if not in the murder itself, then in a cover-up. Here's why:
1) The fact that the mother received photos of the crime scene on her doorstep is a dead give away. Who else, besides the cops, would have access to that? This envelope also contained a death threat to one of Keith's friends, who was later found dead in mysterious circumstances.
2) The hanging "gallow" was set-up in much too of a complex manner for any depressed or desperate person to take the time to construct. This is not consistent with suicide.
3) Keith was wearing someone else's clothes, which I find very weird. I think the reason is that the Cops clothed him so that his real clothes could be destroyed in case of any trace forensic evidence.
My theory is that Keith was a witness to either a violent crime or he knew some major drug dealers. This would explain the 4 black males driving around looking for him in the days before his death. I think Keith's friend was also involved in something that he wished he had not gotten himself into and wanted to warn Keith of the danger they were both in. I say that Keith's friend was involved in shady activity because a witness said he had made a comment about being there when Keith was hanged. Perhaps Keith's friend attended the hanging in fear of his own safety (to fit in etc..). This murder was likely gang/drug related.
Now, the only explanation to the photos on the doorstep has to be that an insider within the police dept. put them there. Perhaps there was a crooked cop who was involved in all of this criminal activity (probably drug dealing) and this cop helped cover up the murder.
So, what you have, I think, was some sort of criminal enterprise being ran by a gang working in conjunction with either one cop or a group of cops. The gang probably killed Keith and some of the cops made sure they covered it up. The whole investigation was horrendous and stank to high heaven.
greatgarrett2 03-16-2007, 01:49 AM Yeah, I don't know about the pictures. Who would have access to them other than cops or it could've been some sadistic ploy by the killers who took photos of the last minutes of Keith's life and had the nerve to leave them on his mother's doorstep. Very strange and sad case. I have to agree with you tho in that keith might've gotten involved with certain people at the wrong place and wrong time. Or, that he might've witnessed something sinister going on.
Thiussat 03-16-2007, 03:56 AM The photos were police photos. The Police deptartment verified this. This means someone on the inside did it.
PrettyinPink55 03-16-2007, 10:35 AM Is this case still cold? I think the police could've been A LOT more helpful in this!!!! They seemed to be uncooperative on purpose, like they knew something. Very frustrating!!!!!
I agree with your theory though thiussat. That's why those guys were probably looking for him.
The fact that somebody sent pictures of the murder scene to the family is just horrifying.
lilmissd 10-28-2007, 06:11 PM I think the police totally dropped the ball on this case, and from what I know about it it makes me very angry that the people that did this have gotten away with it for over 20 yrs.! Even the coroner said that their was no way in Keith's condition, with the chemicals found in his system, that he would have been cognizant and coherent enough to have hung himself in that tree, I don't know why the police can't see that. And the friend of Keith's that was looking for him Mark Findley, I don't think it was a coincidence that he turns up dead just a couple of months after his message on Keith's mother's answering machine? I think he knew what had happened and the people involved knew, and he was killed to keep him from telling what he knew. One thing I don't get is that, if he had information, why didn't he tell Keith's mom sooner? He died before he got to tell what he knew, I mean come on the guy had a couple of months to say something, why didn't he? Both him and Keith I believe had knowledge of criminal activity, maybe going on at the college? And because they wanted to go to the authorities, they were taken completely out! The Medical examiner that looked at Mark's body after he was taken to the coroner, said that his injuries didn't fit the accident! He looked like someone had hit him with a baseball bat, because he had extensive facial injuries that didn't coincide with a bicycle accident. Something about this case just STINKS! You be the judge folks.................
Screwed up case, probably the most corrupt ever profiled on UM.
First Strike: Blatant murder with the two trees, police DOESN'T even do an autopsy and by the time his family is told of the murder he's in a funeral home? WTF?
Second: The pics. Extremely suspicious
Third: His friend Mark, after doing some research, was said to be killed after he fell off his bike, yet the ambulance said it looked like he was hit to death by a baseball bat. That case has been closed and will never be reopened.
I'm sure the cops are covering this up and are hiding a ton of answers....
keith warren 01-02-2009, 05:57 PM I posted this in two other threads. The family really appreciates your care and concern.
I speak on behalf of the family and want to say thank you for your concern. As of 01/09 there is no new developments with the case. I would like to clarify a few things;
1. it took police 6hrs to notify his mother of his death. The detective went to the neighbors house told the neighbor to call the mother and have the mother call him.
2. the first paramedic who arrived on scene said that he immediately knew it was a staged hanging and was not touching the body until police arrived. this is a medically trained individual who from first site knew that the hanging was staged. He waited until the police arrived and thought to himself because the responding officer was black that Keith would get justice. The officer and detective released him from the scene. Only until later when he saw the story on UM did he contact the family to give his account.
3. it took 3 attempts by Keith's uncle to identify the body. The first attempt he was asked to leave the funeral home because they were closed for business ( once keith's mother was notified she had to be sedated and her family in North Carolina was called and they drove up that same night). The uncle was told that there was so much decomposition that there should be a closed casket, however as see by the pictures there is and was no decomposition. The second attempt during business hours the next day he was told he needed the mother or father, Keith's father was in NC and his mother was sedated. The third attempt Keith's mother had to be dragged in and once the funeral had her they pushed several papers infront of her to sign. They then told the uncle to take her home and bring back clothing for the body. Now be mindful that no one from the next of kin had id the body. It took 3 trip and 24hrs to id the body.
4. The medical examiner (at that time) has since admitted that he did not examine the body directly however did take the information over the phone.
5. The detective released the body to the funeral home of his choice
6. The tree that was cut down was later destroyed in a warehouse fire
7. the date of death do sent match on the police report and the death certificate
8. From the autopsy that was funded by the family it was noted that Keith had so many chemical at such high amounts in his system (keep in mind this is several years after his death) that he would not have had the physical or mental capability to tie a rope around two trees and jump off another object.
these are just a few of the issues the family has to deal with. This is Montgomery County at its finest!
TheCars1986 03-29-2011, 09:30 AM If Keith was murdered by drug dealers, why would the cops help cover up their crimes? And if there were some corrupt cops that held some sort of financial gain by keeping the drug dealers free, that would literally mean almost the entire police force was corrupt. Could this really be that big of a conspiracy?
badcompany 03-29-2011, 07:18 PM If Keith was murdered by drug dealers, why would the cops help cover up their crimes? And if there were some corrupt cops that held some sort of financial gain by keeping the drug dealers free, that would literally mean almost the entire police force was corrupt. Could this really be that big of a conspiracy?
Knowing Montgomery County I'd buy it. No offense to anybody who lives there but it is one of the more corrupt county governments and has a rather large bureaucracy (as is often the case with affluent counties). It is entirely possible that the part of the police force that isn't corrupt simply has no resources to go after those who are. With no real public pressure, Keith Warren's death just got swept under the rug.
queenofcupcakes 03-31-2011, 11:05 PM has anyone else noticed that the second examiner found TCE in his system and that its not a drug a kid would buy on the street? Not to mention he said it was consistent with inhalation,which makes it even more bizarre. It makes me think someone who has knowledge of anesthesiology or mortuary work was involved. trichloroethylene used to be used to anesthetize people. unless this kid was doing cleaning work at JPL for Nasa,how the hell would he even get ahold of this chemical?! someone put him to sleep possibly attempting to kill him,since it has a high risk for respiratory despression.
it IS used to clean a range of things,but its use was already limited in the eighties.
was the cause of death strangulation from hanging or was he already dead when he was strung up?
also, on top of the fact that no suicidal person is going to take the time to make a bizarrely elaborate pulley type system to hang themselves, he was a kid! what kid that age would even be able to make that complex of a suicide device? anyone would just walk two feet and hang themselves from a bigger,sturdier tree.
the fact that he was in different clothes,and from the photos they look very clean,makes me think his body was stripped and washed after he died,and that the *******s who did it re-dressed him. as to why they put different clothes on him,i'm baffled.
as far as the two kids that were looking for him,theyre undoubtedly someones rotten little cronies. possibly the people that may have taken him to the person who killed him,probably by force. I really doubt he was killed at the location where his body was found. the best lead would be getting ahold of those two individuals,although its obvious the scummy PD isnt going to bother doing it. they probably know them quite well
queenofcupcakes 03-31-2011, 11:16 PM If Keith was murdered by drug dealers, why would the cops help cover up their crimes? And if there were some corrupt cops that held some sort of financial gain by keeping the drug dealers free, that would literally mean almost the entire police force was corrupt. Could this really be that big of a conspiracy?
If drugs and drug dealers were involved, and they were covering it up for them, its because a significant number of cops in that PD are involved. Perhaps there was a drug ring that would have implicated a lot of police officers and/or affluent members of the community. Youd be suprised how many police departments are essentially running the show themselves. the dealers and kids on the street peddling little sacks of weed and coke to other kids are just the donkeys.
but, I dont think he was involved in drugs,it seems off. Not that I knew him or his family,though. He may have been. I think it is more likely that he knew something and was seen as a threat. If he were a petty drug dealer that pissed another one off, I would think they would just shoot him. It definitely was done under the direction of people who knew what they were doing: the police department.
TheCars1986 04-01-2011, 03:14 PM I have no doubts that the police bungled this investigation. One look at the crime scene photos and it's obvious that Keith could not have hung himself in the position he was found. I just don't think there's this high level corruption going on where drug dealers with the aide of crooked cops are running the town. I personally think this case is a lot like Kurt Sova's. There was probably a freak accident involved and those with Keith began to panic and set up his body to look like he hung himself. This article is from the Keith Warren website written by his mother:
http://keithwarrenjusticesite.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/mothers-account.pdf
The similarities between Kurt Sova and Keith Warren are kind of eerie, IMO. Both cases involve both Keith & Kurt hanging out with friends (some of which allegedly were from ill repute) before they died under mysterious circumstances. Keith Warren was reported dead by a woman who said someone committed suicide in the basement of the house from which she was calling (sounds a lot like Sova, doesn't it?). Never really noticed the similarities between Keith and Kurt, but after reading that article it really made me notice more. Another interesting thing brought up in the article is the fact that the five independent pathologists who refuted the original coroner's report also stated that they could not say whether or not Keith took the toxins voluntarily or not.
EDIT - Just thought of this. If Keith in fact did witness something he wasn't supposed to see (something gang related, drug deal, etc.) why would they take the time to change his clothes? And there were no obvious defensive wounds found on Keith, just how did they subdue him? I personally think if Keith was at a party doing drugs, and had a weird reaction (possibly causing him to vomit on his clothes) this would answer the question why he was wearing different clothes a lot better.
queenofcupcakes 04-01-2011, 10:11 PM I have no doubts that the police bungled this investigation. One look at the crime scene photos and it's obvious that Keith could not have hung himself in the position he was found. I just don't think there's this high level corruption going on where drug dealers with the aide of crooked cops are running the town. I personally think this case is a lot like Kurt Sova's. There was probably a freak accident involved and those with Keith began to panic and set up his body to look like he hung himself. This article is from the Keith Warren website written by his mother:
http://keithwarrenjusticesite.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/mothers-account.pdf
The similarities between Kurt Sova and Keith Warren are kind of eerie, IMO. Both cases involve both Keith & Kurt hanging out with friends (some of which allegedly were from ill repute) before they died under mysterious circumstances. Keith Warren was reported dead by a woman who said someone committed suicide in the basement of the house from which she was calling (sounds a lot like Sova, doesn't it?). Never really noticed the similarities between Keith and Kurt, but after reading that article it really made me notice more. Another interesting thing brought up in the article is the fact that the five independent pathologists who refuted the original coroner's report also stated that they could not say whether or not Keith took the toxins voluntarily or not.
