I have friend that lives in the Shamrock, OK area where Wendy Camp, her daughter and Lisa Kriegar went missing after making a trip to Shamrock from OKC to visit Wendy's son. Bones were found in a pond located on private property in the Drumright/Shamrock area. Bones are those thought to be Wendy Camp, her daughter and Lisa Kriegar. An investigation is under way to determine more information as to what happened. It has been rumored that Chad Noe killed them and placed them in pond and had help. :clap:

Thanks for the update. Hopefully a link to an article can be provided soon.

Chad Noe looked guilty as sin in the UM segment. Maybe a DNA case can confirm that he and his bitter family did away with the 3 ladies.

Something concrete that can confirm suspicians. This case is one of the most talked about and one of the most heated on this forum. Chad Noe is dispicable. TruCrimeJunkie, how long ang were these bones found? This whole discovery seems to be recent news.

The receptionist at our dr's office is the one that told me of the discovery and it was made the weekend of the 8th of October. The FBI has been notified are investigating. The remarks that were heard in the bar back when this initially happened were that they would never find them. The pond they were found in is in a backwoods hard to find location. It's so scary knowing they were dumped on my friends property.

Oh dear. Well, if it turns out to be the three missing women, at least we know what ultimately happened to them. As for the details or who did it, that will probably be harder to prove.

In all honesty I had a feeling that Chad had some connection with their disappearances. BUT that's what I usually feel when there is a prime suspect that deny's they were involved. It was always in the back of my mind that maybe they hitched a ride and met with foul play at the hands of a stranger. I also thought that maybe the two older women wanted to walk away from their life and the younger girl had no choice but to follow. However, I knew that last scenario was far fetched.

When this all happened I was 14 yrs old and I remember it being big news. People in Chandler at the Walmart said that they seriously doubted that they had been dropped off. That is something that would have been noticable due to Wendy being afflicted with MS. I remember that Chad had been a suspect all along. I seriously doubt that he will ever be charged in this crime. He would have had to have help, for that would be too much for one person to handle.

I'll say it again. NO WAY were they dropped off at the Walmart. Naturally, if they were dropped off at that location, they would have gone into the store and called Wendy's husband for a ride home. They couldn't possibly have been abducted in the parking lot since it was broad daylight with people everywhere that would have seen or heard something.

This is why I think Chad's sister is just as guilty. She could have thought of a different lie than dropping them off at the Walmart. Even though she wasn't interviewed in the Unsolved Mysteries segment - her story makes her seem just as gulity.

I hope Chad's family is VERY nervous about the discovery of the bones.

I hope Chad's family is VERY nervous about the discovery of the bones.

Wonder if ol' sourpuss grandma is still as cocky now as she was in the UM segment?

What a witch.

jeeps

bitchin and moanin' - bitchin and moanin'

Classic stuff.

bitchin and moanin' - bitchin and moanin'

Classic stuff.
:lol:
I hate that these women especially a child would meet such a fate. But I hope that they will FINALLY get to the bottom of this. I can't believe a moron like that man and his family can commit murder in America and get away with it this long. That's scary to me:eek:

Hey, has any one been able to add any clarity on this update that the remains found in Okalahoma are those of Wendy Camp and her companions? I have since traveled to Okalahoma and oddly enough there is no information on public record for this case I called a few news stations and newspapers and they were not the least bit forthcoming of any updates or details surrounding these events..

This is great! I had always wondered about this case and am glad justice might happen

At this time, I still have not heard any more about the discovery of the bones. I was told because it is private property that is used for hunting, that an investigation is on hold till the season is over. Sounds weird to me, but this area is so small and murder is so rare, the law may not know what to do. Very strange. I'll keep you updated as I learn more.

I've always found in troubling that the drop off in the Walmart parking lot has been repeated as fact, yet there is no evidence that they ever left Shamrock. The only witnesses to this are the two individuals closest to the primary suspect.

Wendy hadn't spoken to her ex husband in six months, when he called her out of the blue to arrange a visitation for the same day. The likelihood of her disappearing into thin air, the one day Noe and his family were factored into the equation - is absurd. This is a classic case of shoddy police work.

Hopefully the bones prove to be those of Wendy and company and can offer some physical evidence.

Hey any updates? This one has bothered me for so long. First, Chad divorces Wendy for having MS. Second, constanly screwing with her visitation and accusations of sexual abuse. Third, calls up out of nowhere, offers to let Wendy see her son, requests she goes alone, Chad's mom willingly provides transportation. Fourth, stupid hokey story about a drop off at Wal mart and Chad's mom Beverly declines interviews. I'm sure the police have known it's Chad, Beverly and Ida all along and have been waiting for the bodies to turn up and the proper evidence. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this one out.

I can't begin to tell you how much I agree with you on this one I tell this is a classic example of shotty police work and that ex in law family are guilty as hell ............... They need to really do some work on this case because three people just don't dissapear off the face of the earth and never be seen again

oh god please let this case be solved and the guilty parties sentenced, this story is simple and they've tried to make it out to be some big mystery

oh god please let this case be solved and the guilty parties sentenced, this story is simple and they've tried to make it out to be some big mystery

LOL. It amazes me how many of the cases on UM are these "simple" stories that cannot be solved due to lack of evidence. Someone mentioned on one of the threads earlier about the dangers of double jeopardy in the U.S. (I think it was the recent Charlotte Polis thread) I couldn't agree with that comment more. Yeah, to us as the outsiders, it seems like the ex-husband's family is as guilty as sin... but I'm fairly certain that there is a lot that we don't know. If the case was as cut and dry as it seems, there's a reason that an arrest hasn't been made.

Just my two cents. :)

You know I don't understand why they can't build a circumstantial case again Beverly and Chad Noe. I mean they were the last people seen with them, there's all this history of bad blood between them and no one saw them at Wal-Mart where they were supposedly dropped off so I would think they could bring that up in court. I mean its a least a shot because as of right now they are still enjoying their freedom and thats not right if they are guilty of what most people on this board think they're guilty of.

As of now, I have not heard anything more about the bones. I have never heard any news reports or read any newspaper with any info. I was told by the owner of this property that they found the bones of these 3 women and yet nothing more about it. I find it odd. I was also told that after the women went missing that the brother of Chad Noe was in the local bar boasting about they (Law Enforcement) would never find the bodies. Very odd and very scary to know nothing is being done about it.

As of now, I have not heard anything more about the bones. I have never heard any news reports or read any newspaper with any info. I was told by the owner of this property that they found the bones of these 3 women and yet nothing more about it. I find it odd. I was also told that after the women went missing that the brother of Chad Noe was in the local bar boasting about they (Law Enforcement) would never find the bodies. Very odd and very scary to know nothing is being done about it.

It's possible that, since the bodies are skeletonized, they're taking a long time to reconstruct them. Also, it's possible that the three bodies were dumped very close together and their bones got mixed up. That might take a while to sort out. Hopefully, SOMEBODY SOMEWHERE is working on the case and they're just waiting on conclusive findings.

hmm

I did a search on google for the names months ago after someone posted this update and found at least one article supporting that...I gotta try to find that again

As of now, I have not heard anything more about the bones. I have never heard any news reports or read any newspaper with any info. I was told by the owner of this property that they found the bones of these 3 women and yet nothing more about it. I find it odd. I was also told that after the women went missing that the brother of Chad Noe was in the local bar boasting about they (Law Enforcement) would never find the bodies. Very odd and very scary to know nothing is being done about it.


Just wanted to check - any new developments concerning the remains of the 3 women?

I havent heard or seen any updates on the remains. It is safe to assume the two women are dead. I would hope the little girl was spared but I think this is unlikely. However I would hope they would be found so that they could receive the proper burial but besides that so Chad Noe and his mother and possibly other relatives that participated could finally be brought to justice. Personally I dont know who Chad Noe was trying to fool with his joke of an apperance on UM. I dont think he fooled anyone. His mother was probably the smartest out of all of them in that she just didnt make herself look any worse than she already looks by just not appearing. Chad Noe has already had 14 years extra of freedom, I think he and his mother need to be indicted for murder.

There doesn't appear to be any updates on the Doe Network. That Chad and his Grandma... so many quotes in this segement not just the "bitchn and moanin" but also Chad's "maybe in one of my drunken stupors" comment. I know everyone is presumed innocent but Chad had I'm guilty written all over him, lets hope Grandma goes down as an accessory.

How do people disappear from a Walmart parking lot during the middle of the day?

http://www.doenetwork.us/cases/1741dfok.html

It's possible that, since the bodies are skeletonized, they're taking a long time to reconstruct them. Also, it's possible that the three bodies were dumped very close together and their bones got mixed up. That might take a while to sort out. Hopefully, SOMEBODY SOMEWHERE is working on the case and they're just waiting on conclusive findings.

If it is indeed three adult women, what happened to the little girl? Who is the third women. Maybe these are three completely different women. You do have a point nohwheregirl. They could have bones mixed up. However, a good forensic anthropologist can get the job done right. Positive ID of the remains however is something that does not rest entirely in their hands.

I really hope this case gets solved and I also think Chad Noe and his family are guilty as sin!!!!

This case has troubled me since I first saw it on the original airing of UM. I found this site by Googling the parties involved. Have there been any updates?

Does anyone out there know if the police have ever looked back at this case? Where are the families now?

Excuse me for laughing but I just couldn't help it. :lol:

Grandma picked a perfect time to bash Wendy. She didn't even display any symathy nor concern. Chad's mother made herself look just as guilty by declining an interview.

You know I know everybody doesn't have decorum and obviously this wasn't the greatest situation in the world.

But Couldn't Grandma Sour-Puss just have left it at "We had a fight and I asked to be taken home rather than continue the journey."

I know Chad's future lawyer is going to look at a tape of this segement and just slap his forehead... it would be the LAST thing they want to introduced, rather than show the Noe clan as sympathetic or EVEN CARING that the mother of their child had disapperaed they are like "Good Riddance":mad:

Yep,i'm with everyone else on this one.i think Chads whole family is involved.I worked at a Wal-Mart and security is very tight cameras covering the whole parking lot.Now i know this happened in the early 90's when Wal-Mart wasn't as big as now so i'm not even sure if they had cameras in their lots.It could discount there whole account of dropping them off.

Isn't it sickening that Chad's family still hasn't been punished for what they have done?

I remember back when I saw this segment for the first time, I believed the family was guilty as soon as they stated that Chad's sister dropped the 3 women off at the Walmart. BS! They would have simply walked inside the store, gone to a payphone and called Wendy's husband to come pick them up. The chances of them getting kidnapped in the parking lot during the middle of the day with all those people around are slim to none.

They family probably could have thought of a better lie than Walmart.

:mad: :wave:

:mad: :wave:

:mad: :wave:

First off Aisha its great to have a family member posting and we're so glad you've found us! Everyone one I know on here thinks Chad and his family are responsible for their disappearances and have nothing but sympathy for you and your family. While I have your ear I have some questions:

Do you have any contact with Chad and his family? Have they ever tried to tell you their ridiculous story about how Wendy, Lisa and Cynthia were dropped off at Wal-Mart?

I assume you've seen the UM segment where at the end Robert Stack says a few months after their disappearance someone who knows the family claims to have seen Cynthia and police thought it was a credible sighting. Of course I hope its true but always found it rather farfetched. Have you heard of that and have any more info or thoughts on it?

How is Leon doing? I thought he came across as very devoted and nice in the segment.

Does Chad Noe live near you or does the family ever have to encounter him? Do you still get to see Wendy's son?

I hope you don't mind the questions, just curious as to some more aspects of the case. I'm sure we will all appreciate hearing anything you have to say. :)

Kimberly, thanks so much for what you had to add. It makes me even more sure that Chad and his family are, as you put it, guilty as hell.

I hope your family gets the needed answers very soon. You're in my thoughts and prayers!

:mad: :wave:

Well first let me offer my condolensces on your sister and the others. It is nice to see family members on here they offer their opinions on what all happened and they provide updates because you dont hear about it anymore. It is a shame that law enforcement agencies tend to forget about cases because they happened years ago. Ida is still alive? Wow. She seemed old enough in the segment she must be well into her 80's at least by now. Well it is quite obvious that Chad and Beverly were the ones that actually carried it out. Ida I am not sure if she participated but obviously she knows about the whole thing as well. Chad should have been indicted a long time ago. They havent found the bodies but Chad had the motive and that is enough to convict someone of murder. Sorry to hear about Jonathan since your family has basically lost him too from the sounds of it. He must be around 17 now? Well Chad sounds like he has always been a scumbag. Hearing what he did to Wendy when she developed MS and he kicked her to the curb and on top of it all took her son away. What I have always tried to figure out is why he would kill her. Was it because he was afraid that she would take Jonathan back from him? Was it because of his own personal hatred for her? I am sorry but just the way Chad's entire family treated her was just horrible. I couldnt believe that Ida would say on national tv that Wendy was "bitching and moaning." Just no respect at all. I think if Beverly and Chad were indicted you would see Beverly jump ship pretty quickly to save her own butt and say that Chad did it all. But of course they have never been indicted have they? The grand jury needs to indict those two and get them off the streets. Well the remains could be in that well. The state says they cant dig up the well? Wont is more like it. Chad has already had 14 years of freedom more than he should have had. He belongs in prison.

:mad: :wave:

Oh my GOD! And I thought Chad came off bad in the segment. He and his family sounds like an even BIGGER piece of work now.

I thought Chad was guilty as well. Also, did anyone notice that the woman who played Chad's mother Beverly in re-enactment didn't look much older than Chad Noe himself?

I thought Chad was guilty as well. Also, did anyone notice that the woman who played Chad's mother Beverly in re-enactment didn't look much older than Chad Noe himself?

Yeah, I noticed that too. I don't know why I keep thinking Chad's mother was in the segment when I know she declined to be in it. I guess I get so into the show sometimes that I forget the reenactments are reenactments

Yes is would be great to see that scum rot in jail for what he and his sorry ass family has done.. It is good there is still hope even today that the truth will be publicly announce although the ideas and thoughts we have here I think are not far from the truth.. I have often wondered if any of Chad's family ever came across this site and bared witness to the thoughts and ideas that we have about him and his family and what they have done!!

:mad: :wave:

Oh, that photo is priceless!!! :lol: Glad to see Granny Grump in the orange jump suit.

Oh, that photo is priceless!!! :lol: Glad to see Granny Grump in the orange jump suit.

I agree! Dynoguy you must make that your avatar picture...pretty please??!! :lol:

I cast a vote in that direction as well. Those are FANTASTIC pictures.

...now if we could only get one of Chad....

...now if we could only get one of Chad....

Hopefully wearing an orange jumpsuit as well.

:mad: :wave:

:mad: :wave:

Tell ME how to and I will.... Or, the two photos MERGED... PLEASE, someone with photoshop-know-how, help??? THANKS!!!

LOL, with or without text?

http://37pence.org/noejailbirds.jpg

http://37pence.org/noejailbirds2.jpg


Now you just save the image, click on User CP at the top, then Edit Avatar at the left, and upload it there :)

:mad: :wave:

hows this ? wanted to add a little something something on the end

http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/3788/bustedbn9.jpg

:mad: :wave:

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/2558/bustedbp4.jpg

LOL. You crazy kids.... :)

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/2558/bustedbp4.jpg



Excellent! If only Chad Noe was wearing an equally gorgeous orange suit, along with joshmoe. Life is beautiful.:happyface

if i had a photo of him, maybe we could arrange something...

if i had a photo of him, maybe we could arrange something...


lol yay for photoshop!