EDIT - Just thought of this. If Keith in fact did witness something he wasn't supposed to see (something gang related, drug deal, etc.) why would they take the time to change his clothes? And there were no obvious defensive wounds found on Keith, just how did they subdue him? I personally think if Keith was at a party doing drugs, and had a weird reaction (possibly causing him to vomit on his clothes) this would answer the question why he was wearing different clothes a lot better.
I re-watched the Kurt Sova segment today and now I remember it. I dont know,the only similarity was the basement aspect of it. But I think thats just a coincidence because a basement is probably where alot of people would hide a body initially before moving it to a safer location. I really think the Sova case was an accident that kids tried to cover up, albeit in a particularly morbid way.I think there were alot of kids over 18 but still young enough to not think straight when a 17 year old either got too drunk and...well i'm not really sure about that part. I dont think alcohol was the only thing involved though. So they tried to cover it up by hiding the body in several locations. I think the girl who called his dad saying she thought Kurt was asleep in the basement probably started to freak out and wanted to confess without actually doing it. The other people involved found out and moved the body before his dad showed up to check. He did say the cot in the room looked like it had been slept on..or at least there was a body there. But back to the keith story..
I didnt read about the whole call about the body in the basement and the three creeps involved until just now. It does seem eerily similar,but I think its just coincidence.The whole basement issue in the Warren case is totally bizarre. Why would a 19 year old kid
have commited suicide in these people's basement? I dont think they would have enough time between placing the 911 call and the time that paramedics would arrive at the home to move the body and set up that rope system,
so they must have moved him within the two days he was 'missing'.Its odd. Why mention the basement at all? Maybe thats where he was actually killed?
In his mother's account at the end it says Chip Wynn,the man who lived at the house and who was close associates with Officer Leverette, died of a drug overdose. I find that highly suspicious. It doesnt mention what drugs,but I wonder if it was cardiac arrest due to cocaine use. From 1984 till the 90s that particular area that he lived in had a heavy increase in 'gang and drug related activity',since its very close to Washington DC, one of the places where crack had the worst effect. I wouldnt be suprised if Wynn and leverette were involved with the people in high level crack distribution and that Warren may have become entangled in this. He did have a 2000 car insurance payment to make, which is difficult for a kid of 19 to handle. Alot of naive young men got into dealing that sheit just because the economy was so bad. He may have been one. They said he got involved with a 'rough crowd' shortly before his death. A mother's perception of her childs friends is often much nicer than what they really are. I think Mark Finlay was probably also doing the same thing, and both of them may have either wanted to get out, or found out something they should not have. He seemed like a good kid, maybe he was going to tell someone about what was going on?
Now, the thing about the clothes, I think he was killed or subdued at the house the 911 was placed at and then cleaned and re-dressed by the people who did it. But I cant think of why the change of clothes would matter. It reminds me of the case where the girl was found in an oil drum in the lake behind her house and she was wearing clothes that didnt belong to her or anyone she knew. And then not only did the oil drum disappear,but the police denied that she was ever even in it to begin with. whereas her mother firmly stated that there most certainly was an oil drum on the property missing and that she was in it when they pulled her out. Sorry, I just re-told the whole bloody segment in my rambling..
anyway. It just seems to me that if police where involved,they would want to get rid of any of his clothes that might have evidence on it that could link it back to them. even without dna testing,since it was 86.
Maybe not, since thats the part that confuses me the most. As far as the drugs in his system, the chemical trichloroethylene isnt really readily available to teenagers. The most access anyone his age would have to it would be through a solvent or cleaner at a mechanics,and it would be mixed with other stuff.......
hmm....that just made me think of something. I'm going to try and see if there is an actual copy of the autopsy report online. I havent read what the other chemicals in his bloodstream were,which might change my whole theory....and they would have broken down in his bloodstream over time seeing as the REAL autopsy wasnt done for years,so the amount that would have been present if they had properly performed the autopsy upon finding his body in 86 would have been MUCH higher. The fact that the amount was still high enough to be lethal suggests that it couldnt have been inhaled through a few drops on a cloth, but probably through a mechanical ventilator,which would allow him to continue breathing it in even after losing conciousness.I dont know if im starting to sound nutty and far fetched or not,but I just dont see how that particular chemical could be there in that amount without this happening. Perhaps I am wrong and just too paranoid.But, I digress...
But the gist of my babble is, that because the drug trichloroethylene was present,and "consistent with inhalation",I think it had to have been administered by someone who really knew what the f they were doing. anesthesiologists used to use it to sedate people for surgery until the 50s when we wised up and started using halothane. (nasa and the military also use it,a LOT.)Its just that chemical being present in such a high amount that makes the whole thing that much weirder. Why trichloroethelyene? And who obtained it?
Odd.
TheCars1986 04-02-2011, 08:57 AM If you read the article written by Keith's mother (the link is in my post before this one), you'll find that apparently Keith had become friends with "disreputable people" who "may have been involved in drugs". The article also details the woman calling saying a suicide occurred in her basement, that tidbit was left out of the UM broadcast. The way the UM segment was filmed it kind of made it seem like Keith was the clean cut All-American type who would never hang out with drug users. But after reading the article by his mother it kind of makes sense to think that something accidental happened and there was an attempted coverup.
EDIT - Just thought of this...if at least one member of the police department was involved in this coverup, this very well could have been some sort of "sting" operation that went wrong. That would put the police at the scene of Keith's death and also give them a reason as to why they would want it covered up.
queenofcupcakes 04-02-2011, 06:15 PM If you read the article written by Keith's mother (the link is in my post before this one), you'll find that apparently Keith had become friends with "disreputable people" who "may have been involved in drugs". The article also details the woman calling saying a suicide occurred in her basement, that tidbit was left out of the UM broadcast. The way the UM segment was filmed it kind of made it seem like Keith was the clean cut All-American type who would never hang out with drug users. But after reading the article by his mother it kind of makes sense to think that something accidental happened and there was an attempted coverup.
EDIT - Just thought of this...if at least one member of the police department was involved in this coverup, this very well could have been some sort of "sting" operation that went wrong. That would put the police at the scene of Keith's death and also give them a reason as to why they would want it covered up.
Ah, thats a good one. I never considered a possible sting operation gone wrong. That happened to a girl in my city a few years ago and it was a huge scandal. They shouldnt be using any civilian,especially young kids (the girl here was 21) in dangerous operations that have a huge chance in leading to someone's death. But how would the chemicals get in his system? Especially if they were inhaled.
queenofcupcakes 04-02-2011, 06:17 PM If you read the article written by Keith's mother (the link is in my post before this one), you'll find that apparently Keith had become friends with "disreputable people" who "may have been involved in drugs". The article also details the woman calling saying a suicide occurred in her basement, that tidbit was left out of the UM broadcast. The way the UM segment was filmed it kind of made it seem like Keith was the clean cut All-American type who would never hang out with drug users. But after reading the article by his mother it kind of makes sense to think that something accidental happened and there was an attempted coverup.
EDIT - Just thought of this...if at least one member of the police department was involved in this coverup, this very well could have been some sort of "sting" operation that went wrong. That would put the police at the scene of Keith's death and also give them a reason as to why they would want it covered up.
It wouldnt suprise me if the four boys mentioned by his friend and the new friends were petty drug dealers.
TheCars1986 04-03-2011, 11:22 AM Ah, thats a good one. I never considered a possible sting operation gone wrong. That happened to a girl in my city a few years ago and it was a huge scandal. They shouldnt be using any civilian,especially young kids (the girl here was 21) in dangerous operations that have a huge chance in leading to someone's death. But how would the chemicals get in his system? Especially if they were inhaled.
He very well could have ingested them himself. Then in a panic the elaborate "suicide" was staged in the woods behind the house he was in.
keith warren 04-03-2011, 11:03 PM If you go to www.keithwarrenjusticesite.com posted are official documents from the case. There is a new movement to get the death certificate changed from suicide to homicide. The friends and family have proven with verifiable evidence that Keith could not have put himself on the tree. The Montgomery County police department and the State of Maryland cannot prove with verifiable evidence that Keith put himself on the tree. There is also evidence in the police files that proves that the body was embalmed before the family id it. There is a movement on Facebook as well as a petition http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/help-keith-warren-find-justice/. The only way the family will see justice is to in the court of public opinion.
queenofcupcakes 04-04-2011, 01:10 AM He very well could have ingested them himself. Then in a panic the elaborate "suicide" was staged in the woods behind the house he was in.
Inhaled it by himself how though? it would burn alot.
TheCars1986 04-04-2011, 10:23 AM Perhaps he inhaled something that was laced with the chemical.
economistman192 06-30-2011, 09:12 PM I feel that there is a possibility that Keith and Mark tried to rip off or not pay a drug dealer that they were involved with. If they were dealing, maybe they tried to skim some off the top and thought it wouldn't be a big deal. I feel something explosive happened, based on some information someone had...Mark tried to warn Keith that he/they were in trouble.
There is a possibility that someone involved was also an informant for the police - I've heard of stories where the police protect informants. I'm reading that there may also have been jealousy about a girlfriend involved. Someone heard that Keith had done something with this girl behind someone's back, but I think the information was false. This episode was very creepy.
keith warren 06-30-2011, 10:23 PM Whether or not Keith and or Mark were involved with drugs... it does not explain the inactiveness of the police, state of maryland, and maryland state official. Keith could have been the Manuel Noriega of Wheaton, MD that does not explain away the lack of an investiagation. Whatever Keith was involved in prior to his death does not excuse MCPD for not doing there jobs and for their actions after his death that could have possibly allowed someone to get away with murder. You can find official documents and video on www.keithwarrenjusticesite.com
TheCars1986 07-01-2011, 08:17 AM Whether or not Keith and or Mark were involved with drugs... it does not explain the inactiveness of the police, state of maryland, and maryland state official. Keith could have been the Manuel Noriega of Wheaton, MD that does not explain away the lack of an investiagation. Whatever Keith was involved in prior to his death does not excuse MCPD for not doing there jobs and for their actions after his death that could have possibly allowed someone to get away with murder. You can find official documents and video on www.keithwarrenjusticesite.com
I don't think anyone on this website doesn't believe there was a cover up of some kind done by the police in this case. I still think this may have been an accidental death set up to look like a suicide. But that does not justify the actions taken by the police department.
I don't think anyone on this website doesn't believe there was a cover up of some kind done by the police in this case. I still think this may have been an accidental death set up to look like a suicide. But that does not justify the actions taken by the police department.
....you actually think that the police would go to those lengths to cover up an accidental death? And if his death really was an accident, why did those photos have to be sent to Keith's mom with such an ominous note, and why did Mark Finley have to be killed?
mwcarolina 07-01-2011, 11:45 PM ..and why did Mark Finley have to be killed?
First off, i feel the same way i felt years ago on this case. It smells of cover up and wish higher ups would take control of this case and solve it and break through the cover up. Now, why did Finley die, likely due to the fact that the people who killed keith feared that Finley would tell, there were 2 names though. i wonder if the other guy was killed.
TheCars1986 07-02-2011, 10:15 AM ....you actually think that the police would go to those lengths to cover up an accidental death? And if his death really was an accident, why did those photos have to be sent to Keith's mom with such an ominous note, and why did Mark Finley have to be killed?
If the police were involved in some type of sting operation which resulted in Keith's death, then yes they would cover it up. Or the police could have bungled the initial investigation, didn't want to admit their errors, and decided to stick with there "suicide" ruling at all costs. Finley, obviously, was going to tell Keith's mom what really happened which may have been why he was murdered. Although, there still is the possibility (albeit very miniscule) that Finley's death wasn't a murder and he accidentally died from a fall from his bike. Finley died one month after telling Keith's mother he had to "unload" IIRC, which seems like a long time to wait before actually talking to Keith's mother. Had he died a few days after leaving the message, then yeah, you could say he was silenced before he talked. But a whole month went by, which is why I think it's possible that his death was nothing more than an unfortunate accident. And there was another person who was singled out in the letter and I don't think they ever died. The pictures sent to Keith's mom definitely suggest someone from the police department sent them, who else would have access to them?
mwcarolina 07-02-2011, 11:46 PM it maybe someone from the police department or someone who could get their hands on those pictures and likley got them in the police department. like i said, this smells of cover-up and why is the answer we need, but will not likely get unless someone opens up and unloads.
UMFaninMD 07-03-2011, 02:55 PM Knowing Montgomery County I'd buy it. No offense to anybody who lives there but it is one of the more corrupt county governments and has a rather large bureaucracy (as is often the case with affluent counties). It is entirely possible that the part of the police force that isn't corrupt simply has no resources to go after those who are. With no real public pressure, Keith Warren's death just got swept under the rug.
True. Just do a Google search for "Montgomery County corruption" and it will bring up several stories about government and law enforcement employees who have been charged with bribery and other corrupt acts. I live in Harford County and like Montgomery, we are an affluent area with a large bureaucracy so we're a bit similar. Montgomery has also been in the news since last year for several murders, something of an epidemic apparently since the majority of the violent crime occurs in Baltimore City.
keith warren 07-05-2011, 08:54 PM it maybe someone from the police department or someone who could get their hands on those pictures and likley got them in the police department. like i said, this smells of cover-up and why is the answer we need, but will not likely get unless someone opens up and unloads.
The police admitted they were the official pictures taken at the scene by the police. The issue is that Stevie Wonder can see that this was not a case of suicide. After 25yrs and a change of guard, the current police officers, detective etc should make this a priority and do right by Keith Warren and his family and reopen this case. Sherri has a very simple request... Change the death certificate from suicide to either undetermined or homicide. Thru the efforts of the family, it has been proven that Keith could not have physically put himself on the tree. The State of Maryland and Montgomery County police department need to prove their case of Keith hanging himself. Since they cannot prove their case they need to change the death certificate.
mwcarolina 07-05-2011, 10:34 PM sadly, i dont see the police changing their mind. they are covering this up and it's usually unlikely cover-ups by the police will be uncovered and i really wish a higher up group would've went after this case and solved it. hopefully in time something happens with this case and they get some answers.
TheCars1986 07-06-2011, 07:57 AM sadly, i dont see the police changing their mind. they are covering this up and it's usually unlikely cover-ups by the police will be uncovered and i really wish a higher up group would've went after this case and solved it. hopefully in time something happens with this case and they get some answers.
I don't see why it would be such a stretch to change the cause to "undetermined". Even a four year old can see this wasn't a suicide.
keith warren 07-06-2011, 03:34 PM Sadly for the higher ups in Montgomery County and the state of Maryland... its not about justice for Keith and close for his family, but how much it will cost them to admit there wrong.....
mwcarolina 07-08-2011, 09:45 PM I don't see why it would be such a stretch to change the cause to "undetermined". Even a four year old can see this wasn't a suicide.
because then they would have to admit that they (the police) did this and that wrong and i agree, a four year old can see this is NOT a suicide. the photos that have been seen show that he could NOT have killed himself that way and the way it was explained on the show also shows that too. IF you are going to hang yourself why make it so difficult???? you dont, you find a big tree in the woods, and do it. i think it was something to do with drugs and that is why he was killed and Mark was likely killed because he was going to tell about what happened.
Shamsky329 12-17-2011, 04:18 PM This case always bothered me, as well as the Tommy Burkett case. Both cases right off the back are suspicious and the authorities had enough evidence to suggest foul play and not suicide.
Hasho 05-16-2015, 12:48 PM Bumping for Keith. Really interesting that the girl that called the police told them that there was an hanging in the basement of the house, but when the medical team arrived, the girl and her friends said it happened in the woods. One of the guy from the ambulance crew immediately realized that this was not a suicide. A lot of interesting points could be read at Keithwarrenjusticesite.com
Btw http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/sister-on-mission-to-prove-brother-didnt-take-his-own-life/2012/02/17/gIQATe2ZAS_story.html
Hambone2421 05-18-2015, 08:41 AM Bumping for Keith. Really interesting that the girl that called the police told them that there was an hanging in the basement of the house, but when the medical team arrived, the girl and her friends said it happened in the woods. One of the guy from the ambulance crew immediately realized that this was not a suicide. A lot of interesting points could be read at Keithwarrenjusticesite.com
Btw http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/sister-on-mission-to-prove-brother-didnt-take-his-own-life/2012/02/17/gIQATe2ZAS_story.html
Interesting that per that article, Keith's father (who is still alive) was a former police officer. He also said, "I wish my daughter would move on with her life". I wonder if that means that he believes the suicide ruling and wishes she would accept it as well?
Hasho 05-18-2015, 04:14 PM Interesting that per that article, Keith's father (who is still alive) was a former police officer. He also said, "I wish my daughter would move on with her life". I wonder if that means that he believes the suicide ruling and wishes she would accept it as well?
Yes he does. Keith's sister said that her relationship with her father ended over this case.
Hambone2421 05-18-2015, 05:22 PM Yes he does. Keith's sister said that her relationship with her father ended over this case.
That's also interesting considering Keith was his son and he was a former police officer. He may believe that the circumstances surrounding the case aren't as bizarre as Keith's mother and sister.
Either way, it's sad that their relationship ended due to their differing views on Keith's death.
TheCars1986 05-18-2015, 08:22 PM I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around (and believing) the murder scenario. Several articles refer to Keith's death as a "modern day lynching", and that race played a factor in the investigation and the way it was handled. There is also mention of hate crimes against blacks and Jews in the area around the time Keith died. But on the other hand, there is the theory that Keith started hanging around with a rough crowd and may have gotten mixed up with drugs and was killed by this rough crowd. So which is it? And where's the evidence outside of Mark Findlay's mysterious death?
I'm not trying to sound harsh, I'm just having a hard time wrapping my head around the murder theory. Because I do think the case was mishandled and that mistakes were made. But that does not necessarily equate to murder. Of note in Keith's autopsy in 1994, there is a curious line about a brief hospitalization after his parents divorced: "There is a history of a very brief hospitalization termed more of a reactionary-type phenomenon referable to the breakup of his parent's marriage but the word depression is not used." What does this mean?
On a somewhat related note, TCE (the chemical found in his body that was the only one deemed a lethal amount) is found in R134A refrigerant. I wonder if it was possible that he was huffing refrigerant? Kids do this (I work in the HVAC industry and it's more common than you would think) to get high.
Hambone2421 05-19-2015, 08:07 AM I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around (and believing) the murder scenario. Several articles refer to Keith's death as a "modern day lynching", and that race played a factor in the investigation and the way it was handled. There is also mention of hate crimes against blacks and Jews in the area around the time Keith died. But on the other hand, there is the theory that Keith started hanging around with a rough crowd and may have gotten mixed up with drugs and was killed by this rough crowd. So which is it? And where's the evidence outside of Mark Findlay's mysterious death?
I'm not trying to sound harsh, I'm just having a hard time wrapping my head around the murder theory. Because I do think the case was mishandled and that mistakes were made. But that does not necessarily equate to murder. Of note in Keith's autopsy in 1994, there is a curious line about a brief hospitalization after his parents divorced: "There is a history of a very brief hospitalization termed more of a reactionary-type phenomenon referable to the breakup of his parent's marriage but the word depression is not used." What does this mean?
On a somewhat related note, TCE (the chemical found in his body that was the only one deemed a lethal amount) is found in R134A refrigerant. I wonder if it was possible that he was huffing refrigerant? Kids do this (I work in the HVAC industry and it's more common than you would think) to get high.
I think you make some interesting points. Especially with the autopsy findings. Unsolved Mysteries has a tendency to play up only one side of the stories in the cases they feature. In Keith Warren's case, you are led to believe that he was murdered and it was a police cover up.
Now, I will admit that there are a lot of issues here. The debris found on Keith's back that suggest he was hoisted from the ground. The clothes he was found wearing which his family says are not his. The manner in which the rope was constructed around different trees (who goes to THAT kind of elaborate setup just to hang themselves?). The photos sent to Keith's family and the mysterious note. Mark Findlay's comments to Mary Cuey and his untimely death. Mary Findlay's supposed drunken comments when he said "I helped put Keith in the tree.".
Personally, I think he accidentally died somehow. I used to be of the impression that he was killed and the killers made it look like suicide but there is no evidence or motive for murder. I believe he was with friends when he accidentally died and they made it look like a suicide to avoid getting in any kind of trouble. Perhaps there was drugs and alcohol involved. The only thing that doesn't make sense about the accidental death is why would the cops assist in the cover up? They wouldn't care. Just a very odd case all around.
In the photos of Keith hanging from the tree, there is a small picnic basket looking thing and some random guy. Was it ever determined what the significance of the basket was and who the guy was?
TheCars1986 05-19-2015, 09:35 AM According to the police report on Keith's death, Keith's dad told police that Keith suffered a nervous breakdown and was hospitalized for four days after the divorce of his parents. Apparently prior to Keith's death, he was living with his dad in North Carolina when he was hospitalized. His mom picked him up and took him back to Maryland with her after the hospitalization. His dad also told police that he felt Keith felt he was too demanding and didn't show him any love. Shortly after that, his dad bought him a car, which caused some tension in the family. His mother felt that the car gave Keith too much freedom and there appeared to be some sort of back and forth between the parents and Keith with regards to the car. Keith lost his job on July 21st. There was car insurance due to be paid on July 31st. Keith's dad called him on July 29th and told him he was taking his car away from him (assuming it was because he lost his job and couldn't pay the insurance anymore) and taking it back to North Carolina and that he'd be up in Maryland to take it on the 31st. The 31st was the day Keith was found dead.