What a great thread. Some classic stuff. So is the guy that has been assigned this case still not doing anything with it? Why doesn't the FBI get involved? It was apparent that they were kidnapped no matter if it was by someone in the Wal-Mart parking lot (highly doubtful because of the amount of witnesses and cameras there) or by the scumbag family members suspected (Chad, Ida, and Beverly). And isn't kidnapping a federal crime automatically or do they have to be taken across state lines? If not, then they should assign this case to a cold case investigator or investigators that will actually do what it takes to solve it (put pressure on that scumbag granny or mom to give up their son/grandson and claim that they found some bones for leverage)? They would spill everything on that loser that doesn't even care about his son. I mean what other more important cases or cold cases could there be in Oklahoma? 3 WOMEN WERE MURDERED!! WTF?! Call in the Texas Rangers or someone who will actual give a damn, for christsakes.

This is a case where all signs point to the 3 scumbags for either participating in the kidnapping/killing/burying of those poor women and the covering up of it (getting rid of evidence and lying about their involvement or what they know). The only other way is that if they were abducted, but the basis for that theory is from Ida, one of the prime suspects and so you can't rely on it at all since granny is guilty as well as overly-defiant in the segment and doesn't even have a shred of compassion that these ladies went missing and are pretty much dead now. We have to come to the conclusion too that they are dead because they just wouldn't voluntarily leave like that and I'm assuming that Wendy needed stability in her life because of her MS and her son, instead of running away from the rest of her family and her son only to leave him with her despicable ex-husband, his grandma, and Wendy's mother-in-law. They are too guilty for this and should each get the needle for what they did.

Also, did they ever identify those bones found and what crimes did Ida and Beverly get charged and/or convicted with that put them in those perfectly apt orange jumpsuits?

So are the local law enforcement officials there commenting on these bones that were found, or do they just not give a damn?

This is why I think Chad's sister is just as guilty. She could have thought of a different lie than dropping them off at the Walmart. Even though she wasn't interviewed in the Unsolved Mysteries segment - her story makes her seem just as gulity.

I always felt that Chad, his mother, grandmother, and sister, were all in on it. His mother, and his sister too (?) just didn't have the gall to appear on camera. Supposedly there's such a thing as analyzing video and audio recordings through a stress detector to determine if a subject is lying. Maybe they were aware of this and so wanted no filmed record of their story. He and his grandma had more gall and look like two of the most evil creeps on the planet.

Thanks so much, Kimberly-Aisha, for your invaluable information! The full details are far worse even than the amount revealed on the show, which were horrible enough to be one of the main cases which haunted me over the years. Trust me, your loved ones are not forgotten! I did wonder about Cynthia's biological father and his reaction to all this. I felt enough sympathy as it was for her adoptive father Leon losing not only his wife and daughter but his sister...had no IDEA she was a single mother of young children! Any word on what happened to them? (Lisa's son seems to have posted on a message board last year about the case and seemed okay.) Any updates on the case? It seems they have had long enough to analyze those bones. How about interesting Ann Rule or some other true crime author in the case?

Is this discovery http://www.airalex.com/missing.html genuine? It seems if there are ANY human remains buried, it's worth digging up a little concrete to learn whose! If this is true, the cops in this area seem particularly lax! Could people interest a detective or private investigator? That's how the body of a mother buried for years under a deck and swimming pool her husband and killer built was discovered...when everyone was willing to believe her daughter was imagining things, a detective believed her, the pool was dug up, and sure enough, there was the body!

As for the remains in the pond...were they of two or three persons, and was the third a little girl, or older? They ought to be testing these, notifying the families, and asking for DNA samples! If the third body was of a female older than Cynthia when she disappeared, it could still be her and indicates an even worse fate...if these people were into prostitution and trafficking in young girls and thought they could make a buck off her...then disposed of her in this "unfindable" spot years later! Perhaps local authorities are simply too cheap/broke to investigate this. Could the case be updated when the program airs on Spike, and a fund set up to do the testing?

This story just aired on the new UM with no updates. :(

Wow, I didn't know they'd been arrested. Ol' Grandma looks rough in those pics. I'd like to find out more about the arson they apparently committed. I wonder if it's any relation to the case.

Just add me to the list of people who thought Chad Noe and his whole lousy family were guilty as soon as I saw the episode.

Read Wendy's sister's blog, and it just proves their guilt. The idiots changed their story. They first said that they dropped the 3 off on highway 66, but then later said they dropped them off in the parking lot at walmart. Well which is it!? It's pretty darn difficult to confuse a walmart with the side of a highway.

I can't believe the arson charge wasn't connected to accidently burning down their own meth lab. It's probably something stupid like they threw a molotov cocktail into someone's house or car out of jealousy.

Read Wendy's sister's blog, and it just proves their guilt. The idiots changed their story. They first said that they dropped the 3 off on highway 66, but then later said they dropped them off in the parking lot at walmart. Well which is it!? It's pretty darn difficult to confuse a walmart with the side of a highway.

And if they were dropped off at Walmart, I'm sure they would have gone into the store to call for a ride and then they would have waited. I can't imagine anyone is stupid enough to believe that story.

>>>And if they were dropped off at Walmart, I'm sure they would have gone into the store to call for a ride and then they would have waited. I can't imagine anyone is stupid enough to believe that story.<<<

You're 100% correct! I never believed that ridiculous story from the moment they blabbed it all over TV.

If they were ever dropped off in that walmart parking lot, it's because the Noe's hired hit men were waiting for them at the pre-arranged time to make the hostage transfer so they could be taken to another location to be murdered.

The whole Noe family has blood on their hands! And the blood of an innocent child, too!

When the segment showed Wendy calling her husband saying that they would be home in a "couple of hours" and that Beverly was ready to leave, it got me to thinking. Do you think they actually got in a car and drove them anywhere? How do we know that Chad wasn't with them? And I'm willing to bet that they had no intention of taking them home and drove them to someplace off the beaten path, and disposed of the women then and there! I don't know why they thing anyone would be dumb enough to believe that they were dropped off at Wal-Mart that was about 50 miles from Wendy's home, and I seriously doubt they would have hitchiked a ride with a stranger!

Any update on the supposed finding of remains?

Cori,

I visited Wendy's sister's blog a couple days ago and she didn't have any news. However, the authorities have been keeping her family in the dark about anything going on with the Noes.

If I remember correctly, those two old biddies had been in jail on arson charges for at least a month before Kimberly Aisha found out about it. I can't remember how she found out they were in jail. I'm sure they're out now. I believe they had six month sentences that ran from mid 2007 to 12/2007.

Also, I don't think authorities have told Wendy's family anything about bones being discovered. Again, if my memory is correct, I *think* she found out about that info from this message board.

I read just a bit further back in the posts and someone mentioned wondering if the FBI was involved. I don't know if they are/were involved or not.

I think they can get involved, if they decide to, or if a family requests, IF an adult has been kidnapped across state lines. (Not sure on my legalities.)

But I thought that when a child was kidnapped, the FBI had every legal right to get involved, whether the kidnapping was within the state or it was suspected that the child had been taken out of state.

I don't know what the laws were back when Wendy's daughter went missing with her and her SIL. I don't think they even had Amber Alerts back then. And from what I was reading in Katherin Korzulius' thread, even in 1996, the police were telling her mother that unless her 6 year old had been missing 24 or 48 hours or something, they wouldn't even start looking for her. (The mom found her in less than an hour, in the neighborhood, and she died later that day.)

With Wendy's daughter missing (along with her and the SIL) and the Noe women's history of pimping out young women, I can't believe that the possiblity of human trafficking wasn't looked into regarding the child.

Was there ever any confirmed sightings of the 3 in the Wal-Mart parking lot by eyewitnesses or security cameras?

Was there ever any confirmed sightings of the 3 in the Wal-Mart parking lot by eyewitnesses or security cameras?

Fletch, not only were they never seen at the Walmart, the person who said she dropped them off in the Walmart parking lot hasn't even pinned it down to one story yet. At first, she said she had dropped them off on the side of the highway.

As soon as the story is proven to have changed, chances are, the confused storyteller is the murderer. The truth doesn't change.

I think it would be strange that 3 people like that (and possibly more) could not only execute the murders of 2 adults and a child but be able to hide it this long. But, stranger things have happened in this sad world I suppose....

And from what I was reading in Katherin Korzulius' thread, even in 1996, the police were telling her mother that unless her 6 year old had been missing 24 or 48 hours or something, they wouldn't even start looking for her.
That's disgusting. You have to wait at least one full day before they'll look for a missing child? Isn't a child more likely to be killed within the first three hours of an abduction? I think I read something like that online. It's like the police are saying they hope kids get kidnapped and/or killed. :mad:

This was just on today, again with no updates. Chad Noe and his mother were very unlikable. Did anyone else notice they both looked left? (My left, their right, I mean). Supposedly that is a way to tell if someone is lying or not. If nothing else, Ida is guilty of being a sourpuss! :)

I didn't get the statement about how Wendy was being very unpleasant and argumentative. Why not just stop talking to her? It takes two to argue. And who drops a disabled person off alone, anyway? Well, not alone, but still.

Chad Noe- Maybe in a "drunken stupor" I bragged about it. Don't they say drunk people reveal their true selves? If anything, his statement makes him look more guilty.

This is a case where all signs point to the 3 scumbags for either participating in the kidnapping/killing/burying of those poor women and the covering up of it (getting rid of evidence and lying about their involvement or what they know).

Or the police botched the investigation and don't want to admit it.

88keys, did you read on here where Chad Noe's mom and grandma were arrested a couple years ago, and did about 6 months in prison for felony arson? I think that family is capable of anything and I think they killed all three of the victims in this case.

I did notice that Spike edited out the part that RS said at the end of the original airing about someone spotting Cynthia a while after their disappearance. RS said police thought the sighting was credible which I never understood. Maybe they no longer think that.

My fear is that they killed the two adults and spared Cynthia for a crueler fate, but that's just a guess.

Oh yeah, Cori, I forgot... It's also said that the two women forced young girls into prostitution. I can't remember if they were ever charged or if it was just an allegation. Do you recall?

Oh yeah, Cori, I forgot... It's also said that the two women forced young girls into prostitution. I can't remember if they were ever charged or if it was just an allegation. Do you recall?

All I know is they were said to have done some trafficking of young girls, and the remains of three "women" were found in the pond. (WHY has there been NOTHING else on that?) From that I thought, gosh, what if they kept Cynthia alive for years, then killed and placed her in the pond with the others after she was no longer useful to them? :(

bumping this thread....

Chad Noe....schtupping a minor in the hospital hallway.

Now that's Klassy.

bumping this thread....

Chad Noe....schtupping a minor in the hospital hallway.

Now that's Klassy.

The thought of Chad Noe schtupping anyone makes me shudder. Maybe he was looking for his intellectual equal...then realize he can't f**k tree sloths.

bumping this thread....

Chad Noe....schtupping a minor in the hospital hallway.

Now that's Klassy.
Chad Noe is the classiest individual in the history of UM, don't cha know? :D

Are there any updates to the "alleged" discovery of the bones? The "discovery" of the bones happened over three years ago now! Did authorities just make up the whole story? As if the victims' families have not gone through enough grief already, now it seems authorities are just adding insult to injury. I have a good feeling that the authorities don't seem to care about this case, and never did when it happened. The only thing I don't know is why that is.

bodies in a well....FBI or whoever has that case is incompitent

Does anyone know if Ida, Chad, or Beverly took polygraph tests. That's one thing about UM that I never liked... Sometimes they would mention that a person took/or refused to take a polygraph, and sometimes they wouldn't. I highly doubt that this crazy family would, but it would be interesting.

In my opinion, if this family had nothing to do with it and nothing to hide, go take the test... Anytime someone refuses, I question their motives. Anyway, very very sad case. I can't believe Wendy went through three years of extreme physical therapy to get herself back to health, only to be murdered. That is jsut very sick.

Does anyone know if Ida, Chad, or Beverly took polygraph tests. That's one thing about UM that I never liked... Sometimes they would mention that a person took/or refused to take a polygraph, and sometimes they wouldn't. I highly doubt that this crazy family would, but it would be interesting.

In my opinion, if this family had nothing to do with it and nothing to hide, go take the test... Anytime someone refuses, I question their motives. Anyway, very very sad case. I can't believe Wendy went through three years of extreme physical therapy to get herself back to health, only to be murdered. That is jsut very sick.

this is a touchy subject. everyone has a right. but often times refusal of polygraph cues police in on suspect...gives them a direction. on the surface its very pc to say this or that. bottom line is, police do notice.

Anyway, very very sad case. I can't believe Wendy went through three years of extreme physical therapy to get herself back to health, only to be murdered. That is jsut very sick.

Yes, very true...totally agree. Even sadder is that Chad Noe and company are still living free. I seriously think that the police in the town are morons, because no idiot like Chad Noe could get away with this. Someone mentioned earlier in this thread that remains of some women were found in the area...any update to this?

I am a friend of lakeboy and just had to post something here. He just showed me the video of Wendy Camp on youtube and my initial question was, why did they drive from Shamrock to Cushing via such a long route? They drove all the way into Edmund or Oklahoma City for what reason? I looked it up on google maps and its 25 minutes from Shamrock to Cushing, but to add in OK City, thats another 2 plus hours! What was in OK City and why the detour? Thanks!

Also, as a fan of "Lie to Me", I was watching Noe's facial expressions, and his lip licking was an subconscious attempt to keep from smiling when he was talking about he would never kill them. Also, Camp's second husband showed signs of deception or being unsure when he raised his eyebrow talking about the molestation. Anyone else find the body language of the Grandma and Noe strange?

I can't believe there are no updates to this case. This was one of the saddest cases on um. Three people disappear and so many people hurt. I feel that Chad noe killed them with help from his family. Out there someone knows what happen but who knows if this will ever be solved.

I can't believe there are no updates to this case. This was one of the saddest cases on um. Three people disappear and so many people hurt. I feel that Chad noe killed them with help from his family. Out there someone knows what happen but who knows if this will ever be solved.

1. This case can be solved if the bodies are found. The bodies are evidence waiting to be discovered.

2. Their ARE people that no about the crime...the problem is that they are all releated to Chad Noe.:mad:

Also, as a fan of "Lie to Me", I was watching Noe's facial expressions, and his lip licking was an subconscious attempt to keep from smiling when he was talking about he would never kill them. Also, Camp's second husband showed signs of deception or being unsure when he raised his eyebrow talking about the molestation. Anyone else find the body language of the Grandma and Noe strange?

1. Or it could be that they were nervous being in front of a camera in front of millions of people. Keep in mind that these are non-actors that are being put in front of the camera for the first time.

2. Beware of observing the facial behavior of elderly people. They tend to have naturally bizarre facial behavior.

3. Dry mouth and lips is a common ailment that affects public speakers. Chad probably just lost moisture in his mouth.

There have been several rumors about the Noe family regarding this case. There were some who said that Ida, the woman who supposedly dropped off Wendy and the other two girls, was having an affair with the chief of police. A few weeks later, her husband was murdered and she collected life insurance on him. Rumors of a possible "Dixie Mafia" that they all belong to, etc...

I read somewhere on here that now that Ida and Beverly have been arrested for arson, whatever "pull" they had within the local law enforcement must now be gone or else they would have been arrested. This just isn't the case. They were arrested for Arson by the FBI. These two were setting fire to every place they lived in, in order to collect the insurance money on the house, therefore the feds jumped in. They have since been released from prison and are on probation. Just a very weird case, especially considering Chad Noe admitted to the murders to someone at a bar and doesnt deny doing it!!

We seem to all be in agreement that Chad Noe and his family are responsible for the murders of Wendy Camp, her daughter and sister in law. What does everyone think happened to them? How do you think they were murdered and why? After all, she did in fact see her son that day and was on the way back home when all hell broke loose and they disappeared. Could something have happened in the car that set this off or was it all pre-planned? What do you guys think?