Now I'm starting to see why Keith's dad believes it was a suicide. I'm not entirely convinced yet, but I do see the other side of the argument more clearly now.
ETA: Found this report dated 2002, which says that TCE (the chemical found to be of lethal amounts in Keith) is prevalent in embalming rooms.
http://www.champion-newera.com/CHAMP.PDFS/encyclo647.pdf
Hambone2421 05-19-2015, 12:24 PM According to the police report on Keith's death, Keith's dad told police that Keith suffered a nervous breakdown and was hospitalized for four days after the divorce of his parents. Apparently prior to Keith's death, he was living with his dad in North Carolina when he was hospitalized. His mom picked him up and took him back to Maryland with her after the hospitalization. His dad also told police that he felt Keith felt he was too demanding and didn't show him any love. Shortly after that, his dad bought him a car, which caused some tension in the family. His mother felt that the car gave Keith too much freedom and there appeared to be some sort of back and forth between the parents and Keith with regards to the car. Keith lost his job on July 21st. There was car insurance due to be paid on July 31st. Keith's dad called him on July 29th and told him he was taking his car away from him (assuming it was because he lost his job and couldn't pay the insurance anymore) and taking it back to North Carolina and that he'd be up in Maryland to take it on the 31st. The 31st was the day Keith was found dead.
Now I'm starting to see why Keith's dad believes it was a suicide. I'm not entirely convinced yet, but I do see the other side of the argument more clearly now.
ETA: Found this report dated 2002, which says that TCE (the chemical found to be of lethal amounts in Keith) is prevalent in embalming rooms.
http://www.champion-newera.com/CHAMP.PDFS/encyclo647.pdf
See, based on this and combining it with the actual segment, I'm inclined to lead more credence to the suicide theory.
The one thing I keep coming back to is Mark Findlay. The VM he left for Keith's mother and the statements he made. Let's say Keith did kill himself. How can Findlay's actions/statements be explained?
RobinW 05-19-2015, 12:57 PM According to the police report on Keith's death, Keith's dad told police that Keith suffered a nervous breakdown and was hospitalized for four days after the divorce of his parents. Apparently prior to Keith's death, he was living with his dad in North Carolina when he was hospitalized. His mom picked him up and took him back to Maryland with her after the hospitalization. His dad also told police that he felt Keith felt he was too demanding and didn't show him any love. Shortly after that, his dad bought him a car, which caused some tension in the family. His mother felt that the car gave Keith too much freedom and there appeared to be some sort of back and forth between the parents and Keith with regards to the car. Keith lost his job on July 21st. There was car insurance due to be paid on July 31st. Keith's dad called him on July 29th and told him he was taking his car away from him (assuming it was because he lost his job and couldn't pay the insurance anymore) and taking it back to North Carolina and that he'd be up in Maryland to take it on the 31st. The 31st was the day Keith was found dead.
Now I'm starting to see why Keith's dad believes it was a suicide. I'm not entirely convinced yet, but I do see the other side of the argument more clearly now.
This info does answer a few questions I had. IIRC, in the UM segment, they state that Keith's mother did initially accept the suicide ruling, but they don't go into details why. If Keith was experiencing so many personal problems at the time, then the suicide theory is more plausible. I know that Keith's mother tried to get the investigation reopened after noticing some inconsistencies, but it didn't become a full-on crusade for her until six years later when those photos of Keith's hanging mysteriously showed up on her doorstep. Without those photos, it's possible this case might have been completely forgotten about.
Since the photos turned up on Keith's birthday, I guess it's possible that some sicko decided to play a prank, but by the sound of things, only a limited amount of people would have even had access to those photos in the first place, so it seems likely they were dropped off by someone connected to the investigation who was harboring a deep secret about what happened. I do think it's too much of a coincidence that Mark Findlay would be left unharmed for six years, but then suddenly die a suspicious death only two months after those photos and a note threatening his life turned up.
MegtheEgg86 05-19-2015, 02:01 PM ...but by the sound of things, only a limited amount of people would have even had access to those photos in the first place, so it seems likely they were dropped off by someone connected to the investigation who was harboring a deep secret about what happened. I do think it's too much of a coincidence that Mark Findlay would be left unharmed for six years, but then suddenly die a suspicious death only two months after those photos and a note threatening his life turned up.
Agreed.
If it weren't for Mark Findlay and his name repeatedly coming up in conjunction with Keith's death, and then Findlay himself turning up dead in a very suspect supposed accident, I'd probably be more apt to consider the suicide theory. I think Keith was killed and put in that tree.
Hambone2421 05-19-2015, 02:07 PM Agreed.
If it weren't for Mark Findlay and his name repeatedly coming up in conjunction with Keith's death, and then Findlay himself turning up dead in a very suspect supposed accident, I'd probably be more apt to consider the suicide theory. I think Keith was killed and put in that tree.
Completely agree Meg. The big thing for me was him saying that he "helped put Keith in the tree" when he was drunk. Take that away and I could very easily buy the suicide theory. Especially after what TheCars discovered.
TheCars1986 05-19-2015, 02:50 PM I am fascinated with this case and I can't stop reading about it and delving deeper. Here are some facts left out of the UM segment and questions I have about them:
-The police theory of suicide has Keith parking his car at the community clubhouse and walking 2/10 of a mile to the spot he hung himself. Keith's mom had said that she last saw Keith nearly two days prior to his body being found. Did his mother or any of his friends within the neighborhood remember seeing Keith's car at the clubhouse during his disappearance? Or was it stated that specifically no one saw his car until after the discovery of the body?
-Keith was carrying a bag containing a change of clothes and his brown boots. Had he done this any time prior before? Is it remotely possible that he spent the night with someone (after his mother last seen him but prior to being found dead) which is why he left with a bag and a change of clothes? Could he have spent the night with Mark Finley?
-Keith was also carrying a 4 pack of wine coolers, and bottles were found scattered around his body. Knowing that no autopsy was done and that there's no way of determining whether or not he had drank the wine coolers, is this a particular brand that he was known to drink? Was he a drinker?
-The police report indicates that the last time anyone can verify that Keith was alive was after his father called him on July 29th and told him he was going to take his car away. Have there been any other reports of other people who have said that they saw Keith on the 30th or the 31st?
-The other man named in the threatening letter received by Keith's mother has presumably never been injured or killed. Or this would bolster the claim that Finley and this man were killed in retaliation for Keith's death. I believe I have Id'ed this guy, and if he's the right person, he's still alive today and is a successful mortgage lender.
-Why did Mark Finley say he was going to "unload" to Keith's mother, yet not reach out to her for an entire month? Is it possible that since there were rumors going around town involving Finley bragging to people that he was involved with Keith's death, that by "unloading" he simply wanted to tell his mother that he had nothing to do with Keith's death?
-The threatening letter (with the photographs) was sent to Keith's mom 6 years after his death. Isn't it possible that due to the passage of time that Keith's mom simply misremembered the clothes he had? And why were the pictures and the note sent 6 years after the fact?
-Is it possible that one of Keith's friends somehow obtained the pictures of Keith and sent them anonymously to Mary in some sort of way to say that they were going to extract revenge on Mark Finley for what his alleged role in Keith's death?
-Is there any more information with regards to Mark Finley? Was he feeling nervous, did he mention his life being in danger to friends, family, etc. shortly before he died?
-At the time of Keith's death, it was a Maryland state law that the State Medical Examiner had discretion as to whether or not an autopsy was to be performed on suicide victims. That law has since been changed, but at the time of Keith's death it was different.
-The state medical examiner (after Keith's body was exhumed and an autopsy was performed) had said that after reviewing the autopsy, "It is my opinion that the toxicological findings are consistent with the effects of the embalming and body preparation process", and, "The absence of any physical injury on the body supports the conclusion [that] Keith Warren's hanging was a self—inflicted act." If Keith was in fact murdered, where are the signs of a struggle, signs of injuries, etc.?
-The accidental death staging theory has Keith ingesting or inhaling some sort of drug before reacting extremely negatively to it and vomiting (presumably all over his clothing), before dying. Whoever he was with panicked, cleaned him up, and changed his clothes before setting him up in the tree. Not being familiar with autopsies or pathology, but wouldn't the autopsy have shown evidence of some sort of vomiting or damage to Keith's esophagus?
-I think the UM segment was a bit misleading with regards to Mark Finley's death. They make it seem like he hit a curb and tumbled over a cliff and died as a result. I found an old WaPo article from 1993 that says: "Couey contends that there is a connection between her son's death and a pre-dawn bicycle accident last August that killed Harold Finley, a friend of Keith Warren's who was present when Warren's body was found. Police ruled Finley’s death an accident, stating that he received head injuries when the front wheel of his bike came off about 5 a.m. while he was riding on a bike path in Wheaton." Is this true that Finley was present at the scene when Keith's body was found?
-Several articles written around the time of the UM segment being filmed mention that Finley was a friend of Keith's. The UM segment makes it seem like they were only acquaintances.
-According to a poster on this forum, IIRC it's the same person responsible for running the Keith Warren website, Mary never divulged the name of the other person named in the threatening note with Mark Finley. But a local news station ran a story on Keith's death, and specifically mention that Finley's family had no comment with regards to the case and that, "a third friend has also gone to police to complain that Couey had told him that he too might be in danger." So she did reach out to this other guy and the police know the ID of this guy if this report is accurate.
-The same local news report say that the photos Mary Couey received were copies of the original police photos. And it's odd that they were received 6 years after Keith's death and on what would have been his 25th birthday. That does seem indicative of some sort of prank rather than someone concerned about the case trying to reach out to the family to help.
-Keith's mother claims that her car was broken into and that the threatening note was stolen. Did she show this note to any other person?
With all of the available evidence that I can gather it does seem like the police REALLY bungled the way the case was investigated. I don't think there was any criminal intent on the part of the investigating PD, but I do think there was some possible civil lawsuits that could have been filed. However, despite the fact that the police seem to have mishandled the investigation, I'm still leaning more towards accidental death or suicide. I just don't see the evidence for murder.
TheCars1986 05-19-2015, 03:02 PM Agreed.
If it weren't for Mark Findlay and his name repeatedly coming up in conjunction with Keith's death, and then Findlay himself turning up dead in a very suspect supposed accident, I'd probably be more apt to consider the suicide theory. I think Keith was killed and put in that tree.
I'm starting to wonder as to whether or not Finley is just another "woman in the floppy hat" and a red herring in this case. Yes he bragged about being involved with Keith's death, and that article says he was present at the scene after the body was discovered. I'm starting to wonder whether or not the bragging was just some sort of false braggadocio on the part of Finley when he was drunk, being that he was there when the cops found Keith's body and wanted to inject himself into the case more than he was involved.
Plus, Keith's mom reached out to Finley after receiving the note, not the other way around. And Finley told her he'd talk to her soon, but never did. He died a full month later. Just seems odd that he'd wait that long if he indeed planned on "unloading" what he knew to Mary Couey. And as far as I know, the other man named never came forward claiming to have information with regards to Keith's death. He went to the police after Mary Couey contacted him telling him he was threatened in the letter she received, but gave no indication that he had information about Keith's death.
Hambone2421 05-19-2015, 03:52 PM -I think the UM segment was a bit misleading with regards to Mark Finley's death. They make it seem like he hit a curb and tumbled over a cliff and died as a result. I found an old WaPo article from 1993 that says: "Couey contends that there is a connection between her son's death and a pre-dawn bicycle accident last August that killed Harold Finley, a friend of Keith Warren's who was present when Warren's body was found. Police ruled Finley’s death an accident, stating that he received head injuries when the front wheel of his bike came off about 5 a.m. while he was riding on a bike path in Wheaton." Is this true that Finley was present at the scene when Keith's body was found?
Could that be him in the background of that one photo that is taken of Keith Warren to the side? Whoever it is, its a black male that appears to be in normal clothes, not any type of uniform or attire that a crime scene investigator or anyone else in law enforcement would wear.
TheCars1986 05-19-2015, 04:02 PM Could that be him in the background of that one photo that is taken of Keith Warren to the side? Whoever it is, its a black male that appears to be in normal clothes, not any type of uniform or attire that a crime scene investigator or anyone else in law enforcement would wear.
It was a white male (who's curiously shirtless) who was the boyfriend to the woman who called 911 to report Keith's death. The police and local news report stressed that he was not involved in any way, and that due to police ineptitude, they didn't cordon off the scene, and he appeared in the pictures after going out with his girlfriend to show police where Keith's body was.
Hambone2421 05-19-2015, 04:20 PM It was a white male (who's curiously shirtless) who was the boyfriend to the woman who called 911 to report Keith's death. The police and local news report stressed that he was not involved in any way, and that due to police ineptitude, they didn't cordon off the scene, and he appeared in the pictures after going out with his girlfriend to show police where Keith's body was.
http://keithwarrenjusticesite.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2010-12-24T08:20:00-08:00&max-results=7
That's a white guy? Looked like a black male to me.
TheCars1986 05-19-2015, 07:39 PM http://keithwarrenjusticesite.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2010-12-24T08:20:00-08:00&max-results=7
That's a white guy? Looked like a black male to me.
I could have sworn I've seen a closer, clearer picture somewhere and the guy looks white, possibly Hispanic. In that picture it's hard to tell.
Anyway, I was incorrect. The man in the photo is the person who was the "occupant" in the house in which the lady who was walking her dog and found Keith was staying. There was another man staying in the house that time who was the lady's boyfriend. The occupant of the house was the one who led the police and paramedics to the area where Keith's body was found. And he was the one in the photo.
To my knowledge, none of the occupants inside knew Keith, which is why Rodney Kendall was asked to ID the body.
There is a claim on a website (or maybe in this thread or another Keith Warren thread) that a 911 call was made about a "suicide in the basement" of the residence where the 911 call originated. And something to the effect of one of the paramedics (Dallas Lipp, I believe was his name) signed an affidavit related to this tidbit. This fits in with the "accidental death at a party" theory. But after viewing Lipp's affidavit, he makes no mention of the call coming into a "suicide in a basement". He says the call was made from the residence picked up on the 911 call saying that the apparent suicide occurred "in the area" of the residence. Not the basement. This house was right next to the wooded area where Keith was found. There is no mention of the word basement in his affidavit. He does say when they arrived no one was waiting for them outside and that they had to knock on the door, and that one of the people (the man in the photo) reluctantly agreed to show them where Keith's body was...but that's it. He makes note that the three in the house seemed "matter of fact" about things, but also pretty shaken up.
keith warren 07-31-2015, 08:24 PM [/B]I am fascinated with this case and I can't stop reading about it and delving deeper. Here are some facts left out of the UM segment and questions I have about them:
-The police theory of suicide has Keith parking his car at the community clubhouse and walking 2/10 of a mile to the spot he hung himself. Keith's mom had said that she last saw Keith nearly two days prior to his body being found. Did his mother or any of his friends within the neighborhood remember seeing Keith's car at the clubhouse during his disappearance? Or was it stated that specifically no one saw his car until after the discovery of the body?- No...because his car was not parked there the 1 1/2 days prior to his body being found
-Keith was carrying a bag containing a change of clothes and his brown boots. Had he done this any time prior before? -No Is it remotely possible that he spent the night with someone (after his mother last seen him but prior to being found dead) which is why he left with a bag and a change of clothes? Could he have spent the night with Mark Finley?-No because it was routine for Keith to let my mother know of his plans if he was going to be late
-Keith was also carrying a 4 pack of wine coolers, and bottles were found scattered around his body. Knowing that no autopsy was done and that there's no way of determining whether or not he had drank the wine coolers, is this a particular brand that he was known to drink? Was he a drinker?there was 2 bottle tops found in his front pocket of the pants that was not his he was wearing by the funeral home worker who cut his body down off the tree. There is no mention of any empty bottles found at the scene..so would you like for my family to believe Keith drank wine coolers left the scene to throw them away and then come back to hang himself?
-The police report indicates that the last time anyone can verify that Keith was alive was after his father called him on July 29th and told him he was going to take his car away. Have there been any other reports of other people who have said that they saw Keith on the 30th or the 31st?No because MCMPD closed the case at the scene and did not investigate the crime as anything other than a suicide
-The other man named in the threatening letter received by Keith's mother has presumably never been injured or killed. Or this would bolster the claim that Finley and this man were killed in retaliation for Keith's death. I believe I have Id'ed this guy, and if he's the right person, he's still alive today and is a successful mortgage lender. and the point you are making is that people who have committed crimes and dont get caught cannot go on to have live a full life?
-Why did Mark Finley say he was going to "unload" to Keith's mother, yet not reach out to her for an entire month? Is it possible that since there were rumors going around town involving Finley bragging to people that he was involved with Keith's death, that by "unloading" he simply wanted to tell his mother that he had nothing to do with Keith's death? Only Mark Finely can answer that question, however I heard the message on the tape and I personally took it to MCMPD and the tape came up missing
-The threatening letter (with the photographs) was sent to Keith's mom 6 years after his death. Isn't it possible that due to the passage of time that Keith's mom simply misremembered the clothes he had? And why were the pictures and the note sent 6 years after the fact? No because per the police inventory the items I have in my possession are the items my uncle received back in 1986 from the investigating officer
-Is it possible that one of Keith's friends somehow obtained the pictures of Keith and sent them anonymously to Mary in some sort of way to say that they were going to extract revenge on Mark Finley for what his alleged role in Keith's death? Montgomery county Maryland pd have CONFIRMED they are the copies of the negatives currently in their arhive
-Is there any more information with regards to Mark Finley? Was he feeling nervous, did he mention his life being in danger to friends, family, etc. shortly before he died? The answer would require someone doing a investigation
-At the time of Keith's death, it was a Maryland state law that the State Medical Examiner had discretion as to whether or not an autopsy was to be performed on suicide victims. That law has since been changed, but at the time of Keith's death it was different.It has been proven that there is NO MEDICAL documentation/information for a determination of suicide. The basics of a lividity test were not done. We dont know what day or time Keith passed away because no one with at medical background examined his body, not to mention the funeral home worker who cut Keith off the tree said that he notice there was NO soling on Keith's clothing.
-The state medical examiner (after Keith's body was exhumed and an autopsy was performed) had said that after reviewing the autopsy, "It is my opinion that the toxicological findings are consistent with the effects of the embalming and body preparation process", and, "The absence of any physical injury on the body supports the conclusion [that] Keith Warren's hanging was a self—inflicted act." If Keith was in fact murdered, where are the signs of a struggle, signs of injuries, etc.?Or he could have been dead prior to being strung up on tree
-The accidental death staging theory has Keith ingesting or inhaling some sort of drug before reacting extremely negatively to it and vomiting (presumably all over his clothing), before dying. Whoever he was with panicked, cleaned him up, and changed his clothes before setting him up in the tree. Not being familiar with autopsies or pathology, but wouldn't the autopsy have shown evidence of some sort of vomiting or damage to Keith's esophagus? You made our point... MCMPD investigating Detective never thought we would get the pictures which would validate our claim all along something wasnt right.
-I think the UM segment was a bit misleading with regards to Mark Finley's death. They make it seem like he hit a curb and tumbled over a cliff and died as a result. I found an old WaPo article from 1993 that says: "Couey contends that there is a connection between her son's death and a pre-dawn bicycle accident last August that killed Harold Finley, a friend of Keith Warren's who was present when Warren's body was found. Police ruled Finley’s death an accident, stating that he received head injuries when the front wheel of his bike came off about 5 a.m. while he was riding on a bike path in Wheaton." Is this true that Finley was present at the scene when Keith's body was found? Mark was not present however the night before Keith's body was found, I was personally told by 4 people Mark came through my neighborhood like a bat out of hell looking for Keith and I was given the description as if he was trying to either warn Keith or set him up
-Several articles written around the time of the UM segment being filmed mention that Finley was a friend of Keith's. The UM segment makes it seem like they were only acquaintances. Mark was an acquaitance
-According to a poster on this forum, IIRC it's the same person responsible for running the Keith Warren website, Mary never divulged the name of the other person named in the threatening note with Mark Finley. But a local news station ran a story on Keith's death, and specifically mention that Finley's family had no comment with regards to the case and that, "a third friend has also gone to police to complain that Couey had told him that he too might be in danger." So she did reach out to this other guy and the police know the ID of this guy if this report is accurate.And what exactly does this have to do with the fact that at 1:30pm on the afternoon of July 31 there was no physical evidence to rule this case a suicide and Keith's body should have gone to the coroners office or ME office for autopsy
-The same local news report say that the photos Mary Couey received were copies of the original police photos. And it's odd that they were received 6 years after Keith's death and on what would have been his 25th birthday. That does seem indicative of some sort of prank rather than someone concerned about the case trying to reach out to the family to help.MCMPD have confirmed they are their pictures so using your theory someone broke into the police department and stole the negatives, had the negatives developed and then broke back in put the negatives back and gave us the pictures
-Keith's mother claims that her car was broken into and that the threatening note was stolen. Did she show this note to any other person?Yes, I saw the note
With all of the available evidence that I can gather it does seem like the police REALLY bungled the way the case was investigated. I don't think there was any criminal intent on the part of the investigating PD, but I do think there was some possible civil lawsuits that could have been filed. However, despite the fact that the police seem to have mishandled the investigation, I'm still leaning more towards accidental death or suicide. I just don't see the evidence for murder.