First thing I would like to offer my condolences to the family member though its almost 3 years since she last posted here.

Well, Hambone, there can be no definite answer to your ques since nobody has them but Chad and his family.

But if they were indeed murdered, it aint too hard to think how either.

Wendy is suffering from MS and Cynthia is only a child; they couldnt offer any resistance whatsoever if they were attacked. The only one who could put up any form of fight within the three was only Lisa.

Even so, it wont be too much of a task for Ida, Beverly and Chad to overcome just one person.

The reason why Chad's family cannot be indicted is because there is no proof to indicate a crime even taking place.


So far the three of them can only be listed as missing.


Without any hard evidence such as a body, blood or any practical gain that Chad's family seemingly will receive upon the three's disappearance, any perceptions on foul play are just mere speculation; the police cant really do anything here..


It seems that Chad and his family got away with murder. :mad:

Wendy's sister is such a nice lady. She has posted on here before and will openly give out her email address and encourage you to email her and talk about the case with her. She alluded to some things in her posts on this board that could be the reasons why this case has never been solved. She alleged (however true or untrue it may be, its still worth a mention) that Chad Noe and his family are connected to something called the Dixie Mafia and that Chad's grandma or aunt (cant remember which one) was having an affair with the chief of police which may answer the question of why this case has been forgotten about with the local LE. I'm not saying any of this is true and that these are the reasons, but it seems to fit.

Does anyone know what happened with the story of bones being found near a pond that started this thread? I'm assuming they weren't the bones of Wendy, her daughter and sister in law.

The reason why Chad's family cannot be indicted is because there is no proof to indicate a crime even taking place.

So far the three of them can only be listed as missing.

Without any hard evidence such as a body, blood or any practical gain that Chad's family seemingly will receive upon the three's disappearance, any perceptions on foul play are just mere speculation; the police cant really do anything here..

It seems that Chad and his family got away with murder. :mad:

I wonder what happened to the car that everyone was traveling in? Did the police ever get a warrant to process the car for evidence? Perhaps the attack (which led up to the murders) started in the car and blood splatters could of been found in there.

Well, nobody knows.

As I afore-mentioned, there is no proof to indicate a crime occured.

Thats the sad thing about the law. No crime = No case.

So, I wonder the possibility of the issue of a warrant since there aint no supposed crime.

However, if the Noes killed them, I highly doubt that the three were assaulted in the car.

From the sudden invitation to the end disappearance of Wendy and the other two, it was a top to bottom premeditated plan to murder, so the Noes had it all mapped out, they wouldnt be so dumb to attack them and allow incriminating evidence to be left inside.


Even if there were any, they had 10+ years to wipe clean every single molecule thats in the car that would ever implicate them. The car could very well be scrapped by now as far as we know.

Well, nobody knows.

As I afore-mentioned, there is no proof to indicate a crime occured.

Thats the sad thing about the law. No crime = No case.

So, I wonder the possibility of the issue of a warrant since there aint no supposed crime.

However, if the Noes killed them, I highly doubt that the three were assaulted in the car.

It was a top to bottom premeditated plan to murder, so the Noes had it well planned, at least on the disposing of the bodies part..

Wendy's sister mentioned that the Noe family was involved in the Dixie Mafia, whatever that is. If this is true, then what I think happened is that Chad Noe got upset at Wendy for whatever reason, maybe he just wanted to have his son to himself and Wendy at all, so he may have orchestrated his son to see his mother one last time, then have his grandma drive them out to where these "Mafia" people are to kill them and dispose of the bodies. I dont think he counted on having two extra people with her though.

It was orchestrated IMO. The links they have with the Mafia (alleged I know). And come on, Chad Noe has admitted in a drunken state that he killed them and he doesn't deny it while sober. Alcohol brings the TRUTH out more than anything. Have 10 beers and you may as well inject the guy with truth serum as far as I am concerned.

One thing puzzles me here. I know Ida is hated around here and she was an old prude. But she claims she was dropped off at home correct? Well if they were going from Shamrock to OKC, where does Ida live? Granted, she was apparently the only one in the car that was willing to tell the story so maybe she was never dropped off, but if she was, where was it she claims she was dropped off? Where does she live?

I just think it is possible that Ida - grouch that she may be - may not have been around for the killings. She might know more than meets the eye but I've always thought they would have kept her out of it. She was a crusty old prude in the segment but she seemed to stay strong in her story body language wise.

Another thing is puzzling. How did they kill them? If we are to assume that they had co-operation with some unsavoury characters how would they get them out of the car without leaving evidence behind? Wouldn't Wendy get suspicious if she saw Beverly pulling off into a deserted area? There would likely be a struggle to get them out of the car. Blood left behind etc.

Also did they think of another possibility? I did not know Wendy, but the woman was young and on her third marriage. And Leon Camp hardly seems like a prize himself. Is there more to Wendy that we don't know? Was she a very difficult person to deal with? To communicate with? Why I ask this is because if Ida is telling the truth about a verbal brawl then is it possible that there was someone in that car who snapped and went too far physically? Therefore having to cover it up.

Another thing is puzzling. How did they kill them? If we are to assume that they had co-operation with some unsavoury characters how would they get them out of the car without leaving evidence behind? Wouldn't Wendy get suspicious if she saw Beverly pulling off into a deserted area? There would likely be a struggle to get them out of the car. Blood left behind etc.

Also did they think of another possibility? I did not know Wendy, but the woman was young and on her third marriage. And Leon Camp hardly seems like a prize himself. Is there more to Wendy that we don't know? Was she a very difficult person to deal with? To communicate with? Why I ask this is because if Ida is telling the truth about a verbal brawl then is it possible that there was someone in that car who snapped and went too far physically? Therefore having to cover it up.

I personally think that one of two things happened.

1. Something may have happened in the car and someone went to far, most likely injuring Wendy. I also tend to think there was a gun or weapon in the car that was held on the other family members. I think they went to a remote location and killed each one of them, most likely shooting them all and then buried their bodies, just as Chad Noe said in his "drunken stupor".

2. If these Dixie Mafia rumors are true, its also likely that they pre-arranged all of this. They let Jonathan see his mother one last time. They then could have driven them to a remote location where these other "mafia" members were, the mafia members then killed the women and buried all of their bodies.


Are there any other theories out there?

Are there any other theories out there?

An absolute longshot but could Wendy's voice have been disguised when she called Leon her husband? In other words, was Wendy dead when she made this apparent call to Leon at 4:45pm? I know Leon would know his own wife's voice but could it be that they never left that house and went home? The fake call comes in and that bides them more time? It would have to be someone who can do a brilliant impersonation. Just a thought. I doubt it too.

An absolute longshot but could Wendy's voice have been disguised when she called Leon her husband? In other words, was Wendy dead when she made this apparent call to Leon at 4:45pm? I know Leon would know his own wife's voice but could it be that they never left that house and went home? The fake call comes in and that bides them more time? It would have to be someone who can do a brilliant impersonation. Just a thought. I doubt it too.

I was also wondering if she made the phone call with a gun to her head. She was told to tell her husband everything was fine when it really wasn't.

I was also wondering if she made the phone call with a gun to her head. She was told to tell her husband everything was fine when it really wasn't.

I doubt it. Wendy's sister has written on here before and she said not only did Wendy call her husband late that afternoon, but she also called her mother. I doubt they would have let her make two phone calls under duress. They may have been afraid that she would have blurted something out real quick.

...They may have been afraid that she would have blurted something out real quick.

If Wendy had a gun to her head, I doubt she would risk her life by blurting something out.

If Wendy had a gun to her head, I doubt she would risk her life by blurting something out.

If she had a gun to her head in the first place, she had to know that they were going to kill her eventually.

If she had a gun to her head in the first place, she had to know that they were going to kill her eventually.

Well just a far off theory. Stranger things have happened. Maybe they threated to kill Leon if she spoke up in that scenario. But in all reality when Wendy made that call she probably felt safe and had no idea what was coming.

I am one who personally thinks Ida wasn't involved in the killings (I think she really did get out of the car when she did and just doesn't want to ask questions about it). She is Chad's grandmother so if he was 25-30 years old at that time then she would be 65-70 minimum. Something tells me an elderly woman would be no good in that situation. Too much could happen in a struggle with her, a heart attack, a stroke and let's not forget she dies first so maybe a death bed confession.

But how much was Wendy and Chad's son questioned? I know he wasn't very old, but how much insight could be provide on this case. Would he be able to recognize some hostile treatment towards his mom. Would he remember who got in the car with her? Would he remember who was babysitting him when they drove away. Put it this way, if Ida was watching him, that contradicts her story. I've always wondered how much that kid knew

If she had a gun to her head in the first place, she had to know that they were going to kill her eventually.

Not necessarily.

Holding a gun to someone's head to make them do something- call someone, for example- has been done before. Wendy may have thought that if she cooperated they wouldn't kill her.

I don't know that this really happened here, as it doesn't seem to serve a purpose. But Chad doesn't look like he's the smartest potato chip in the bag.

But how much was Wendy and Chad's son questioned? I know he wasn't very old, but how much insight could be provide on this case. Would he be able to recognize some hostile treatment towards his mom. Would he remember who got in the car with her? Would he remember who was babysitting him when they drove away. Put it this way, if Ida was watching him, that contradicts her story. I've always wondered how much that kid knew

According to Wendy's sister, Jonathan (Wendy's son) was wanting to be interviewed on the 15th anniversary of her disappearance when a local tv station was going to do a piece on Wendy's disappearance. However, when they came to interview him, Chad and his family told the reporters that Jonathan was "mentally ********" and wouldn't be of any help. Wendy's sister claims that Jonathan is not ******** and that this was just another way to block anything from turning up.

Well perhaps when Jonathan is 18 (shouldn't he be already) he can do what he wishes and get away from his toxic family.

According to Wendy's sister, Jonathan (Wendy's son) was wanting to be interviewed on the 15th anniversary of her disappearance when a local tv station was going to do a piece on Wendy's disappearance. However, when they came to interview him, Chad and his family told the reporters that Jonathan was "mentally ********" and wouldn't be of any help. Wendy's sister claims that Jonathan is not ******** and that this was just another way to block anything from turning up.

SHouldn't he be able to do that already? Its his choice. There was never any mention of him being mentally challenged or autistic or anything like that. Nothing. Man, the circumstantial evidence just keeps piling up in this case. I often wonder if Ida Prewitt is still alive or not. I know there was at least one daughter who thought her dad did it. The "Skull Duggery" case of a wife's skull showing up in a garden.

SHouldn't he be able to do that already? Its his choice. There was never any mention of him being mentally challenged or autistic or anything like that. Nothing. Man, the circumstantial evidence just keeps piling up in this case.


Your right, but keep in mind that most likely, Jonathan has been fed lies by his dad's side of the family his entire life. He was probably told that his mother abandoned him or other crazy stories, therefore he grew up thinking this was true. He may not care about his mother's disappearance because of this.

Your right, but keep in mind that most likely, Jonathan has been fed lies by his dad's side of the family his entire life. He was probably told that his mother abandoned him or other crazy stories, therefore he grew up thinking this was true. He may not care about his mother's disappearance because of this.

Yeah the kid may not be able to see the forest through the trees. But at the same time, it's hardly consensus that she just got up and abandoned him. I don't even think the Noe family would say that. I think it's almost unanimous that they were murdered. So that alone might get the kid curious. Someday I'm sure he'll want to know his roots

Yeah the kid may not be able to see the forest through the trees. But at the same time, it's hardly consensus that she just got up and abandoned him. I don't even think the Noe family would say that. I think it's almost unanimous that they were murdered. So that alone might get the kid curious. Someday I'm sure he'll want to know his roots

Judging from comments by Wendy's sister, and this isnt meant mean, but Jonathan isnt the sharpest tack in the box. I doubt he really thinks about it much and if he does, he probably knows what happened but the only family he knows is that of his father and his father's family, which are the people that killed Wendy. He probably doesnt know what to do if he does indeed know what happened or suspect what happened.

Not necessarily.

Holding a gun to someone's head to make them do something- call someone, for example- has been done before. Wendy may have thought that if she cooperated they wouldn't kill her.

I don't know that this really happened here, as it doesn't seem to serve a purpose. But Chad doesn't look like he's the smartest potato chip in the bag.

What I meant by my original comment was that if she had a gun to her head by Chad or his family (someone she knows and can identify easily to police), then she had to know something bad was about to happen. If someone you knows puts a gun to your head and is instructing you to do things, I highly doubt they are gonna make nice later and take you out to dinner. If in fact a gun was held on her, given the past history between Chad's family and Wendy, she had to know they were going to kill her.

Plus I personally believe they were letting Jonathan see his mother one last time before they killed her. Leon even says that when Chad called that day and offered to let her see her son, Wendy was shocked and so was Leon. That's why Leon had his sister go with her.

Another thing is puzzling. How did they kill them? If we are to assume that they had co-operation with some unsavoury characters how would they get them out of the car without leaving evidence behind? Wouldn't Wendy get suspicious if she saw Beverly pulling off into a deserted area? There would likely be a struggle to get them out of the car. Blood left behind etc.

Also did they think of another possibility? I did not know Wendy, but the woman was young and on her third marriage. And Leon Camp hardly seems like a prize himself. Is there more to Wendy that we don't know? Was she a very difficult person to deal with? To communicate with? Why I ask this is because if Ida is telling the truth about a verbal brawl then is it possible that there was someone in that car who snapped and went too far physically? Therefore having to cover it up.

These are good points.

My first question would be, if this was orchestrated, and they did indeed kill Wendy, her daughter and her sister in law, why not kill Leon as well? Killing him would have put to rest alot of the questions about the disappearance. All three women were directly related to Leon. His wife, daughter and sister. Surely they had to think he would raise hell and accuse them to no end. However, if Chad's family does indeed have Mafia ties and the police in their pocket, they probably wouldn't worry about it.

As to your second point about maybe something happened in the car. I don't think anything happened in the car because there were 5 people in the car and the car wasn't very big either. It would be pretty hard to inadvertently kill Wendy, then kill both her daughter and sister in law while maintaining control of the car and not leaving any evidence behind.

Wendy did confirm in her last phone call to Leon that they were about be heading home, which is to suggest that she had already seen her son Jonathan. One of the first time I saw this segment, I thought that maybe they lured Wendy with the thought of her seeing Jonathan, then driving her out to some remote place and killed her. However, Wendy's phone call suggests that she did indeed see her son. That is, if you believe the phone calls were legit and not forced or staged. I think one possibility is that the three women were drugged. Maybe they stopped through McDonald's to get a drink and Chad's family putting sleeping pills or something in their drinks to knock them out. This would explain no evidence being found in the car. They could have driven them out to the middle of nowhere and killed them while they were incapacitated and then buried them. That's just my two cents.

Also, does anyone remember exactly what Chad Noe said during his "drunken stupor" about killing Wendy? Did he give details or just say that he killed them?

According to numbnuts in the segment he said, "Yeah yeah I killed them". No doubt about it Chad and his mother were involved but I'm still on the fence about Ida being directly involved.

Pretty sure this is him...poor kid looks like his Dad...
http://www.facebook.com/noejohnathan?ref=search

I feel really sad his Mother, her sister in law, & Wendy's daughter, are gone. :( out of alot of cases this one really got under my skin for some reason. his Dad from what I've seen and read seems like a lowlife. Ida just seems like a nasty old Witch. I wonder how much if at all does Jonathan know about what happened to them? I really hope this case gets solved.

So was the story in the first post that started this thread a hoax or what?

According to the first post, bones of 3 people were found on private land, but because it was hunting season, the authorities were putting off an investigation, so as to not inconvenience the hunters.

WTH!?