I will continue to ask the question what information/evidence at 1:30pm on the afternoon of July 31, 1986 allowed Detective Beasley to play God and totally change the dynamic of my family structure
WishfulDreamer 07-31-2015, 10:57 PM Thank you for posting. I realize today marks 29 years, and I'm deeply sorry for your loss. I hope that one day you get answers.
keith warren 07-31-2015, 11:35 PM Thank you for posting. I realize today marks 29 years, and I'm deeply sorry for your loss. I hope that one day you get answers.
Thankyou for the your nice message. It is difficult every year for 2 days because we dont know the exact day or time Keith died.
TheCars1986 08-01-2015, 11:05 AM No...because his car was not parked there the 1 1/2 days prior to his body being found
Did Keith say where he was going with his car the last time he spoke with his parents?
No because it was routine for Keith to let my mother know of his plans if he was going to be late
Were there any reasons why Keith would have had the brown boots and a change of clothes?
there was 2 bottle tops found in his front pocket of the pants that was not his he was wearing by the funeral home worker who cut his body down off the tree. There is no mention of any empty bottles found at the scene..so would you like for my family to believe Keith drank wine coolers left the scene to throw them away and then come back to hang himself?
I had read an article wrong, my apologies. There were no bottles found at the scene, but there was an empty carton of wine coolers found there. But did he drink that particular brand prior?
No because MCMPD closed the case at the scene and did not investigate the crime as anything other than a suicide
I haven't seen the UM segment in a long time, but was Keith reported missing prior to his body being found?
and the point you are making is that people who have committed crimes and dont get caught cannot go on to have live a full life?
No, the point was that if Finley was murdered as an effort to keep quiet, the note specifically said that "so and so" was next. And he's still alive. Which doesn't coincide with the theory that Finley was murdered to be silenced.
Only Mark Finely can answer that question, however I heard the message on the tape and I personally took it to MCMPD and the tape came up missing
If you don't mind me asking, what was Finley's demeanor like on the tape message?
It has been proven that there is NO MEDICAL documentation/information for a determination of suicide. The basics of a lividity test were not done. We dont know what day or time Keith passed away because no one with at medical background examined his body, not to mention the funeral home worker who cut Keith off the tree said that he notice there was NO soling on Keith's clothing.
I know that there was never an autopsy done that supported the death as suicide. It was a (head scratching) Maryland law back then that did not require a death by suicide to have an autopsy performed. That law has since changed.
Or he could have been dead prior to being strung up on tree
Yes he could have. But how was he murdered?
Mark was not present however the night before Keith's body was found, I was personally told by 4 people Mark came through my neighborhood like a bat out of hell looking for Keith and I was given the description as if he was trying to either warn Keith or set him up
Thanks for clearing that up.
And what exactly does this have to do with the fact that at 1:30pm on the afternoon of July 31 there was no physical evidence to rule this case a suicide and Keith's body should have gone to the coroners office or ME office for autopsy
Just saying that the authorities were aware of this other man named in the note, and had questioned him.
dynoguy88 08-01-2015, 11:58 AM This may be a minor factoid but hopefully Sherri can answer for me.
The UM segment says that Mark Finely left a message on your mother's answering machine saying, "Miss Warren, this is Mark Findlay. I got your message and I will be by to see you.’ I do remember the specific words were ‘I need to unload."
UM hints that was the last time there was any contact between Mary and Mark before he died so the meeting never took place. But, as it turns out, an entire month passed before Mark died. What happened there? Was it an entire month of phone tag (which seems highly unlikely) or do you think Mark got second thoughts about unwinding to your mother and decided to ignore her calls?
I'm just wondering why there was no further contact during that time period.
keith warren 08-01-2015, 01:15 PM [QUOTE=TheCars1986]Did Keith say where he was going with his car the last time he spoke with his parents?He said he was going out with "friends"... the same friends who did not call or come by looking for Keith the day and a half he was missing.. any other time they would have been on our phone or in my house hanging outThis information was given to MCMPD with no follow up at the time
Were there any reasons why Keith would have had the brown boots and a change of clothes?My mother saw Keith leave the house in the items which we received from MCMPD the day after his body was found minus the shorts, underware and tshirt, the brown construction boots, blue hooded jacket jimi Hendrix hat and blue duffle bag with tape it.... He did not leave with a chang of clothing
I had read an article wrong, my apologies. There were no bottles found at the scene, but there was an empty carton of wine coolers found there. But did he drink that particular brand prior?that I cannot answer for fact, however if you have empty wine cooler cartons where are the empty bottles?
I haven't seen the UM segment in a long time, but was Keith reported missing prior to his body being found?My mother made several attempts to report him missing in the 24hrs which she hadn't seen or heard from him... MCMPD would not take the report until 48hrs after she last saw him
No, the point was that if Finley was murdered as an effort to keep quiet, the note specifically said that "so and so" was next. And he's still alive. Which doesn't coincide with the theory that Finley was murdered to be silenced. Mark had information in relation to how Keith got on that tree
If you don't mind me asking, what was Finley's demeanor like on the tape message? Nervous
I know that there was never an autopsy done that supported the death as suicide. It was a (head scratching) Maryland law back then that did not require a death by suicide to have an autopsy performed. That law has since changed.There was NOTHING at the scene at 130pm to classify it a suicide or not[/B]
Yes he could have. But how was he murdered?because no autopsy was performed and the Detective did his very best to destroy evidence that question will never be answered. from cutting the tree down to "losing" the noose... The lead Detective did everything in his power to cover up something
Thanks for clearing that up.
Just saying that the authorities were aware of this other man named in the note, and had questioned him.No they did not question him... he went to them to file a compliant against my mother. He was never question in an official capacity
keith warren 08-01-2015, 01:20 PM This may be a minor factoid but hopefully Sherri can answer for me.
The UM segment says that Mark Finely left a message on your mother's answering machine saying, "Miss Warren, this is Mark Findlay. I got your message and I will be by to see you.’ I do remember the specific words were ‘I need to unload."
UM hints that was the last time there was any contact between Mary and Mark before he died so the meeting never took place. But, as it turns out, an entire month passed before Mark died. What happened there? Was it an entire month of phone tag (which seems highly unlikely) or do you think Mark got second thoughts about unwinding to your mother and decided to ignore her calls?
I'm just wondering why there was no further contact during that time period.
I cannot say why Mark waited a month to make contact. I was not familiar with Mark and did not have a conversation with him outside of the one time in a mall at a random encounter
LilMissKryssy 08-04-2015, 02:29 PM Sherri, I feel so sorry for you and your family for the suffering you all have had to endure with no having justice for Keith. I do believe he was murdered and it was covered up from what I've read over the years.
I have a question that you might be able to answer since you probably have more information then I do. Is there a theory or a reason as to why Keith would've been murdered? Also, was anyone who could have or would have had a motive connected to the lead detective or anyone in the police department that would lead them to cover it up? Just wondering if you had any theories regarding that.
keith warren 08-04-2015, 08:08 PM Sherri, I feel so sorry for you and your family for the suffering you all have had to endure with no having justice for Keith. I do believe he was murdered and it was covered up from what I've read over the years.
I have a question that you might be able to answer since you probably have more information then I do. Is there a theory or a reason as to why Keith would've been murdered? Also, was anyone who could have or would have had a motive connected to the lead detective or anyone in the police department that would lead them to cover it up? Just wondering if you had any theories regarding that.
Unfortunately we really dont have a clue to the answers to either question
keith warren 10-16-2017, 01:51 PM I respectfully ask everyone to visit www.TheKeithWarrenJusticesite.com. User name "TheCars1986" and "BDR" have put misinformation and misquoted me in other threads on this site concerning my brother and the circumstances surrounding his death. What is more troubling is that when he mis-quoted me in another thread he then used alternative facts to back up his point. There is nothing more disturbing then when you read lies, deceit and misinformation about your loved one from someone who clearly has nothing more to do than to misinform others.
janiesue 10-17-2017, 02:49 PM So I am trying to think why the different clothing, could he have had a GF and maybe they where parking? and someone came up on them... The clothing just blows my mind
keith warren 10-17-2017, 03:05 PM So I am trying to think why the different clothing, could he have had a GF and maybe they where parking? and someone came up on them... The clothing just blows my mind
To explain the clothing.... Some of the clothing Keith was last seen in by my mother was given to my uncle from the police officer the day after his body was found. We recognized the items as his so who ever had the clothing knew what we would recognized and not throw up a red flag. It was not until after we got the pictures did we realize the clothing was changed. There are several explanations from the police:
1. He took a change of clothing to hang himself
2. The clothing was around his body - however you dont see them in the pictures and they are not listed in the police report
3. The police claim the funeral were in possession of his clothing.. The funeral home personnel gave a statement that the only thing they remove from the scene was the body, noose(which they gave to police), and the clothing on the body.
My theory is Keith was killed in the clothing he left the house in and whomever were in possession of his clothing knew what to give us and what to destroy.
janiesue 10-17-2017, 03:16 PM It look like his feet where touching the ground, is that right?
keith warren 10-17-2017, 03:19 PM He feet are in a position as if he were sitting in a bar stool touching the ground
janiesue 10-17-2017, 03:23 PM He feet are in a position as if he were sitting in a bar stool touching the ground
Yea, and they think he did that to his self? the flight or fight would have taken over and I am sure the ground and area around him would have been highly disturbed. No matter if he thought he wanted to kill his self the body once it started happening would have fought back. ...How would he have gotten his head in the rope?.. No way he did this. No way at all.
I am so sorry that the police are not standing up and finding out the truth for your family member
dynoguy88 10-17-2017, 07:15 PM The police actually suggested he brought an extra pair of clothing to change into before hanging himself? :rolleyes: If you're going to kill yourself, changing into a second set of street clothes first is going to be the last thing on your mind.
I've also always had a problem with the tree he was hanging from. In my mind, a depressed and suicidal teenager going into the woods to kill himself would not have chosen such a wimpy little tree to hang himself from. Keith was a skinny kid, not huge and heavy. Yet that tree branch can barely hold his weight. It just seems to bolster the theory brought up in the segment that he was already dead and someone hoisted him up, lazily, on the first little tree they came across so they could get out of there in a hurry.
keith warren 10-17-2017, 08:46 PM The police actually suggested he brought an extra pair of clothing to change into before hanging himself? :rolleyes: If you're going to kill yourself, changing into a second set of street clothes first is going to be the last thing on your mind.
I've also always had a problem with the tree he was hanging from. In my mind, a depressed and suicidal teenager going into the woods to kill himself would not have chosen such a wimpy little tree to hang himself from. Keith was a skinny kid, not huge and heavy. Yet that tree branch can barely hold his weight. It just seems to bolster the theory brought up in the segment that he was already dead and someone hoisted him up, lazily, on the first little tree they came across so they could get out of there in a hurry.
What was told to my mom by the detective was that Keith used 2 trees to hang himself. One tree was to anchor the rope then he threw the rope over the branch of the second tree and jump off some object to hang himself.
keith warren 10-17-2017, 08:48 PM Yea, and they think he did that to his self? the flight or fight would have taken over and I am sure the ground and area around him would have been highly disturbed. No matter if he thought he wanted to kill his self the body once it started happening would have fought back. ...How would he have gotten his head in the rope?.. No way he did this. No way at all.
I am so sorry that the police are not standing up and finding out the truth for your family member
The explanation from MCMPD is that he used a "sling shot" method to hang himself. Once he dropped down the branch was supposed to snatch back up and somehow his feet were kicked out in front of him
keith warren 10-17-2017, 09:45 PM Sherri, I feel so sorry for you and your family for the suffering you all have had to endure with no having justice for Keith. I do believe he was murdered and it was covered up from what I've read over the years.
I have a question that you might be able to answer since you probably have more information then I do. Is there a theory or a reason as to why Keith would've been murdered? Also, was anyone who could have or would have had a motive connected to the lead detective or anyone in the police department that would lead them to cover it up? Just wondering if you had any theories regarding that.
That is a very good question. We have no idea what could have possibly happen because there's so many moving parts and so many different components to so many different people playing so many parts and roles in this situation.
janiesue 10-18-2017, 07:47 AM Have yall tried a PI?
keith warren 10-18-2017, 10:41 AM Have yall tried a PI?
Yes, my mother had to file for bankruptcy paying for the PI, exhumation and autopsy, as well as other experts to do the job MCMPD is paid to do.
James T 07-25-2018, 09:19 AM Intriguing case-I am curious about the photos sent to Keith's mother, did the police give any explanation as to how crime scene photos were copied/stolen from them? Was it somebody inside the force doing it or possibly one of their relatives involved? Aside from the guy who ended up dead what happened to the other individual named in the threatening note? It showed two letters which looked like LA or LE-maybe a Larry, Lee or Leroy.
TheCars1986 07-25-2018, 10:38 AM Intriguing case-I am curious about the photos sent to Keith's mother, did the police give any explanation as to how crime scene photos were copied/stolen from them? Was it somebody inside the force doing it or possibly one of their relatives involved? Aside from the guy who ended up dead what happened to the other individual named in the threatening note? It showed two letters which looked like LA or LE-maybe a Larry, Lee or Leroy.
He's still very much alive and active in the area.
Shonnette1986 08-02-2018, 02:44 PM The photos were police photos. The Police deptartment verified this. This means someone on the inside did it.
Wow, you are correct. I never even thought about that. The police were clearly covering this case up. I think it was some shady officer who was involved and wanted to taunt the family.
Stratego 03-24-2025, 10:39 PM I see this is a sensitive case, but I truly feel this is most likely a suicide. The fact that it's elaborate does not convince me it's not. It would also be a very elaborate murder-staged-suicide. I think it's telling his mother initially accepted the suicide ruling and it seems his father still does (?). While LE didn't do a great job, I don't think they covered anything up.
keith warren 03-25-2025, 07:16 PM I see this is a sensitive case, but I truly feel this is most likely a suicide. The fact that it's elaborate does not convince me it's not. It would also be a very elaborate murder-staged-suicide. I think it's telling his mother initially accepted the suicide ruling and it seems his father still does (?). While LE didn't do a great job, I don't think they covered anything up.
Understand, and respect your opinion.
1. It's hard to argue with science; the Maryland Medical Examiner reversed the cause of death on the death certificate in 2024 to undetermined
2. The detective was so convinced it was a suicide that he decided to send the body to the funeral home of his choice, change Keith's clothing, order no autopsy, and destroy evidence.
3. The detective was so convinced it was a suicide that he went back to the crime scene 30 days after we buried Keith and cut the tree down with the explanation he was collecting evidence on a closed case. He then, interestingly enough, did not document the evidence, take pictures, or keep any record of the branch he was trying to get to. The branch could tell you which way the rope burn was going—up or down....
3. The detective was so convinced it was a suicide that he lost the noose, which would be considered key evidence to prove a point of suicide because the knot could tell you if a left-handed or right-handed person tied the knot.
4. The detective was so convinced it was a suicide that he took information from an unknown, unrelated person at the scene and then used the information to classify the case as a suicide and close the case 30 minutes after arriving on the scene.
4a. The detective was so convinced it was a suicide he told the Medical Examiner there was no need for you to come to the scene and sent the body to the funeral home of the detective's choice, which embalmed my brother prior to identification.
5. It's hard to believe a mother could change her mind.
infinityluxe 03-26-2025, 11:34 AM Understand, and respect your opinion.
1. It's hard to argue with science; the Maryland Medical Examiner reversed the cause of death on the death certificate in 2024 to undetermined
2. The detective was so convinced it was a suicide that he decided to send the body to the funeral home of his choice, change Keith's clothing, order no autopsy, and destroy evidence.
3. The detective was so convinced it was a suicide that he went back to the crime scene 30 days after we buried Keith and cut the tree down with the explanation he was collecting evidence on a closed case. He then, interestingly enough, did not document the evidence, take pictures, or keep any record of the branch he was trying to get to. The branch could tell you which way the rope burn was going—up or down....
3. The detective was so convinced it was a suicide that he lost the noose, which would be considered key evidence to prove a point of suicide because the knot could tell you if a left-handed or right-handed person tied the knot.
4. The detective was so convinced it was a suicide that he took information from an unknown, unrelated person at the scene and then used the information to classify the case as a suicide and close the case 30 minutes after arriving on the scene.
4a. The detective was so convinced it was a suicide he told the Medical Examiner there was no need for you to come to the scene and sent the body to the funeral home of the detective's choice, which embalmed my brother prior to identification.
5. It's hard to believe a mother could change her mind.
I agree with you Sherri. This was no suicide.
Something about this case that always bothered me was your father's lack of involvement with the media. From the information I gathered he quickly accepted this was a suicide and even gave the police information saying Keith was depressed and they had a bad fight. We saw your mother on the front line for years and your dad just kind of left her hanging. Mary didn't deserve that. I think this would have got much more support had they both been united in finding the truth.
Someone was working overtime to make Keith's death look like something it wasn't.
I think hanging him in a tree was a desperate plea to make it look like suicide; Keith died somewhere else. Whoever put him in that tree were intending to make it look like he killed himself not make it look like a hanging. A hanging of a black man brings too much attention. A black person would know this. I think it was one of Keith's white friends. I also don't think he was lynched. Too much care went into making it look a certain way. The changing of the clothing makes me think Keith probably had thrown up all over his own clothing.
I also think they panicked and covered up what could have been a drug overdose. I also feel like someone on that police force helped them cover up this crime.
Perhaps the same person who helped cover it up is the same person who slipped your mother those photographs out of a guilty conscience. Maybe wanting to at least let her know it indeed wasn't suicide.
I highly doubt this crime will ever be solved. I think the people involved and who know what happened have taken a pact to take this one to the grave.
I'm not sold that Keith was murdered but I am positive this was no suicide. Keith could have been experimenting with drugs with friends and it went awry.
There is the possibility it is murder and maybe someone jealous of Keith's nice car and future as a college student slipped him a lethal dose--someone he considered a friend.
I commend you on your crusade to get justice for Keith I really do. I also hope for you Sherri that you can come to terms with the possibility you may never know the truth. I know you are taking this on in the memory of Keith and your beautiful mother who worked so hard for justice. I just hope you take time to enjoy your life and not let this be all consuming. Your mother and Keith want you to live your life and find your own happiness outside of this.
Street Novelist 04-10-2025, 07:58 PM Too much time has gone by. The people who really know what happened are either dead or are so old, they probably figured there was no point in telling the truth now and will take it to their graves.
infinityluxe 04-14-2025, 02:04 AM Too much time has gone by. The people who really know what happened are either dead or are so old, they probably figured there was no point in telling the truth now and will take it to their graves.
Keith would be 58-59 if he were alive. I think his peers and the people responsible for his death would be around his age.
I think the people who know what happened have a pact to take it to their grave.
I don't think Keith's death was intentional. The cover up was very much intentional and tone deaf (hanging a black man). They were so busy trying to make this look like a suicide they didn't realize that hanging him from a tree would be unwanted attention (being theorized as a lynching).
I think one of Keith's peers had a relative in the police department that helped them cover this up. I think someone else in the police department also knew and their conscience got the best of them watching Mary Couey on the news still trying to get justice. This person put those pictures at Mary's doorstep.
This is a case I don't think there will ever be justice for. The people involved did something not very common--they kept their mouth shut.
This is a cautionary tale to watch the company you keep. Everyone is not your friend.
freakbook 04-14-2025, 01:51 PM The cover up was very much intentional and tone deaf (hanging a black man). They were so busy trying to make this look like a suicide they didn't realize that hanging him from a tree would be unwanted attention (being theorized as a lynching).
It could've been intentional. If the people Keith were hanging around we're black (I know it was said he didn't have many black friends) then "hanging" Keith would've been a great way for them to avoid blame
The talks of a lynching would automatically point to anyone white, so if they were black or another minority then it would be the perfect scapegoat for them to avoid suspicion
Street Novelist 04-14-2025, 03:08 PM It could've been intentional. If the people Keith were hanging around we're black (I know it was said he didn't have many black friends) then "hanging" Keith would've been a great way for them to avoid blame
The talks of a lynching would automatically point to anyone white, so if they were black or another minority then it would be the perfect scapegoat for them to avoid suspicion
Exactly! If the perpetrators were black, hanging Keith from a tree would have been the perfect distraction/red herring. They would know police would concentrate on only white suspects.
Street Novelist 04-14-2025, 03:13 PM Keith would be 58-59 if he were alive. I think his peers and the people responsible for his death would be around his age.
Not the police officers who originally investigated the case. They would have been in their 20's or 30's in 1986, putting them in their 60's-70's now. Most people that age with a secret don't go running to the media/press.
freakbook 04-14-2025, 03:37 PM Exactly! If the perpetrators were black, hanging Keith from a tree would have been the perfect distraction/red herring. They would know police would concentrate on only white suspects.
I'm still trying to get the episodes to you
keith warren 04-28-2025, 10:52 AM I agree with you Sherri. This was no suicide.
Something about this case that always bothered me was your father's lack of involvement with the media. From the information I gathered he quickly accepted this was a suicide and even gave the police information saying Keith was depressed and they had a bad fight. We saw your mother on the front line for years and your dad just kind of left her hanging. Mary didn't deserve that. I think this would have got much more support had they both been united in finding the truth.
Someone was working overtime to make Keith's death look like something it wasn't.
I think hanging him in a tree was a desperate plea to make it look like suicide; Keith died somewhere else. Whoever put him in that tree were intending to make it look like he killed himself not make it look like a hanging. A hanging of a black man brings too much attention. A black person would know this. I think it was one of Keith's white friends. I also don't think he was lynched. Too much care went into making it look a certain way. The changing of the clothing makes me think Keith probably had thrown up all over his own clothing.
I also think they panicked and covered up what could have been a drug overdose. I also feel like someone on that police force helped them cover up this crime.
Perhaps the same person who helped cover it up is the same person who slipped your mother those photographs out of a guilty conscience. Maybe wanting to at least let her know it indeed wasn't suicide.
I highly doubt this crime will ever be solved. I think the people involved and who know what happened have taken a pact to take this one to the grave.