First, it doesn't make any sense to delay an investigation when three dead bodies found together obviously points to murder, and second, "hunting season" is nearly all year long. It just depends on what kind of critter you're hunting. In michigan, deer season alone lasts 3 1/2 months.

Here's a recap of this thread. On 10/17/2005, TrueCrimeJunkie visited here and started this thread with the following information:

I have friend that lives in the Shamrock, OK area where Wendy Camp, her daughter and Lisa Kriegar went missing after making a trip to Shamrock from OKC to visit Wendy's son. Bones were found in a pond located on private property in the Drumright/Shamrock area. Bones are those thought to be Wendy Camp, her daughter and Lisa Kriegar. An investigation is under way to determine more information as to what happened. It has been rumored that Chad Noe killed them and placed them in pond and had help.

10/17/2005 - The receptionist at our dr's office is the one that told me of the discovery and it was made the weekend of the 8th of October. The FBI has been notified are investigating. The remarks that were heard in the bar back when this initially happened were that they would never find them. The pond they were found in is in a backwoods hard to find location. It's so scary knowing they were dumped on my friends property.

10/17/2005 - When this all happened I was 14 yrs old and I remember it being big news. People in Chandler at the Walmart said that they seriously doubted that they had been dropped off. That is something that would have been noticable due to Wendy being afflicted with MS. I remember that Chad had been a suspect all along. I seriously doubt that he will ever be charged in this crime. He would have had to have help, for that would be too much for one person to handle.

11/9/2005 - (Mr. Clairvoyant posts to say that he recently went to OK and found no info on this discovery of three skeletons reported locally.)

11/11/2005 - At this time, I still have not heard any more about the discovery of the bones. I was told because it is private property that is used for hunting, that an investigation is on hold till the season is over. Sounds weird to me, but this area is so small and murder is so rare, the law may not know what to do. Very strange. I'll keep you updated as I learn more.

1/2/2006 - As of now, I have not heard anything more about the bones. I have never heard any news reports or read any newspaper with any info. I was told by the owner of this property that they found the bones of these 3 women and yet nothing more about it. I find it odd. I was also told that after the women went missing that the brother of Chad Noe was in the local bar boasting about they (Law Enforcement) would never find the bodies. Very odd and very scary to know nothing is being done about it.

Pretty sure this is him...poor kid looks like his Dad...
http://www.facebook.com/noejohnathan?ref=search

Does anyone else think we should send him a link to the segment?

I just read through several pages of a thread on Web Sleuths. It spans a few years, just like this one.

They have the same info we do regarding the "bone discovery" and it looks like they got the story from here. There's no other info posted that supports the discovery of bones or the suspicion of remains being linked to Wendy and her family.

The WS thread links back here as a reference for information on the skeletal remains, but after that, it's a dead end. A few years ago, a WS member suggested that Wendy's sister come here to contact the OP.

From a google search, I can't find anything about bones being discovered. Nothing about it is mentioned on the charley project or doe network pages regarding this case. It seems that the person who posted here a few years ago is the only one with this information. At this point, I have to think it's all just gossip and a wild goose chase.

I just read through several pages of a thread on Web Sleuths. It spans a few years, just like this one.

They have the same info we do regarding the "bone discovery" and it looks like they got the story from here. There's no other info posted that supports the discovery of bones or the suspicion of remains being linked to Wendy and her family.

The WS thread links back here as a reference for information on the skeletal remains, but after that, it's a dead end. A few years ago, a WS member suggested that Wendy's sister come here to contact the OP.

From a google search, I can't find anything about bones being discovered. Nothing about it is mentioned on the charley project or doe network pages regarding this case. It seems that the person who posted here a few years ago is the only one with this information. At this point, I have to think it's all just gossip and a wild goose chase.

Seems to me thr bones found were that of some male hikers or local guys. thought i read that some time ago online.

Seems to me thr bones found were that of some male hikers or local guys. thought i read that some time ago online.

Do you have any information that would help me find a report about that? I've been doing google searches using the words Drumright, Shamrock, OK, Wendy, bones, skeleton, hiker, found.... etc, and all I keep getting is links to here and the websleuths discussion, plus all the other odd stuff that shows up in search results.

The Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation still lists Wendy Camp as missing, nothing said about any bodies being found. http://www.ok.gov/osbi/Investigative/Unsolved_Cases/

thats because the bones weren't them. or they would have said so. i wish i coulsd remember where i read about them at.

thats because the bones weren't them. or they would have said so. i wish i coulsd remember where i read about them at.

Right, I understand that it's not them, I was just trying to do a search for something like "unidentified skeletal remains found in Oklahoma" in order to find a news story about the discovery.

I'm not trying to link the bones to the Wendy Camp disappearance, I'm trying to find out if there were ever 3 dead people found together, as the person in the original post stated.

Since you said that you remembered something about these people being found dead, I was hoping that you could remember what city it happened in, or if they were hunters, hikers, homicide victims, etc, so that could help narrow down the search terms.

Does anyone else think we should send him a link to the segment?
Go for it

Pretty sure this is him...poor kid looks like his Dad...
http://www.facebook.com/noejohnathan?ref=search


Do we even know if that's him? His profile is on friends only so we can't even see where he's from to validate it. However, if it is him, I second the idea of someone sending him a link to this story.

In some ways, I think this case is like the abducted Baskin kids. Chad Noe got custody of the son he had with Wendy (but then it appears he didn't really bother raising him and handed the child off to others.)

Since the boy was so young when his mother went missing, and the fact that he was subsequently raised by people who seemed to hate Wendy, isn't it possible that, like the Baskin kids, he's been taught lies or negative things about Wendy that would make him not have any interest in finding the biological mother who "abandoned" him, or even reading about her side of the story?

I wonder if he even knows that Wendy, her daughter, and her sister in law went missing on the very day that Wendy was to finally have a visitation with him? He was so young, he could have been told any kind of story about when/where she went missing. However, if I were in this young man's situation, the coincidence of the timing of the disappearances would definitely make me want to know more about a possible connection to a deadly family feud.

I'm pretty sure it's him. He spells his name in an odd way, and the pic he had as his profile pic a few days ago was a dead ringer for his father.

Regarding some earlier posts a few pages back - I agree that as much of a crotchety, insensitive old grouch that Ida Pruitt comes across as, I don't think she had an active part in the (probable) murders. That's not to say she didn't have some knowledge of what they were planning to do, though.

I'll have to rewatch the segment, but I know one point they were discussing was that given the timeline, it would've been impossible to make the trip they were planning (i.e. to return Wendy, Lisa and Cynthia back home, then for Beverly to meet Chad back closer to home) which I agree with.

What's the last time Wendy was 100% confirmed alive? I never thought of the idea of someone impersonating her and/or a gun being at her head at that moment, but it's possible. Not that Leon would remember exactly all these years later, but I'm sure if there was any distress in her voice, he would've picked up on it and asked if everything was ok, etc.

I don't buy the Walmart story, they probably were never there in the first place, although most likely it's in the area with whatever happened to them, so they probably used it as a diversion.

P.S. It's so weird to hear Walmart mentioned in that context, because it so doesn't seem like an 80s place (though I believe it was around in the Midwest before it caught on elsewhere). The first one I went to was built in '93 or 94 and back then it was like a total novelty (even in a metro area, lol). It didn't even become global (like the way McDonald's is) until the early-mid 2000s.

In some ways, I think this case is like the abducted Baskin kids. Chad Noe got custody of the son he had with Wendy (but then it appears he didn't really bother raising him and handed the child off to others.)

Since the boy was so young when his mother went missing, and the fact that he was subsequently raised by people who seemed to hate Wendy, isn't it possible that, like the Baskin kids, he's been taught lies or negative things about Wendy that would make him not have any interest in finding the biological mother who "abandoned" him, or even reading about her side of the story?

I wonder if he even knows that Wendy, her daughter, and her sister in law went missing on the very day that Wendy was to finally have a visitation with him? He was so young, he could have been told any kind of story about when/where she went missing. However, if I were in this young man's situation, the coincidence of the timing of the disappearances would definitely make me want to know more about a possible connection to a deadly family feud.

Actually, looking back at the earlier threads, this is what Wendy Camp's sister had to say about Jonathan today:

"Johnathan has a really bad learning disability, he has NO co-ordination, and he is sweet as can be, but just not really "there" like you would expect."

So I guess he may not have inherited his family's evil and mean-spirited side, but I'm sure being raised in that environment has had a lot of negative effects on him.

Here is what I find odd about this case: on the one hand, as some have suggested, looked at one way, it can seem like this was all part of a meticulous plot to kill Wendy Camp from the beginning. After months of objecting to visits from Wendy, suddenly Chad calls up and says not only can you visit, but I'll send my mother out to get you. Strange.

On the other hand, if this was a plan, it was a bad plan. First of all, simply by sending a car out to get her, Chad Noe and family have established, beyod a shadow of a doubt, who she was with in the hours leading up to her disappearance. If she doesn't come back from this little trip, suspiscion will immediately fall upon Chad and his family - if the intent all along was to kill Wendy, why make it so obvious?

And why let Wendy call when she gets there, and call again when she leaves? It could be that both calls were hoaxes, that someone among Chad's family/inner circle was capable of immitating Wendy's voice that completely, but... c'mon. That is more of a movie plot point than something that can be so easily carried off in real life (I can see Chad's mother putting a napking over the talk-piece of the phone right now, and - voila! - magically she sounds just like Wendy). And, apparently, Wendy called not only her husband, but her Mom, at 4:45 when she was leaving, so it makes this voice imitation theory even less likely.

What all this tells me is that Hambone, in his post above, is decidedly correct: Chad and his family let Wendy visit with Jonathan that day. Which further suggests to me that if Chad, et. al, did murder Wendy, Cynthia, and Renee, that was not the original intent of the day. Why bring her out, have her visit, then kill her? I suppose you might say, "To let Jonathan see her one last time," but man, that is cold-blooded. More, if the plan was to murder Wendy all along, why didn't Beverly, Chad's Mom, object or try to stop Wendy from bringing Cynthia, or talk Renee, Leon's sister, out of coming? If Chad's plan was to murder Wendy all along, I would wager his mother didn't know about it - otherwise, she would have tried to reduce the number of people going along with Wendy that day. The segment tells us that Renee going was Leon's idea, and was cooked up between the time Chad called Wendy that morning and invited her to see Jonathan and the time Beverly arrived to pick Wendy up. So, there is no way Chad and company could have known, prior to Beverly's arrival, that Leon's sister was coming along for the trip. Further, I wonder if they knew or realized that Wendy would bring her daughter - her 6 year old daughter - with her to visit her son. I can't imagine it was part of the plan to kill a 6 year old child as part of this plot.

No, it seems to me that the decision to kill Wendy must have come some time during this trip, not as part of a plan from the very beginning. The question, of course, is when would that have occurred? And what could have turned things so sour during this three-hour visit to cause Chad et. al. to decide to murder these three?

A fair question at this point also is: what was the motive for these killings? Chad had custody of the child, and had demonstrated previously an ability to avoid visitations from Wendy. Triple homicide seems like a drastic an unnecessary step for him.

If Wendy's call back to her husband was genuine, which I believe it was, then she must have been murdered out on the road somewhere. What makes this all the more perplexing is that, assuming Wendy's call was genuine, Chad wasn't in the car with Wendy, Cynthia, Renee, or his mother as they left Chad's town that day. Isn't that strange? I suppose the murders might have happened within moments of Wendy hanging up the phone with her husband/mother, but again, that is awfully risky - it would make it far too obvious what had happened to her and her companions. The whole episode suggests to me that Wendy, Cynthia, and Renee did inded get into Beverly's car, probably with Ida, and they did indeed start driving off together.

This means that Chad had to take a separate car either to follow his mother or to meet her at some pre-arranged kill/dump site. That seems awfully pre-meditated, and yet much of the rest of what transpired that day seems quite the opposite of pre-meditated. Perhaps Wendy et. al. were drugged in the car, and once they were all asleep, Beverly met Chad at some pre-arranged meeting spot out in the backwoods somewhere, where Wendy, Renee, and Cynthia were then killed and buried?

Sorry this post is rambling and disorganized, but what I am leading to is something rather shocking: I don't think the case against Chad is as open and shut as people seem to think it is. I know Chad seems like an awful fellow in the segment. I know the Wal-Mart story simply doesn't add up. I know there is essentially no likelihood these three disappeared together on their own. That seems to leave only one possibility: Chad and his mom, at the very least, murdered these three.

But there seem to me to be significant questions concerning Chad's motive for these killings (killing three people, just to avoid occasional visitations, which he had already demonstrated a skill for avoiding?), his "plan" for doing them (when exactly was it decided that the three must die? Seems not to have been part of the original plan, but, if it was, why make it so obvious to everyone where Wendy et. al. were and who they were with just prior to their disappearances?), his opporunity for doing them (if their plan was to kill her, why on earth would they let Wendy call her husband to tell him she was on her way home? Doesn't make any sense), and, in particular, the nuts and bolts of how these murders were carried out (Chad met his mother somewhere secluded and the two of them killed the three of them there? They were killed before they ever left town? If so, must have happened shortly after Wendy's phone call - but that seems unlikely; and who not only decides to murder a completely innocent 6 year old girl over a custody battle, but enlists his own mother for assistance in doing so?).

I don't like him either, and it would hardly surprise me if Chad did kill the three of them. But honestly, there is a lot here that is weird.

That makes a lot of sense. It does seem weird that they would commit a triple homicide just to avoid the possibility of future visitations with the child.

I don't think the Walmart thing ever happened. On Websleuths, and maybe here too, Wendy's sister said that the Oklahoma authorities (I think the OFBI) have the details of Wendy's last call. It originated somewhere on the opposite side of the expressway than where the WM is located.

If the murders were premeditated, I wonder if maybe the group had conspired to kill Wendy, but then at the last minute, she brought along two other people, one of them being a child, which threw them off their plan. They may have permitted the visit to take place while they discussed whether or not to go ahead and kill Wendy, with the sister in law and little girl being sort of collateral damage.

On the other hand, I can definitely see that ridiculous bunch getting in a argument and just committing murders on the spur of the moment.

Whatever happened, I'm sure that Wendy is dead. Her sister said that she was on medication that she had to take regularly to survive. She could only live two or three days without it. I don't know what it was or what ailment it treated, but Wendy didn't bring the medicine with her that day, indicating that she didn't intend to be away from home any longer than her visit would take.

Excellent points, Mozartpc. You're definitely right that Wendy was the target and they would have no way of knowing about Cynthia or Renee (my bad, I forgot her name since I haven't watch the seg in awhile).

I agree that even for the type of people they are, that does seem uncharacteristic and an awful lot of a length to go through, just for a custody battle that Chad was on the winning end of. Maybe there was some argument during the visitation and it was a spur of the moment thing? Even with as much of an old witch (using the most polite word there, lmao) that Ida was, I'm not sure she's quite capable of murder...and I'm sure at least Renee could've physically defended herself against her, unless of course she had a weapon.

If Beverly and Chad (the most likely suspects) did anything to Renee and Cynthia, it would've probably just been because they were witnesses. I get the feeling Ida was correct about her version of events, that they started arguing in the car and something enraged Beverly enough to decide to do away with them. Even for white trash like them, that seems awfully like an overreaction, but of course I wouldn't put it past them, especially Chad. If that indeed is the case, then ironically Ida asking to be dropped off may have made the situation worse. They might've not gone through with it if she was around. Again, she may have been a cranky, heartless, unpleasant old bag, but I don't see her as being an active participant in the murders, especially to an innocent little kid.

That would also explain the phone calls, which more than likely were genuine and of her own free will, assuming everything was ok. Especially if Wendy also called her mom, which (a) I'm sure if there was a gun pointed at her, they wouldn't have let her make, and (b) wouldn't have thought of it on their own to have Wendy call her.

The whole thing reminds me of the Sammy Wheeler case, actually. Lots of bitterness on all sides, lots of accustaions and counter-accusations, but in the end Wheeler was murdered by some stranger.

The problem with this case is that most of Chad Noe's story is believable, and seems vaguely supported by Wendy's telephone calls, up until 4:45. It could be that Wendy, Cynthia, and Renee were murdered shortly after that time, but in the segment they show Wendy finishing up the call with her husband by saying, "I have to go, Beverly is waiting" or something to that effect. I guess my problem is this: if Wendy, Cynthia, and Renee got into a car with Beverly and Ida, but NOT Chad Noe, as Ida and Chad claimed, the murder plot gets pretty complicated pretty fast. Of course, murder may well still have happened, and Ida or Chad or both could certainly be lying, but again, something doesn't seem quite right.

It would be nice to know where and when Chad and Beverly were next seen after the 4:45 phone calls by Wendy to her husband and mother.

Looking back through this thread, the poster who had registered here claiming* to be Wendy's sister mentioned that Chad didn't really raise Jonathan, but rather left Jonathan off with Beverly to be raised by her; worse, Chad supposedly visited Jonathan a grand total of ONCE following Wendy's disappearance, and, by the time Jonathan was 18 years old, he hadn't seen his father in 10 years.

Assuming this account is even sort of true, it suggests Chad was, at best, a distracted father. Meanwhile, the poster claiming to be Wendy's sister also suggested that Beverly and her mother, Ida, had been involved in some HEAVY stuff, including running an interstate underage prostitution ring. Nonetheless, she was also apparently Jonathan's primary caregiver after Chad won custody.

All this leads me to wonder: who had the greater stake in seeing Jonathan continue to reside with Chad and his family? Chad, the guy who seemed to be only vaguely interested in raising a son in the first place, or Beverly? Would Chad kill three people just to keep a kid he seemed only barely interested in anyway?

Perhaps it was Beverly, and not Chad, who orchestrated this whole thing. She appears to have been more of the criminal mastermind sort (and I use the term "mastermind" very loosely); Chad just seems to have been an all-around screw up.

*- I say the poster "claiming" to be Wendy's sister because I always take such claims on the internet, where people can claim to be whomever they like, with a grain of salt. I am never 100% convinced that a poster who comes on here saying they knew so-and-so or are so-and-so is being completely forthright. That said, the poster who claimed to be Wendy's sister did seem to be knowledgable and genuine.

I don't think anyone on here thinks Chad was any mastermind at all. He was a moron who did what his mother told him to do. I agree that it was his mother's idea, but I think Chad carried out the plan.

Seems to me thr bones found were that of some male hikers or local guys. thought i read that some time ago online.


I read that somewhere, too, and now I can't find it back!

I have friend that lives in the Shamrock, OK area where Wendy Camp, her daughter and Lisa Kriegar went missing after making a trip to Shamrock from OKC to visit Wendy's son. Bones were found in a pond located on private property in the Drumright/Shamrock area. Bones are those thought to be Wendy Camp, her daughter and Lisa Kriegar. An investigation is under way to determine more information as to what happened. It has been rumored that Chad Noe killed them and placed them in pond and had help. :clap:
I don't think Chad Noe acted alone. I believe Beverly who is Chad's mom and Jonathan's grandma was involved. I saw it on the internet that Beverly was arrested for arson.She could have helped bury the bodies or something. Beverly and Chad are not classy people. I think they planned to murder them before they even called to ask Wendy to visit because in the past they had moved, changed their numbers and did all that to sabotage visits and then all the sudden the day of the disappearance no sabotage, seems fishy to me. I believe what you say about the bones being found believed to be Wendy's.

I will start off by saying that IMO Chad is guilty. Hands down, no question. Hang the SOB.

But...

The one thing that I have never really understood about this case is what is the motive? I am sure that given the circumstances there was no insurance policies still in place. Wendy and Chad were no longer related. Chad had full custody of Jonathan and the segment of UM gave no indication that that was going to change at any time. Also if custody were the issue, and Chad killed them because he wanted to make sure he kept his son, then why hasn't he seen much of him since then? If info on this thread is accurate, he hasn't seen much of Jonathan since this happened.

Like I said, I firmly believe that Chad killed the three, but why? It just doesn't make a lot of sense. What was to gain?

PS

My question of motive of course comes with the assumption that the act was premeditated. Which it is likely to have been, hence the sudden "change of heart" by Chad calling and offering to let Wendy see Jonathan that day.

If they got in an argument during the visit or something, then obviously I could see him killing her in "one of his drunken stupers..."

Keep in mind that Chad is the same guy that when his wife became very ill and was hospitalized had the reaction of divorcing her. Great guy huh? I wouldnt put anything past him.

I'm surprised that given such obvious suspects, such an unbelievable narrative from those suspects and given the wealth of evidence that would have been available from the sister's car, that even the Oklahoma police fouled up this case as badly as they have.

The fact that no on saw them alive after they left the house should have been enough for warrant to search the Noe home and the car that they were last seen in. The past history of antagonism and Chad Noe's failure to follow the court-ordered visitation schedule should have been enough hold in him in custody until this matter was sorted out.

The police in this case bungled this from "Go" and have been unable to recover their stride in the time period since then. This case should be taught at police academies as an example of how NOT to investigate a multiple homicide.

I think the motive to murder Wendy would be to just get her out of the picture. Even though Chad had full custody, Wendy was still somewhat in the picture and still would call up to see if she could visit him on a regular basis, and they in their minds they probably saw her as a nuisance. There's no doubt in my mind that this was premeditated which would explain the "change of heart" that Chad had. Renee and Cynthia coming along with Wendy wasn't factored into their sick little plan, so they had to murder them as well to keep quiet IMO. I think Beverly masterminded the whole affair, Chad carried out the murders, and Ida helped cover up the crime in one way or another.

Here is what I find odd about this case: on the one hand, as some have suggested, looked at one way, it can seem like this was all part of a meticulous plot to kill Wendy Camp from the beginning. After months of objecting to visits from Wendy, suddenly Chad calls up and says not only can you visit, but I'll send my mother out to get you. Strange.

On the other hand, if this was a plan, it was a bad plan. First of all, simply by sending a car out to get her, Chad Noe and family have established, beyod a shadow of a doubt, who she was with in the hours leading up to her disappearance. If she doesn't come back from this little trip, suspiscion will immediately fall upon Chad and his family - if the intent all along was to kill Wendy, why make it so obvious?

And why let Wendy call when she gets there, and call again when she leaves? It could be that both calls were hoaxes, that someone among Chad's family/inner circle was capable of immitating Wendy's voice that completely, but... c'mon. That is more of a movie plot point than something that can be so easily carried off in real life (I can see Chad's mother putting a napking over the talk-piece of the phone right now, and - voila! - magically she sounds just like Wendy). And, apparently, Wendy called not only her husband, but her Mom, at 4:45 when she was leaving, so it makes this voice imitation theory even less likely.

What all this tells me is that Hambone, in his post above, is decidedly correct: Chad and his family let Wendy visit with Jonathan that day. Which further suggests to me that if Chad, et. al, did murder Wendy, Cynthia, and Renee, that was not the original intent of the day. Why bring her out, have her visit, then kill her? I suppose you might say, "To let Jonathan see her one last time," but man, that is cold-blooded. More, if the plan was to murder Wendy all along, why didn't Beverly, Chad's Mom, object or try to stop Wendy from bringing Cynthia, or talk Renee, Leon's sister, out of coming? If Chad's plan was to murder Wendy all along, I would wager his mother didn't know about it - otherwise, she would have tried to reduce the number of people going along with Wendy that day. The segment tells us that Renee going was Leon's idea, and was cooked up between the time Chad called Wendy that morning and invited her to see Jonathan and the time Beverly arrived to pick Wendy up. So, there is no way Chad and company could have known, prior to Beverly's arrival, that Leon's sister was coming along for the trip. Further, I wonder if they knew or realized that Wendy would bring her daughter - her 6 year old daughter - with her to visit her son. I can't imagine it was part of the plan to kill a 6 year old child as part of this plot.

No, it seems to me that the decision to kill Wendy must have come some time during this trip, not as part of a plan from the very beginning. The question, of course, is when would that have occurred? And what could have turned things so sour during this three-hour visit to cause Chad et. al. to decide to murder these three?

A fair question at this point also is: what was the motive for these killings? Chad had custody of the child, and had demonstrated previously an ability to avoid visitations from Wendy. Triple homicide seems like a drastic an unnecessary step for him.

If Wendy's call back to her husband was genuine, which I believe it was, then she must have been murdered out on the road somewhere. What makes this all the more perplexing is that, assuming Wendy's call was genuine, Chad wasn't in the car with Wendy, Cynthia, Renee, or his mother as they left Chad's town that day. Isn't that strange? I suppose the murders might have happened within moments of Wendy hanging up the phone with her husband/mother, but again, that is awfully risky - it would make it far too obvious what had happened to her and her companions. The whole episode suggests to me that Wendy, Cynthia, and Renee did inded get into Beverly's car, probably with Ida, and they did indeed start driving off together.

This means that Chad had to take a separate car either to follow his mother or to meet her at some pre-arranged kill/dump site. That seems awfully pre-meditated, and yet much of the rest of what transpired that day seems quite the opposite of pre-meditated. Perhaps Wendy et. al. were drugged in the car, and once they were all asleep, Beverly met Chad at some pre-arranged meeting spot out in the backwoods somewhere, where Wendy, Renee, and Cynthia were then killed and buried?

Sorry this post is rambling and disorganized, but what I am leading to is something rather shocking: I don't think the case against Chad is as open and shut as people seem to think it is. I know Chad seems like an awful fellow in the segment. I know the Wal-Mart story simply doesn't add up. I know there is essentially no likelihood these three disappeared together on their own. That seems to leave only one possibility: Chad and his mom, at the very least, murdered these three.

But there seem to me to be significant questions concerning Chad's motive for these killings (killing three people, just to avoid occasional visitations, which he had already demonstrated a skill for avoiding?), his "plan" for doing them (when exactly was it decided that the three must die? Seems not to have been part of the original plan, but, if it was, why make it so obvious to everyone where Wendy et. al. were and who they were with just prior to their disappearances?), his opporunity for doing them (if their plan was to kill her, why on earth would they let Wendy call her husband to tell him she was on her way home? Doesn't make any sense), and, in particular, the nuts and bolts of how these murders were carried out (Chad met his mother somewhere secluded and the two of them killed the three of them there? They were killed before they ever left town? If so, must have happened shortly after Wendy's phone call - but that seems unlikely; and who not only decides to murder a completely innocent 6 year old girl over a custody battle, but enlists his own mother for assistance in doing so?).

I don't like him either, and it would hardly surprise me if Chad did kill the three of them. But honestly, there is a lot here that is weird.

My theory- I feel chad had divorced wendy and never thought she was going to get out of the coma so he started his whole new life with his new wife and his son. He probably received bickering from his new wife about why his old wife constantly wants to see thier son once she was out of the coma. He most likely had devised a plan to get rid of her once and for all but never anticipated the other two going. I believe he had this job done by someone else otherwise he would have carried this job out long before instead of place resistance to wendy on seeing the son. He had someone who was willing to help him get rid of her, and his mother i believe was only suppose to drive them to the set location. The mother probably didnt want to arouse suspicion and tell the other two not to go as well as not get into the middle of it. so she took them to the location after she allowed wendy to make a few calls. She provided this much at least knowing this would be the last phone conversations and probably encouraged her to call her mother as well. Once she took them to the location, a man was there, perhaps two. and they forced all three into a sepperate car..why? because im thinking that she needed to make it back in a reasonable time frame for the aliby. this is how i feel it went down..the sad part is the mother can hold a straight face knowing that the child is murdered.

My theory- I feel chad had divorced wendy and never thought she was going to get out of the coma so he started his whole new life with his new wife and his son. He probably received bickering from his new wife about why his old wife constantly wants to see thier son once she was out of the coma. He most likely had devised a plan to get rid of her once and for all but never anticipated the other two going. I believe he had this job done by someone else otherwise he would have carried this job out long before instead of place resistance to wendy on seeing the son. He had someone who was willing to help him get rid of her, and his mother i believe was only suppose to drive them to the set location. The mother probably didnt want to arouse suspicion and tell the other two not to go as well as not get into the middle of it. so she took them to the location after she allowed wendy to make a few calls. She provided this much at least knowing this would be the last phone conversations and probably encouraged her to call her mother as well. Once she took them to the location, a man was there, perhaps two. and they forced all three into a sepperate car..why? because im thinking that she needed to make it back in a reasonable time frame for the aliby. this is how i feel it went down..the sad part is the mother can hold a straight face knowing that the child is murdered.

I think your right. Wendy's sister has commented on here before and she alluded to the "Dixie Mafia" in the town/area that this happened. She stated that one of these members of the "Mafia" was sleeping with either Beverly or Ida. I believe that either Beverly or Ida (whichever was having an affair with this guy) recruited this man to kill Wendy Camp and her daughter and sister in law and dispose of their bodies. It was probably originally only supposed to be Wendy but when all three showed up, it threw a wrench in their plans.

I think your right. Wendy's sister has commented on here before and she alluded to the "Dixie Mafia" in the town/area that this happened. She stated that one of these members of the "Mafia" was sleeping with either Beverly or Ida. I believe that either Beverly or Ida (whichever was having an affair with this guy) recruited this man to kill Wendy Camp and her daughter and sister in law and dispose of their bodies. It was probably originally only supposed to be Wendy but when all three showed up, it threw a wrench in their plans.

Sweet Jesus I hope it was Beverly having the affair. I can't conceive why any man would want to bed Ida Pruitt.

Sweet Jesus I hope it was Beverly having the affair. I can't conceive why any man would want to bed Ida Pruitt.

Clearly, you never been to Oklahoma.

Clearly, you never been to Oklahoma.

I'll take that as a good thing. I can't imagine Ida being like the new girl in a whorehouse where everyone wants to screw her, but if she was the one having an affair I sure hope whoever slept with her had poor vision...or a couple of bags.

All I can say is here's a link to some "average" women in Oklahoma (and this is near a large city).
Judge for yourself: http://personals.oodle.com/women-seeking-men/tulsa-ok/age_40_60/?inbs=1&r=100

All I can say is here's a link to some "average" women in Oklahoma (and this is near a large city).
Judge for yourself: http://personals.oodle.com/women-seeking-men/tulsa-ok/age_40_60/?inbs=1&r=100

Four words: Oklahoma, here I come!

Sweet Jesus I hope it was Beverly having the affair. I can't conceive why any man would want to bed Ida Pruitt.