I'm not sold that Keith was murdered but I am positive this was no suicide. Keith could have been experimenting with drugs with friends and it went awry.
There is the possibility it is murder and maybe someone jealous of Keith's nice car and future as a college student slipped him a lethal dose--someone he considered a friend.
I commend you on your crusade to get justice for Keith I really do. I also hope for you Sherri that you can come to terms with the possibility you may never know the truth. I know you are taking this on in the memory of Keith and your beautiful mother who worked so hard for justice. I just hope you take time to enjoy your life and not let this be all consuming. Your mother and Keith want you to live your life and find your own happiness outside of this.
Thank you for your thoughtful and supportive words. I stand firmly in the belief that the truth will always rise, no matter how long it takes. My request is simple: the Montgomery County Police Department must acknowledge the mishandling of Keith’s case and update his record to reflect the medical examiner’s official findings.
Families should never have to fight for basic justice — yet here we are. And I will not back down. It is heartbreaking when families are left in limbo because law enforcement and the medical community fail to work together to bring closure.
It is unacceptable that families are forced to battle the very institutions meant to serve and protect them. Justice delayed does not have to mean justice denied — but it demands courage, integrity, and action from those in power.
For Keith. For truth. For every family still waiting to be heard.
I will not be silenced. I will not be ignored. Justice will have its day.
keith warren 04-28-2025, 10:52 AM I agree with you Sherri. This was no suicide.
Something about this case that always bothered me was your father's lack of involvement with the media. From the information I gathered he quickly accepted this was a suicide and even gave the police information saying Keith was depressed and they had a bad fight. We saw your mother on the front line for years and your dad just kind of left her hanging. Mary didn't deserve that. I think this would have got much more support had they both been united in finding the truth.
Someone was working overtime to make Keith's death look like something it wasn't.
I think hanging him in a tree was a desperate plea to make it look like suicide; Keith died somewhere else. Whoever put him in that tree were intending to make it look like he killed himself not make it look like a hanging. A hanging of a black man brings too much attention. A black person would know this. I think it was one of Keith's white friends. I also don't think he was lynched. Too much care went into making it look a certain way. The changing of the clothing makes me think Keith probably had thrown up all over his own clothing.
I also think they panicked and covered up what could have been a drug overdose. I also feel like someone on that police force helped them cover up this crime.
Perhaps the same person who helped cover it up is the same person who slipped your mother those photographs out of a guilty conscience. Maybe wanting to at least let her know it indeed wasn't suicide.
I highly doubt this crime will ever be solved. I think the people involved and who know what happened have taken a pact to take this one to the grave.
I'm not sold that Keith was murdered but I am positive this was no suicide. Keith could have been experimenting with drugs with friends and it went awry.
There is the possibility it is murder and maybe someone jealous of Keith's nice car and future as a college student slipped him a lethal dose--someone he considered a friend.
I commend you on your crusade to get justice for Keith I really do. I also hope for you Sherri that you can come to terms with the possibility you may never know the truth. I know you are taking this on in the memory of Keith and your beautiful mother who worked so hard for justice. I just hope you take time to enjoy your life and not let this be all consuming. Your mother and Keith want you to live your life and find your own happiness outside of this.
Thank you for your thoughtful and supportive words. I stand firmly in the belief that the truth will always rise, no matter how long it takes. My request is simple: the Montgomery County Police Department must acknowledge the mishandling of Keith’s case and update his record to reflect the medical examiner’s official findings.
Families should never have to fight for basic justice — yet here we are. And I will not back down. It is heartbreaking when families are left in limbo because law enforcement and the medical community fail to work together to bring closure.
It is unacceptable that families are forced to battle the very institutions meant to serve and protect them. Justice delayed does not have to mean justice denied — but it demands courage, integrity, and action from those in power.
For Keith. For truth. For every family still waiting to be heard.
I will not be silenced. I will not be ignored. Justice will have its day.
keith warren 04-28-2025, 10:56 AM I'm still trying to get the episodes to you
Great point...
However, we should never get distracted from the fact that the color of the perpetrators would not matter if MCPD did the job they are paid to perform.
infinityluxe 05-04-2025, 10:32 AM Thank you for your thoughtful and supportive words. I stand firmly in the belief that the truth will always rise, no matter how long it takes. My request is simple: the Montgomery County Police Department must acknowledge the mishandling of Keith’s case and update his record to reflect the medical examiner’s official findings.
Families should never have to fight for basic justice — yet here we are. And I will not back down. It is heartbreaking when families are left in limbo because law enforcement and the medical community fail to work together to bring closure.
It is unacceptable that families are forced to battle the very institutions meant to serve and protect them. Justice delayed does not have to mean justice denied — but it demands courage, integrity, and action from those in power.
For Keith. For truth. For every family still waiting to be heard.
I will not be silenced. I will not be ignored. Justice will have its day.
Everything you stated is a fact. Someone worked overtime trying to cover this up for a reason. I truly hope you get the truth and justice for you and your loved ones. I was born the year Keith died and his story resonated with me watching re-runs of Unsolved as a child in the 90s.
You did an amazing feat getting that death certificate changed.
1990 UM fan 05-14-2025, 10:28 PM Sherri, you are a strong, brave, and resilient woman. Keith (and your mother) would be proud that you are fighting for him, and justice. This has gone on far too long and the truth must be set free, and peace of mind for your family.
keith warren 06-23-2025, 08:23 AM Sherri, you are a strong, brave, and resilient woman. Keith (and your mother) would be proud that you are fighting for him, and justice. This has gone on far too long and the truth must be set free, and peace of mind for your family.
Thank you for your kind message. I appreciate anyone who is continuing the conversation about how #KeithWarren was strung up on the tree. #MontgomeryCountyMaryland wanted my brother's story buried with him. I'm thankful for social media and the internet. Please continue to share Keith's story with your social circle.
keith warren 06-23-2025, 08:24 AM Everything you stated is a fact. Someone worked overtime trying to cover this up for a reason. I truly hope you get the truth and justice for you and your loved ones. I was born the year Keith died and his story resonated with me watching re-runs of Unsolved as a child in the 90s.
You did an amazing feat getting that death certificate changed.
Thank you, I appreciate your kind words.
keith warren 11-04-2025, 04:16 PM After nearly four decades of unanswered questions, my brother Keith Warren’s death has finally been reclassified by the Office of the Chief Medical Examiner from suicide to undetermined.
This moment represents more than a change in language — it marks a shift in truth, accountability, and acknowledgment that something was deeply wrong all those years ago. And now, as of last week, the Montgomery County Police Department has officially reopened Keith’s case. For the first time in 39 years, there is a renewed opportunity to uncover the truth that was long denied.
For my mother, who fought until her last breath to be heard, and for every family who has ever been silenced by the system meant to protect them, this is a step toward long-overdue justice.
The journey has been painful, but it has also revealed the power of persistence, faith, and community. Your prayers, your words of encouragement, and your unwavering belief have helped carry this fight forward when it felt impossible to keep going. For that, I thank you — deeply.
Though this reclassification and reopening bring validation, they do not bring closure. The fight for full transparency and accountability continues. Keith’s story is not just about our family — it’s about ensuring that truth is never buried, and that no family has to spend decades demanding what should have been given from the start: justice.
— Sherri Warren
mikewho 11-16-2025, 08:39 AM After nearly four decades of unanswered questions, my brother Keith Warren’s death has finally been reclassified by the Office of the Chief Medical Examiner from suicide to undetermined.
This moment represents more than a change in language — it marks a shift in truth, accountability, and acknowledgment that something was deeply wrong all those years ago. And now, as of last week, the Montgomery County Police Department has officially reopened Keith’s case. For the first time in 39 years, there is a renewed opportunity to uncover the truth that was long denied.
For my mother, who fought until her last breath to be heard, and for every family who has ever been silenced by the system meant to protect them, this is a step toward long-overdue justice.
The journey has been painful, but it has also revealed the power of persistence, faith, and community. Your prayers, your words of encouragement, and your unwavering belief have helped carry this fight forward when it felt impossible to keep going. For that, I thank you — deeply.
Though this reclassification and reopening bring validation, they do not bring closure. The fight for full transparency and accountability continues. Keith’s story is not just about our family — it’s about ensuring that truth is never buried, and that no family has to spend decades demanding what should have been given from the start: justice.
— Sherri Warren
That's great to hear. Hopefully this will lead to the case being solved. I have always felt this was murder and that Keith did not commit suicide.
infinityluxe 11-24-2025, 04:36 PM That's great to hear. Hopefully this will lead to the case being solved. I have always felt this was murder and that Keith did not commit suicide.
You know I think the only way this case will ever be solved is a deathbed confession.I think Keith was drugged/poisoned by someone he knew that was jealous of him. Keith had a lot going for him he was good looking, had a nice car and was on his way off to college. Either that or Keith witnessed something he shouldn't have. The way Keith was put in that tree was not in a way some teenager would do it. I think whoever did this got help from a relative that may have been a police officer. That is why Keith was embalmed immediately to cover up his true cause of death. This was all orchestrated and I think the PD covered it up on purpose.
I really hope one day Sherri gets the justice she deserves but I think maybe a handful of people know what truly happened to Keith and they are not going to say anything. This doesn't come off like a hate crime this was personal.
keith warren 04-12-2026, 02:50 PM You know I think the only way this case will ever be solved is a deathbed confession.I think Keith was drugged/poisoned by someone he knew that was jealous of him. Keith had a lot going for him he was good looking, had a nice car and was on his way off to college. Either that or Keith witnessed something he shouldn't have. The way Keith was put in that tree was not in a way some teenager would do it. I think whoever did this got help from a relative that may have been a police officer. That is why Keith was embalmed immediately to cover up his true cause of death. This was all orchestrated and I think the PD covered it up on purpose.
I really hope one day Sherri gets the justice she deserves but I think maybe a handful of people know what truly happened to Keith and they are not going to say anything. This doesn't come off like a hate crime this was personal.
I agree with the personal angle.
keith warren 04-12-2026, 02:50 PM That's great to hear. Hopefully this will lead to the case being solved. I have always felt this was murder and that Keith did not commit suicide.
Thank you
Dogface82 05-19-2026, 01:53 AM I am glad the death certificate has been corrected. It is a step in the right direction. I do feel that an agency or task force and prosecutor independent of Montgomery County should conduct the new investigation. Even if Montgomery PD does every perfect this time there will always be doubt because of the actions of the original first responders and investigators.
Personally I don't think Keith did this to himself. Homicide has been discussed. A possibility that hasn't been explored is an initiation gone wrong. Could he have been in a closet or other enclosed space that contained fluid with the chemical that may have killed him?
mwcarolina 05-26-2026, 11:28 PM Glad it’s been changed finally. I still question who did it though I feel whoever did it was likely very close to Mark
keith warren 07-10-2026, 10:21 AM Glad it’s been changed finally. I still question who did it though I feel whoever did it was likely very close to Mark
Agree. I also believe this case will never get the proper investigation as long as Montgomery County is running the investigation
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