LMAO!!! It was probably both of them. Eeeewwwww

LMAO!!! It was probably both of them. Eeeewwwww

hahaha we all get laughs...oh wow, that website cant be the only singles one that makes all the woman look well...hmm....:lol:

I am not new to this case, I remember watching it when I was home sick from school one day. I used to pretend I was sick sometimes to stay home and watch UM. I am getting into it again, and came across this case on Youtube. I read a lot of the posts here, dating back to the mid 00's. I couldn't find a post that said this case was solved, but could someone just give me an overview on what is recent to the case, and what is going on with it. Now, did the Granny, and the other woman get arrested for something else? Thanks, and I LOVE this site! It's awesome! Thanks for having it here!

when ida prewitt got to bristow with beverly she decided she wanted to go home to shamrock. cynthia had to go to the bathroom when they got there and went in the house. wendy and lisa stayed outside but ida came back out side to empty something she had in a pan and they got to arguing and ida hit wendy with the pan which knocked her out. lisa started screaming because she thought wendy was dead (as did ida, chad and beverly) and chad knew he had to get lisa to be quiet so he stabbed her. they knew they had to do something about cynthia so they killed her too, wrapping her in the bathroom shower curtain. since wendy was to big to put in the car with the other 2 chad borrowed a truck from someone he knew and covered them in the back with something. not knowing for sure when the law would be there he knew he couldn't take them very far so he disposed of them immediately. i think i know where because i grew up in shamrock. i have not lived there in a long time but i believe there are people who really do know what happened. this is just a story but my sister, my daughter, and myself have been having some really weird dreams lately concerning these 2 women and the little girl and i live 600 miles away.

when ida prewitt got to bristow with beverly she decided she wanted to go home to shamrock. cynthia had to go to the bathroom when they got there and went in the house. wendy and lisa stayed outside but ida came back out side to empty something she had in a pan and they got to arguing and ida hit wendy with the pan which knocked her out. lisa started screaming because she thought wendy was dead (as did ida, chad and beverly) and chad knew he had to get lisa to be quiet so he stabbed her. they knew they had to do something about cynthia so they killed her too, wrapping her in the bathroom shower curtain. since wendy was to big to put in the car with the other 2 chad borrowed a truck from someone he knew and covered them in the back with something. not knowing for sure when the law would be there he knew he couldn't take them very far so he disposed of them immediately. i think i know where because i grew up in shamrock. i have not lived there in a long time but i believe there are people who really do know what happened. this is just a story but my sister, my daughter, and myself have been having some really weird dreams lately concerning these 2 women and the little girl and i live 600 miles away.

I'm assuming that you are presenting this as being speculation, correct? Unless you were personally involved in this there would be no way that you would know any of this.

when ida prewitt got to bristow with beverly she decided she wanted to go home to shamrock. cynthia had to go to the bathroom when they got there and went in the house. wendy and lisa stayed outside but ida came back out side to empty something she had in a pan and they got to arguing and ida hit wendy with the pan which knocked her out. lisa started screaming because she thought wendy was dead (as did ida, chad and beverly) and chad knew he had to get lisa to be quiet so he stabbed her. they knew they had to do something about cynthia so they killed her too, wrapping her in the bathroom shower curtain. since wendy was to big to put in the car with the other 2 chad borrowed a truck from someone he knew and covered them in the back with something. not knowing for sure when the law would be there he knew he couldn't take them very far so he disposed of them immediately. i think i know where because i grew up in shamrock. i have not lived there in a long time but i believe there are people who really do know what happened. this is just a story but my sister, my daughter, and myself have been having some really weird dreams lately concerning these 2 women and the little girl and i live 600 miles away.

This is very odd indeed...

when ida prewitt got to bristow with beverly she decided she wanted to go home to shamrock. cynthia had to go to the bathroom when they got there and went in the house. wendy and lisa stayed outside but ida came back out side to empty something she had in a pan and they got to arguing and ida hit wendy with the pan which knocked her out. lisa started screaming because she thought wendy was dead (as did ida, chad and beverly) and chad knew he had to get lisa to be quiet so he stabbed her. they knew they had to do something about cynthia so they killed her too, wrapping her in the bathroom shower curtain. since wendy was to big to put in the car with the other 2 chad borrowed a truck from someone he knew and covered them in the back with something. not knowing for sure when the law would be there he knew he couldn't take them very far so he disposed of them immediately. i think i know where because i grew up in shamrock. i have not lived there in a long time but i believe there are people who really do know what happened. this is just a story but my sister, my daughter, and myself have been having some really weird dreams lately concerning these 2 women and the little girl and i live 600 miles away.

Could you please elaborate further? Seems like you have some sort of connection with this case.

well insight that sounds crazy enough to be true!

when ida prewitt got to bristow with beverly she decided she wanted to go home to shamrock. cynthia had to go to the bathroom when they got there and went in the house. wendy and lisa stayed outside but ida came back out side to empty something she had in a pan and they got to arguing and ida hit wendy with the pan which knocked her out. lisa started screaming because she thought wendy was dead (as did ida, chad and beverly) and chad knew he had to get lisa to be quiet so he stabbed her. they knew they had to do something about cynthia so they killed her too, wrapping her in the bathroom shower curtain. since wendy was to big to put in the car with the other 2 chad borrowed a truck from someone he knew and covered them in the back with something. not knowing for sure when the law would be there he knew he couldn't take them very far so he disposed of them immediately. i think i know where because i grew up in shamrock. i have not lived there in a long time but i believe there are people who really do know what happened. this is just a story but my sister, my daughter, and myself have been having some really weird dreams lately concerning these 2 women and the little girl and i live 600 miles away.

I am 100% positive that you will never post on here again, but can you please tell us how you came across this information? Is this just speculation or do you have some kind of inside knowledge as to what actually happened?

I am 100% positive that you will never post on here again, but can you please tell us how you came across this information? Is this just speculation or do you have some kind of inside knowledge as to what actually happened?

yes do tell? Speculation lead you to the extent of posting such an outlandish tale (true or not)..And I'm really hoping not. I will say for you to provide such gastly details makes me wonder if you event give thought to Wendy's family...

There's one problem I have with this "hypothetical" scenario. How did at least four people (Ida, Lisa, Beverly, and Chad) assume that Ida had enough strength to kill Wendy by hitting her once with a pan? Wouldn't someone have checked her pulse? I know Beverly, Ida, and Chad were trash but they were still capable of committing three murders and covering it up. I just don't see how a "heat of the moment" accident could have resulted in the murder of three people. Why stab Lisa? Wouldn't it be more probable to see if Wendy was still alive, and then call for help? Why turn an assault into a brutal triple homicide? I think this was premeditated, not a spur of the moment kill/s.

There's one problem I have with this "hypothetical" scenario. How did at least four people (Ida, Lisa, Beverly, and Chad) assume that Ida had enough strength to kill Wendy by hitting her once with a pan? Wouldn't someone have checked her pulse? I know Beverly, Ida, and Chad were trash but they were still capable of committing three murders and covering it up. I just don't see how a "heat of the moment" accident could have resulted in the murder of three people. Why stab Lisa? Wouldn't it be more probable to see if Wendy was still alive, and then call for help? Why turn an assault into a brutal triple homicide? I think this was premeditated, not a spur of the moment kill/s.

Exactly. The poster is just speculating (I think). It's a theory, albeit not a very good one either which is why he hasn't posted here since. Ida was an old woman. Wendy didn't look very strong but a frying pan probably won't kill anyone especially coming from the swing of an old lady. Frying pans don't kill people in cartoons OR in real life.

If this were true, the worst thing would that there would be an all out brawl. At teh very worst Ida gets charged with assault. No need to kill a kid and a sister in law.

That being said this is such a disturbing case. No doubt the Noe's know what happened to them. How much they were involved is debatable. I often wonder how Chad and his mother could kill someone so cleanly. These were three human beings. I am assuming Ida wouldn't be a lot of help with a homicide so my theory has always been that they went somewhere and had some "assistants" pick them up. If you have a gun pointed to you, you'll do as you are told.

I've also thought there is the strong possibility that Wendy made that call to Leon under gun point. It's possible.

Chad divorces his wife while she is ill and in the hospital because as he stated, he had one child to deal with and didnt need another. Great guy. Then when Wendy re-marries his mother accuses they new husband of molestation. These people are obviously cold and heartless. Planning and carrying out a murder is not beyond them. Police simply dropped the ball here. They killed them and disposed of the bodies. The only mystery is where the remains are.

Chad divorces his wife while she is ill and in the hospital because as he stated, he had one child to deal with and didnt need another. Great guy. Then when Wendy re-marries his mother accuses they new husband of molestation. These people are obviously cold and heartless. Planning and carrying out a murder is not beyond them. Police simply dropped the ball here. They killed them and disposed of the bodies. The only mystery is where the remains are.

Agreed. And I'll say it again, the police thing is almost a non issue if you believe Wendy's sister when she said that the police helped to cover this up. The police didn't drop the ball, they just looked the other way.

Agreed. And I'll say it again, the police thing is almost a non issue if you believe Wendy's sister when she said that the police helped to cover this up. The police didn't drop the ball, they just looked the other way.
Yes that is what I mean by them dropping the ball. I think there is enough evidence to charge Beverly with murder.

Yes that is what I mean by them dropping the ball. I think there is enough evidence to charge Beverly with murder.

What evidence would you use to charge her with murder? There are no bodies, no murder weapon and the cause of death has not been identified.

I used to think Ida was innocent, but after hearing about her and Beverly being incarcerated I tend to think she was involved as well. I just thought she was a mean old cuss from her interview on UM, but now there's little doubt in my mind that she was involved (if not in the actual murders, the cover up).

What evidence would you use to charge her with murder? There are no bodies, no murder weapon and the cause of death has not been identified.
She was the last person with three people that where never seen again. I know it sounds odd but we had a case near where I live where three women went missing and a man named Richard Grissom was the last person known to be with them. He was tried and convicted of triple homicide with no bodies or murder weapon.

She was the last person with three people that where never seen again. I know it sounds odd but we had a case near where I live where three women went missing and a man named Richard Grissom was the last person known to be with them. He was tried and convicted of triple homicide with no bodies or murder weapon.

The mere fact that Richard Grissom was the last known man to be with those women is certainly not substantial enough for conviction. Grissom was convicted mainly on circumstancial evidence, but it was very strong evidence--the victims' belongings were found in Grissom's possession, to include bank cards that were used after their disappearances. He had also murdered an elderly woman as a juvenile and served a prison term for that crime.

There are no such circumstances surrounding Beverly as far as I know.

I happen to know someone who used to be close to this family and they have told me stories about how the two women killed a man and strung him up in the yard or garage..I can't remember. I have also heard the stories about the prostitution ring. The fact is these people are killers...no motive has to be involved when people are like that. All it has to be is a bad mood or a very small grudge. It so sad they were able get away with most of their crimes.

The mere fact that Richard Grissom was the last known man to be with those women is certainly not substantial enough for conviction. Grissom was convicted mainly on circumstancial evidence, but it was very strong evidence--the victims' belongings were found in Grissom's possession, to include bank cards that were used after their disappearances. He had also murdered an elderly woman as a juvenile and served a prison term for that crime.

There are no such circumstances surrounding Beverly as far as I know.
Really since when can you use a crime committed as a juvenile (or any past convictions) as evidence in another trial? Thats new. Still you have no bodies and the man was given a triple murder conviction.

She was the last person with three people that where never seen again. I know it sounds odd but we had a case near where I live where three women went missing and a man named Richard Grissom was the last person known to be with them. He was tried and convicted of triple homicide with no bodies or murder weapon.

In 1959 in Canada a young Steven Trustcott was the last known person to be seen with 12 year old Lynne Harper while riding his bike. He was sentenced to hang but it was reduced to a 10 year sentence. He always claimed his innocence to this day and went as far as the Government of Canada to completely exhonerate him in 2008. It was sloppy and even lazy police work that was based on assumption. Turns out they were wrong. Bottom line is circumstantial evidence is unlikely to hold up in court. I think the Noe's are responsible but how can we prove it?

The only way is for someone in the family to come forward and testify, but it is too dangerous. There are many members of that family who know the truth about that murder and other crimes and are just way to afraid to say anything. If they did, they would be killed for sure. It's a horrible situation and I couldn't even imagine having to grow up with these murderers like my friend did.

The only way is for someone in the family to come forward and testify, but it is too dangerous. There are many members of that family who know the truth about that murder and other crimes and are just way to afraid to say anything. If they did, they would be killed for sure. It's a horrible situation and I couldn't even imagine having to grow up with these murderers like my friend did.

Really? "Killed for sure?" So no one in this family of criminals has ever gotten jammed up so bad that revealing the murderers of three people wouldn't get them out of it?

Sorry...I'm calling BS on your posting as it simply doesn't fit in w/ human nature. Or...for that matter...reality.

You can think whatever you want, but its true.

Really? "Killed for sure?" So no one in this family of criminals has ever gotten jammed up so bad that revealing the murderers of three people wouldn't get them out of it?

Sorry...I'm calling BS on your posting as it simply doesn't fit in w/ human nature. Or...for that matter...reality.

It's not just these 3 people btw, its the whole family. They are all crooked and crazy. I guess you have never met a family of crooks and crazies but its reality whether you want to believe it or not.

It's not just these 3 people btw, its the whole family. They are all crooked and crazy. I guess you have never met a family of crooks and crazies but its reality whether you want to believe it or not.
I read an article recently in our local paper about this family I beileve the name was "Blair" but could be wrong. Anyhow half the people in this family had been charged or convincted of murder in a ten year period. The reporter was labeling them as the Murderous Blair Family and he had docemented all of the charges and convictions against them. So I do beileve there is such a thing as families that kill. Its not so far fetched in the Camp case.

It's not just these 3 people btw, its the whole family. They are all crooked and crazy. I guess you have never met a family of crooks and crazies but its reality whether you want to believe it or not.

I have no problems believing in a "crazy family." I have serious issues believing that no one in a "crazy family" wouldn't get into a position where giving evidence at trial for three murders would be seen as not being a method to get out of trouble themselves.

My guess is that they have all been involved in some kind of trouble, and to speak up would get them in trouble not only with the police but mafia members and the group Hells Angels. It is a huge ring of people that are criminals.

Really since when can you use a crime committed as a juvenile (or any past convictions) as evidence in another trial? Thats new. Still you have no bodies and the man was given a triple murder conviction.

I did not expressly state that the fact he had murdered another individual as a juvenile was "used as evidence", although it certainly is an aggravating factor and is perfectly acceptable for case building unless ruled otherwise by whomever is presiding. My point is that the man clearly wasn't found guilty because he was the last person known to be with the victims. The notion of a case against Beverly constructed on that basis is even more ludicrous. Law and the carriage of justice are not that oversimplified or hurriedly conclusory, thankfully.
O

My guess is that they have all been involved in some kind of trouble, and to speak up would get them in trouble not only with the police but mafia members and the group Hells Angels. It is a huge ring of people that are criminals.

Really?
Mafia?
In Oklahoma?

Just FYI, the Mafia would have forced Noe and his family to "clean up" the mess they created by having three people disappear. If that meant that one of them would have had to plead guilty, then so be it.

And given the Noe's family's obvious stupidity, I have serious doubts that most criminal organizations would involve them in anything more peripheral criminal activities.

um yes there is Mafia everywhere, and it is widely known that Beverly was sleeping with a member. I think you should read up on the case a little bit. It is also known that her daughter Jackie was involved in the group Hells Angels and is now incarcerated and has to be moved from jail to jail because of it. I do not presume to know everything about this case, all I know is what my family member told me, who used to be close to them (not by choice).
How do you know so much about Mafia whereabouts and procedures?

um yes there is Mafia everywhere, and it is widely known that Beverly was sleeping with a member. I think you should read up on the case a little bit. It is also known that her daughter Jackie was involved in the group Hells Angels and is now incarcerated and has to be moved from jail to jail because of it. I do not presume to know everything about this case, all I know is what my family member told me, who used to be close to them (not by choice).
How do you know so much about Mafia whereabouts and procedures?

My grandfather owned a bar in South Side Chicago. He also ran numbers from the bar and he had a gym w/ club fighters. I've seen Mafia members in the flesh and I have some knowledge of how they operate.

Having said that, I doubt that Mafia members would involve themselves in a triple homicide that would include two children for a family like the Noe's. There simply wouldn't be enough money involved and there would be too much risk killing the children for it to be worthwhile.

I don't know about Hell's Angels, but I would have to imagine that even they would have a hard time killing children if for no other reason than the heat that act would bring upon them. I think that you are forgetting that attention is what most criminals try to avoid. Failing to do so means arrest, imprisonment or something worse.

Since you brought up this angle, the least you can do is to provide some actually PROOF that events occurred in the manner that you described. So far what you've stated sounds like fiction. Bad pulp fiction, in fact.

Ok well I have my own theory about it yes, no I don't have hard facts, if I did, the murder would be solved, I JUST told you all I know is what I was told, and read, just like all the other people on this forum. I just happen to hear the story from a family member who used to be close to the family when she was younger. I have heard that it wasn't the mafia she was sleeping with but the Chief of Police, and that they are affiliated with something called the Dixie Mafia, I know that Beverly burnt down the houses she lived in and collected insurance money until the FBI caught up with them, I know that she also set fire to my family members house in Oklahoma the night before they left and they moved here to Texas. I also THINK that the little girl was most likely put into the prostitution ring that had on the highway at truck stops. It doesn't matter if i'm right or wrong here, what matters is that someone should find someone who IS right, and knows FIRST hand not second or third.

Ok well I have my own theory about it yes, no I don't have hard facts, if I did, the murder would be solved, I JUST told you all I know is what I was told, and read, just like all the other people on this forum. I just happen to hear the story from a family member who used to be close to the family when she was younger. I have heard that it wasn't the mafia she was sleeping with but the Chief of Police, and that they are affiliated with something called the Dixie Mafia, I know that Beverly burnt down the houses she lived in and collected insurance money until the FBI caught up with them, I know that she also set fire to my family members house in Oklahoma the night before they left and they moved here to Texas. I also THINK that the little girl was most likely put into the prostitution ring that had on the highway at truck stops. It doesn't matter if i'm right or wrong here, what matters is that someone should find someone who IS right, and knows FIRST hand not second or third.

I stand by by my earlier call of BS.

On this one, I would have to go with something along the lines of chad and Wendy getting into an argument before the visiting had ended, but after the phone call. Perhaps he hit her or shot her or something to the point of her being dead or at least seriously injured. I would think that the other two, now witnesses, had to be dealt with as well.

Now the mother and new wife (or girlfriend, I can't remember which) help chad to dispose of the bodies somewhere in the area. - as I recall it was brought up on this thread that there were recently 3 bodies found on this families property or very near it.

The whole trip home, arguing in the car and Walmart story, were then fabricated to make it a missing persons search rather than a multiple homicide investigation from the get go.

I don't think there is any real mystery here. If this family indeed had any mafia, outlaw bikers, or corrupt police relations, I think that at the most those connections, if they were indeed called upon for favors, were only asked for help in disposing of the bodies. I admit, I feel this is pretty far fetched though. I think this case and its guilty parties lie within chad's family.

Only other thing I can think of that would have others brought in would be if there were relations to corrupt police, that could have kept the heat off of chad's family.

If the crime were premeditated, I would have to ask, what was the motive? Chad had custody. They were divorced so no insurance money. So a heated argument makes the most sense to me.

Either way, I don't think there is much more to this other than where are their bodies? Chad and his family know the answer to this. If the bodies found were indeed Wendy and her family, then that would pretty well end the matter if they were indeed found on chad's family's property or very near it.

Ok well I have my own theory about it yes, no I don't have hard facts, if I did, the murder would be solved, I JUST told you all I know is what I was told, and read, just like all the other people on this forum. I just happen to hear the story from a family member who used to be close to the family when she was younger. I have heard that it wasn't the mafia she was sleeping with but the Chief of Police, and that they are affiliated with something called the Dixie Mafia, I know that Beverly burnt down the houses she lived in and collected insurance money until the FBI caught up with them, I know that she also set fire to my family members house in Oklahoma the night before they left and they moved here to Texas. I also THINK that the little girl was most likely put into the prostitution ring that had on the highway at truck stops. It doesn't matter if i'm right or wrong here, what matters is that someone should find someone who IS right, and knows FIRST hand not second or third.

KW, this is not inside knowledge. Everything you stated in this post has already been discussed on this board and most it came from Wendy's sister. The Dixie Mafia, burning down the house, sleeping with the chief of police, etc.. all came from Wendy's sister. Are you trying to say this all of this is a theory that you happened to have researched and came to this conclusion? If so, you are lying because as I have said, it has already been discussed.

On this one, I would have to go with something along the lines of chad and Wendy getting into an argument before the visiting had ended, but after the phone call. Perhaps he hit her or shot her or something to the point of her being dead or at least seriously injured. I would think that the other two, now witnesses, had to be dealt with as well.

Now the mother and new wife (or girlfriend, I can't remember which) help chad to dispose of the bodies somewhere in the area. - as I recall it was brought up on this thread that there were recently 3 bodies found on this families property or very near it.

The whole trip home, arguing in the car and Walmart story, were then fabricated to make it a missing persons search rather than a multiple homicide investigation from the get go.

I don't think there is any real mystery here. If this family indeed had any mafia, outlaw bikers, or corrupt police relations, I think that at the most those connections, if they were indeed called upon for favors, were only asked for help in disposing of the bodies. I admit, I feel this is pretty far fetched though. I think this case and its guilty parties lie within chad's family.

Only other thing I can think of that would have others brought in would be if there were relations to corrupt police, that could have kept the heat off of chad's family.

If the crime were premeditated, I would have to ask, what was the motive? Chad had custody. They were divorced so no insurance money. So a heated argument makes the most sense to me.

Either way, I don't think there is much more to this other than where are their bodies? Chad and his family know the answer to this. If the bodies found were indeed Wendy and her family, then that would pretty well end the matter if they were indeed found on chad's family's property or very near it.

I think that you are probably correct. The biggest problem I have w/ it is this: who killed the little girl? Hate to say it, killing Wendy Camp seems to be within the "range of abilities" possessed by the Noe family and even the teenager I could possibly see. Which one of those depraved POS' killed the little girl?

And why wasn't/isn't the death of the child being put forward as a reason or an impetus to solving this heinous crime?

KW, this is not inside knowledge. Everything you stated in this post has already been discussed on this board and most it came from Wendy's sister. The Dixie Mafia, burning down the house, sleeping with the chief of police, etc.. all came from Wendy's sister. Are you trying to say this all of this is a theory that you happened to have researched and came to this conclusion? If so, you are lying because as I have said, it has already been discussed.

Wow, NO I NEVER said I had inside knowledge, ALL I said was that I heard this story from someone who happened to know these people THAT IS ALL, I just put in my theory just like everyone else. What is wrong with that. Everyone else on here can put their theory but not me? WTFE

Wow, NO I NEVER said I had inside knowledge, ALL I said was that I heard this story from someone who happened to know these people THAT IS ALL, I just put in my theory just like everyone else. What is wrong with that. Everyone else on here can put their theory but not me? WTFE

I don't think you're lying, but I don't agree with the theory of the child being forced into prostitution. There's no doubt in my mind that all three of the missing women are dead.

Yea maybe so, it just seems so cruel to murder a child over an argument with the mother. I can't see how anyone could do that. I hope new evidence comes to light soon.

Wow, NO I NEVER said I had inside knowledge, ALL I said was that I heard this story from someone who happened to know these people THAT IS ALL, I just put in my theory just like everyone else. What is wrong with that. Everyone else on here can put their theory but not me? WTFE

I'm not saying you cant have an opinion. What I'm saying is that this story you are giving as coming from someone who knew the Noe's isn't new information. Its the same stuff that has been repeated on this board and this discussion topic several times. Therefore, if you are claiming it as new and original information from a source close to the Noe's, then it may be that to you, but not to everyone else on this board since it has already been mentioned on here numerous times.

Yea maybe so, it just seems so cruel to murder a child over an argument with the mother. I can't see how anyone could do that. I hope new evidence comes to light soon.

The original target in this murder was most likely Wendy. Killing someone over an argument is cold in itself, but then killing another woman and a child because they were potential witnesses makes it that more despicable.

I like what KW is saying. But I must say, it just doesn't make sense that this case would go unsolved this long with those being the facts. Assuming they are connected to the Hells Angels, the Chief of Police, some local hick maifia...those groups aren't big and powerful enough to conceal a secret like this for so long. As mentioned by others, at some point, after all of this time, someone would have talked by now. I think it's as simple as just those 4 knowing what happened and nobody else.

Also, maybe I missed it, but didn't this long thread begin by someone saying they may have found DNA evidence for this case?? What happened with that?

How old was the sister-in-law? I'm curious because it wasn't mentioned in the broadcast. She looked really thin in the photograph and unfortunately, could have probably been easily overpowered, especially with companions of a MS patient and a child, unfortunately. This case infuriates me and I cannot believe it hasn't been solved. I hope that Noe didn't get custody of the son after this, but I think he probably did. What about the testing this thread started with?

the Chief of Police, some local hick maifia

LMAO!!!


Also, maybe I missed it, but didn't this long thread begin by someone saying they may have found DNA evidence for this case?? What happened with that?

Yes, the original poster claimed that bodies had been found near a pond and they were believed to be that of Wendy, her sister in law and daughter. However, Wendy's sister was on here a few years back and disputed that saying that it wasn't the bodies of Wendy and the other two. Its unknown at this point if there were even any bodies discovered at all or if it was just a hoax.

I just watched this episode for the first time. I haven't read everyone's theories here, but my feeling is that family wouldn't have had any guilt killing the daughter and sister-in-law because they were related to the man that they accused of sexually abusing their son. They probably convinced themselves it was true after having lied about it for so long. If there was any truth to it, they might have killed out of retribution. My feeling is that it's VERY odd that if the sister-in-law did kick them out at WalMart, that Wendy wouldn't have walked straight to a pay phone, like she did the other times, and call her husband for help. No way she would have just stood in some parking lot (pre cell phones and texts) and just waited. Besides, what kind of person (sister-in-law) drops a child in a parking lot, no matter how angry she is with the parent. I believe they never made it to that parking lot, and to that effect, they may not have even made it to the house. I wonder if anyone knows whether the police even questioned Jonathan that day, and asked him if he'd seen his mother or heard anything. I hope no one contacted him - he really deserves his privacy, after something like this.

Just watched it again:

I believe Chad did it, but the whole family knew exactly what was going on and decided there was no other way to get rid of Wendy, and protect "their son". If she left them alone, this never would have happened, as far as they were concerned. Chad said "my son" in the clip, meaning he never saw the boy as their's, and he left her after she got sick with MS. She didn't even back down after the sexual abuse charges which they thought would keep him permanently out of her life. As far as they were concerned they didn't have any other way to get her out of the picture. I believe it was always their intention to deceive Wendy and get her to come there by herself, they didn't anticipate the other two. However, once the others went, they realized that it would make the story even stronger, because if it had only been Wendy, it would have been more suspicious, but three people drop off the face of the earth? They never made it to the parking lot.

The ex husband isn't a good liar. I don't believe after six months of not seeing him that she ignored the boy and sat on the porch having coffee and talking with the man who kept her from her son. The problem with these people, grandmother included, is that they are so angry and vindictive that they can't even hide their rage at her still. I don't believe she even made it to the house, actually.

The other possibility is that there was a fight, Wendy was killed and the other two died were killed because they were witnesses.

I watched the segment a few days ago and I totally believe Wendy's mother's theory that the three were killed shortly after arriving and the story about the argument in the car and forcing them out at Wal-Mart was made up. This case is eerily similar to another one where a young woman named Karyn Slover was murdered by her ex-husband and her ex-inlaws because they wanted her son and she was planning to move away.

Oh the Noes totally did it. There is no doubt in my mind, or the minds of anybody who watched the UM segment.


What amazes me is that Chad is clearly an idiot. The guy admitted to admitting that he killed them on the Unsolved Mysteries segment!!!! And his mother's cockamamie Wall Mart story is the dumbest thing I've ever heard in my life. These are clearly not very bright people...AND THEY GOT AWAY WITH TRIPLE MURDER!!!!

Its unbelievable. I can't fathom how they can be the last ones to see the three alive, responsible for the transportation to & from the house, & have a history of resentment towards Wendy, and that in of itself doesn't yield a proper investigation. A search warrant of that house and car should have been issued as soon as possible.

I watched the segment a few days ago and I totally believe Wendy's mother's theory that the three were killed shortly after arriving and the story about the argument in the car and forcing them out at Wal-Mart was made up. This case is eerily similar to another one where a young woman named Karyn Slover was murdered by her ex-husband and her ex-inlaws because they wanted her son and she was planning to move away.
They could not have been killed shortly after arriving because Wendy called her husband when she got there and called on her way home after they had left Chad

I read somewhere on here that now that Ida and Beverly have been arrested for arson, whatever "pull" they had within the local law enforcement must now be gone or else they wouldn't have been arrested for arson. This just isn't the case. They were arrested for Arson by the FBI. These two were setting fire to every place they lived in, in order to collect the insurance money on the house, therefore the feds jumped in. They have since been released from prison and are on probation. The one thing I find strange is that since the FBI arrested them for arson and had them in prison, I wonder if the FBI even knew about the Wendy Camp story and if it was investigated at all by them?

Well hopefully when they were sent to prison, they didn't just sit there "gripin' & a bitchin'" as Ida would so eloquently put it.

Chad confirmed his guilt on UM with the following statement...
"Maybe in a "drunken stupor" I bragged about it."

Chad confirmed his guilt on UM with the following statement...
"Maybe in a "drunken stupor" I bragged about it."

His mannuerisms in the segment also confirmed his guilt, IMO. He was blinking rapidly, talking in a cracked voice, etc.

His mannuerisms in the segment also confirmed his guilt, IMO. He was blinking rapidly, talking in a cracked voice, etc.

And what was that about "still holding them alive somewhere"? It's possible the little girl was kept alive for years after the two women were killed.

And what was that about "still holding them alive somewhere"? It's possible the little girl was kept alive for years after the two women were killed.

Sadly I think all three of them were killed that day. I find it amazing that (at the very least) Chad has not been prosecuted for something involving their disappearance.

Sadly I think all three of them were killed that day. I find it amazing that (at the very least) Chad has not been prosecuted for something involving their disappearance.

I used to think the same thing but after Wendy's sister came on here and said that Chad's family has ties to local LE, it doesn't surprise me. The FBI would have had to get involved for something to have happened.

What gets me is that there is a TON of circumstantial evidence that links Chad and his family to their disappearance. You'd think that they could get indicted on that stuff alone.

I have friend that lives in the Shamrock, OK area where Wendy Camp, her daughter and Lisa Kriegar went missing after making a trip to Shamrock from OKC to visit Wendy's son. Bones were found in a pond located on private property in the Drumright/Shamrock area. Bones are those thought to be Wendy Camp, her daughter and Lisa Kriegar. An investigation is under way to determine more information as to what happened. It has been rumored that Chad Noe killed them and placed them in pond and had help. :clap:


I've tried researching this on the internet. I can't find ANY record of ANY bones of 1 or 3 (for that matter) peoplebeing found in OK in a pond. Can you give us some links?
According to the OSBI website, this is still an unsolved case

I used to think the same thing but after Wendy's sister came on here and said that Chad's family has ties to local LE, it doesn't surprise me. The FBI would have had to get involved for something to have happened.

What gets me is that there is a TON of circumstantial evidence that links Chad and his family to their disappearance. You'd think that they could get indicted on that stuff alone.

Seems to me that if LE got Chad away from his mother and gave him an "intense" interrogation, he'd crack like a piece of china.

Seems to me that if LE got Chad away from his mother and gave him an "intense" interrogation, he'd crack like a piece of china.

Yea, I agree but I doubt LE even cares judging from their lack of doing anything noteworthy in this case and that they supposedly have ties to Noe's family. I believe that the only way this case is solved is if a body is recovered.

Yea, I agree but I doubt LE even cares judging from their lack of doing anything noteworthy in this case and that they supposedly have ties to Noe's family. I believe that the only way this case is solved is if a body is recovered.

At least Ida and Beverly are in jail. Seems to me like the perfect time to reinvestigate this case and thoroughly question Chad. I think that would result in this case being solved.

At least Ida and Beverly are in jail. Seems to me like the perfect time to reinvestigate this case and thoroughly question Chad. I think that would result in this case being solved.

If I remember correctly, I think Beverly and Ida are already out of jail as they received a very light sentence. I could be wrong but for some reason I thought Wendy's sister said they weren't going to be in prison very long. But I agree that while they were in (put there by the FBI, I believe) it would have been a perfect time for the FBI to investigate this case again as two of the prime suspects were incarcerated.

While Chad Noe and his family are some the most likely suspects on UM that have gotten away with murder, they are also some of the least likely who have a chance being charged for it. As much as we believe that they were responsible for the death of those three people, not only is there no evidence of murder, there's no evidence that a crime was even committed, period!

In other similar UM cases where there's no body (Charlotte Pollis, Christi Nichols, Tommy Gibson), there's at least some circumstantial evidence to suggest that the suspect disposed of a dead body at some point. In this case, there's nothing to indicate this other than Chad Noe's drunken rambling that "they'll never find the bodies". Abandoning three people at Walmart sounds suspicious, but it can't be officially disproven.

While I do think the family is guilty as sin, I would never make an attempt to prosecute them on the minimal evidence they have right now. Sadly, if the rumours about the Noe family's ties with local LE are true, there probably will be no legal action in this case unless bodies are found.

UPDATE:



http://newsok.com/sister-of-missing-...rticle/3544336

Anyone see this article? I don't seem to be able to get into the whole article? Can anyone else? Its about Wendy's sister and her dreams and the case. :)

As for the unsolved mysteries segment I found it strange that chads mother would not be on it. If she is so inocent why not come on and declair her side of the story. If anything makes her look guiltier than anything. And Ida always freeked me out. eek!

UPDATE:



http://newsok.com/sister-of-missing-...rticle/3544336

Anyone see this article? I don't seem to be able to get into the whole article? Can anyone else? Its about Wendy's sister and her dreams and the case. :)

As for the unsolved mysteries segment I found it strange that chads mother would not be on it. If she is so inocent why not come on and declair her side of the story. If anything makes her look guiltier than anything. And Ida always freeked me out. eek!

That link doesn't work. I too always thought it was odd that Chad's mother did not appear on camera for UM. Generally when someone wouldn't appear on UM, I always tended to think they had something to hide.

http://newsok.com/sister-of-missing-woman-says-recurring-dreams-might-mean-something/article/3544336

Try that link. Hoping some one can get into the whole article so we can see what it says. :wave:

Another thing is there was no remorse by the Noe family. I mean if it were me I would feel bad if I dropped some off at a store and they disapeared. I wouild be on there saying I dropped thme of and thought she would go in the store and make a phone call like wendy always did. Never dreamed anything would happen to the three in populated a store. These people showed no remorse at all. Not normal behavior you ask me. Chads mother wouldnt even appear on the show. Very strange to say the least. My feeling is Chad probably hired someone he met in a bar and had his family go along with it. Always felt that way.

Another thing is there was no remorse by the Noe family. I mean if it were me I would feel bad if I dropped some off at a store and they disapeared. I wouild be on there saying I dropped thme of and thought she would go in the store and make a phone call like wendy always did. Never dreamed anything would happen to the three in populated a store. These people showed no remorse at all. Not normal behavior you ask me. Chads mother wouldnt even appear on the show. Very strange to say the least. My feeling is Chad probably hired someone he met in a bar and had his family go along with it. Always felt that way.

There's no remorse because the whole "we dropped them off at the Wal-Mart because Wendy wouldn't stop bitching" is a bunch of BS. Had Beverly honestly dropped off Wendy, her daughter, and Lisa at that Wal-Mart the very first thing they would have done was called Wendy's husband Leon. The odds that Beverly innocently dropped them off in that parking lot and the three of them were then abducted mere seconds after by an unknown third party border on astronomical.

Of all the cases on Unsolved Mysteries, this is the one case where everyone knows who did it and there is no debating who did it.

Of all the cases on Unsolved Mysteries, this is the one case where everyone knows who did it and there is no debating who did it.

Believe it or not I actually used to think Ida was innocent of any wrong doing and her account of what happened was accurate. But then I found out both she and Beverly were incarcerated and I knew the whole family had to have been involved. Pure scum.

Its not so much the story or their account of what happened that I find unbelievable. Its the fact that Wendy was a very needy person due to her condition (not a slight or insult on the victim, just the truth). She had been in constant contact with Leon that whole day when things were (seemingly) going good. I have to think that if they were just dumped at Walmart, she would have immediately called Leon. And to believe Chad Noe's family's account, is to believe that sometime after they dropped them at Walmart, all three of them were almost immediately kidnapped, which I find unbelievable.

Was anyone able to recover the full article fom my link? :wave:

Was anyone able to recover the full article fom my link? :wave:

I tried, but could only see the first couple paragraphs, like you. It looks like you have to be a subscriber to the site or the print version of their newspaper to access some of the content. :(

I believe this is the first I've read anything from Lisa Kreager's sister. It would be very interesting to see the rest of that article.

At least Ida and Beverly are in jail. Seems to me like the perfect time to reinvestigate this case and thoroughly question Chad. I think that would result in this case being solved.

They've been out for a long time now. Maybe 4 years? They committed an arson and did only about six months. :( There's a nifty booking photo of both the hags tho, in prison orange and all. Wendy's sister (Aisha) used it as her avie, too, so it's got to be around here somewhere.


FOUND THEM

Post #14 here: http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showthread.php?t=200468

They've been out for a long time now. Maybe 4 years? They committed an arson and did only about six months. :( There's a nifty booking photo of both the hags tho, in prison orange and all. Wendy's sister (Aisha) used it as her avie, too, so it's got to be around here somewhere.


FOUND THEM

Post #14 here: http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showthread.php?t=200468

I really don't know why this case has not been solved after all of these years. It is obvious Chad and family killed them. It seems like a no brainer but I guess without bodies it is hard to prove. Chad has even bragged about killing them and doesn't deny it.

I tried, but could only see the first couple paragraphs, like you. It looks like you have to be a subscriber to the site or the print version of their newspaper to access some of the content. :(

I believe this is the first I've read anything from Lisa Kreager's sister. It would be very interesting to see the rest of that article.


Yeah apparently she had a dream she believes might be what happened to her sister.

I always believe chad hired someone to kill the three. His mother and grandmother were just a small part of the plan. Like needing his mother to be the driver.

You would think after all these years someone would have come across some reamains. It think it still possible some still will. About the only way this case maybe solved.

Yeah apparently she had a dream she believes might be what happened to her sister.


Do you remember what her dream was? I don't recall reading it on here.

Do you remember what her dream was? I don't recall reading it on here.

This is all the site says, without subscribing to get the full article:


Sister of missing woman says recurring dreams might mean something

BY ROBERT MEDLEY
Published: February 27, 2011

Manell Morris has a recurring nightmare.

She dreams she’s lying on the floor, looking beneath a bed, and underneath are her missing sister Lisa Kregear, sister-in-law Wendy Camp, and Camp’s young daughter, Cynthia Britto.

It’s dark, and all three are alive, Morris said, but they are trapped, and she can’t communicate or help them. “I’m on my stomach … a very small area that I’m looking under, but...

http://newsok.com/sister-of-missing-woman-says-recurring-dreams-might-mean-something/article/3544336

This is all the site says, without subscribing to get the full article:


Sister of missing woman says recurring dreams might mean something

BY ROBERT MEDLEY
Published: February 27, 2011

Manell Morris has a recurring nightmare.

She dreams she’s lying on the floor, looking beneath a bed, and underneath are her missing sister Lisa Kregear, sister-in-law Wendy Camp, and Camp’s young daughter, Cynthia Britto.

It’s dark, and all three are alive, Morris said, but they are trapped, and she can’t communicate or help them. “I’m on my stomach … a very small area that I’m looking under, but...

http://newsok.com/sister-of-missing-woman-says-recurring-dreams-might-mean-something/article/3544336

That was it. I just listened to her radio interview. Did the police ever interigate these people? After Beverly threatened Wendy during the custody hearing, and then she is the last person to be with wendy . cynthia renee. come on. not to mention beverly and ida going to jail for fraud and arson. come on these people are criminals. the cops should have interigated them and polygraphed them why they had them in custody. by the sound of things their screwing up jonathon. Beverly knows were chad is. she is his mother. these cops need to get on the ball. " I will give jonathon back over my dead body or hers. A heck of thing for beverly to say. geez.

One of the worst police investigations ever. Was the Noe home even actually SEARCHED for any evidence? I'm surprised nobody has turned to vigilantism. I know I couldn't sit still if my wife, daughter, or sister was obviously murdered by a group of people, especially not for 20 years.

One of the worst police investigations ever. Was the Noe home even actually SEARCHED for any evidence? I'm surprised nobody has turned to vigilantism. I know I couldn't sit still if my wife, daughter, or sister was obviously murdered by a group of people, especially not for 20 years.


Man they should have interigated and polygraphed those Noe's. I wonder if Jonathon knows something. Why else would they keep him from talking to Wendy's family?

One of the worst police investigations ever. Was the Noe home even actually SEARCHED for any evidence? I'm surprised nobody has turned to vigilantism. I know I couldn't sit still if my wife, daughter, or sister was obviously murdered by a group of people, especially not for 20 years.

There was some speculation that Beverly was involved with someone high up in law enforcement and/or the "Dixie Mafia", which may be why the police investigation seems so bungled.

There was some speculation that Beverly was involved with someone high up in law enforcement and/or the "Dixie Mafia", which may be why the police investigation seems so bungled.
that makes sense and I've always suspected they *knew they were going to get away with it,and that's why they went ahead with such a bold and obvious plan.

Well just a far off theory. Stranger things have happened. Maybe they threated to kill Leon if she spoke up in that scenario. But in all reality when Wendy made that call she probably felt safe and had no idea what was coming.

I am one who personally thinks Ida wasn't involved in the killings (I think she really did get out of the car when she did and just doesn't want to ask questions about it). She is Chad's grandmother so if he was 25-30 years old at that time then she would be 65-70 minimum. Something tells me an elderly woman would be no good in that situation. Too much could happen in a struggle with her, a heart attack, a stroke and let's not forget she dies first so maybe a death bed confession.

But how much was Wendy and Chad's son questioned? I know he wasn't very old, but how much insight could be provide on this case. Would he be able to recognize some hostile treatment towards his mom. Would he remember who got in the car with her? Would he remember who was babysitting him when they drove away. Put it this way, if Ida was watching him, that contradicts her story. I've always wondered how much that kid knew
yes,WHO was watching Jonathan when they left,and WHY on earth would Ida need to be in the car anyway?I've always felt she was in on it,and she went along as a witness for Beverly and Chad.

yes,WHO was watching Jonathan when they left,and WHY on earth would Ida need to be in the car anyway?I've always felt she was in on it,and she went along as a witness for Beverly and Chad.


You all thinik Beverly hired someone from this so called dixie mofia to kill them?

Read Wendy's sister's blog, and it just proves their guilt. The idiots changed their story. They first said that they dropped the 3 off on highway 66, but then later said they dropped them off in the parking lot at walmart. Well which is it!? It's pretty darn difficult to confuse a walmart with the side of a highway.


IMO this is where they should have started looking for the bodies or evidence (off hwy 66).it seems they were trying to account for being seen there,then they decided it would be better to say they dropped them off at walmart.
IMO Chad was following them,and they were forced at gunpoint to another location,where they were killed.
while it may or may not have been off hwy 66,that would seem a good place to start.

from the sound of it,I think it was all Beverly's idea (esp. since she refused to be on camera) and she had inside assurance from LE that she would get away with it.I think she recruited Chad to do the actual killing,thinking she would look innocent as just being the 'helpful' driver who picked up Wendy.She then assigned blame to Wendy for 'having' to drop her off,accusing her of being argumentative.Ida was,IMO,also recruited by Beverly as a witness to the whole thing,which is why she was needlessly in the car for the return trip in the first place.

IMO this is where they should have started looking for the bodies (off hwy 66).it seems they were trying to account for being seen there,then they decided it would be better to say they dropped them off at walmart.
IMO Chad was following them,and they were forced at gunpoint to another location,where they were killed.
while it may or may not have been off hwy 66,that would seem a good place to start.


They could have hired someone to take them off at gun point.

You all thinik Beverly hired someone from this so called dixie mofia to kill them?
since Chad bragged about killing them,I think she recruited her own son to do it.she probably felt safer that way,thinking he would never turn on her,and vice versa..she would never turn on him.
I think she had assurance from someone high up in LE that they would get away with it.

They could have hired someone to take them off at gun point.
possibly,but Chad was the one who drunkenly bragged about killing them.that's the smoking gun as far as I'm concerned.he even admits it.

possibly,but Chad was the one who drunkenly bragged about killing them.that's the smoking gun as far as I'm concerned.he even admits it.

He should be polygraphed. Being that he was drunk he could have just be trying to make himself look big in front of his buddies, when he knows some he hired did it. Hard tell with a drunk or high person.

He should be polygraphed. Being that he was drunk he could have just be trying to make himself look big in front of his buddies, when he knows some he hired did it. Hard tell with a drunk or high person.
the thing that makes me think there was no hired killer is the fact that 3 of them,instead of just the one they thought was going (Wendy,of course) went missing.and it's been said Beverly didn't protest when the 3 of them showed up to get into her car.
so think about it..a hired killer would want 3x (or more) the $$$ and would take full advantage of it..or simply say NO,the deal is off.the Noe's don't strike me as wealthy ppl and by all accounts,they weren't,esp. with the arson convictions and trying to scam the ins. co.'s.It appears to be a do-it-all themselves job to me.
also note Chad and not Beverly appeared on UM...I think she convinced him to appear instead of her,making it more likely the whole thing was planned and covered up by her.

After listening to the radio interview again, Wendy's sister made note of Wendy's last phone call that day. In the UM segment, it made note of Wendy's last phone call to Leon, which phone records state happened at 4:42 p.m. The call was placed before the troops left Shamrock. The conversation mainly consisted of Wendy recounting her visit with Jonathan and then it ended when Wendy said that Beverly was in a hurry and that she would be home in a couple hours.

I always assumed that was the last time Wendy spoke with ANY of her family members before she vanished. But the radio interview points out that Wendy's last phone call was actually to her mother from a gas station, and this is all on police record. In that conversation, Wendy told her mother that Cynthia had started crying in the car because she was hungry. So they pulled in to the gas station and since Wendy didn't have her wallet on her, Beverly was livid because she had to spend a couple bucks on a soda and a bag of candy for Cynthia. The conversation ended with Wendy saying, "I'll be home in about an hour and Leon should be home by then so I'll talk to you tomorrow." It should also be noted that this was never a planned call. Wendy told her mom that she happened to notice the payphone outside the station while Beverly was inside buying the candy.

I'd like to know the time and location of this call from the gas station. Because even though it wasn't mentioned in the segment, it was clearly after Wendy's call to Leon at 4:45. And according to Beverly, she dropped the 3 women off at the Walmart (yeah, right) at approximately 5:45.

So, if I am to understand this bizarre timeline correctly, when everyone left Shamrock at 4:45, the women drove for 30 minutes, turned around, drove back to Shamrock, dropped off Ida, drove 30 minutes again when Beverly claims to have kicked Wendy, Cynthia and Renee out of her car in Chandler and then she somehow made it all the way to Cushing where she met Chad at a restaraunt at 7:00. The times don't add up, especially when you factor in the trip to the gas station. This is just amazing. Isn't this the kind of proof of Beverly's lying that even the most corrupt police department couldn't cover up?