Mary K. Letourneau to be released from prison today

By Michael Ko
Seattle Times staff reporter

Mary K. Letourneau, the elementary-school teacher who became tabloid fodder after having two babies with a former sixth-grade student, will walk out of prison today after completing most of a 7½-year sentence for child rape.
Within 24 hours of her release from the Washington Corrections Center for Women in Gig Harbor, Letourneau must register as a sex offender with the King County Sheriff's Office and report where she is living. Then she must meet with her community corrections officer.

After that, one big question looms: Are Letourneau and her former student going to see each other again?

A lifetime no-contact order, which is part of her sentence, prevents Letourneau, 42, from seeing the student, Vili Fualaau, now 21. When they started having sexual encounters, she was 34 and he was 12.

Though contrite at times, she has steadfastly maintained that their unusual union was strictly about love. While in prison, in violation of the no-contact order, she sent Fualaau more than 20 letters, which were mostly affectionate. In one, though, she threatened him with "castration" if he ever dated anyone else.

Yesterday morning at Seattle-Tacoma International Airport, Fualaau told KING-TV reporter Linda Byron that he still loved Letourneau. Fualaau was on his way to New York City with a friend for national media interviews.

"I'm kinda nervous, I don't know what my feelings are right now, but I do know that I do love her," said Fualaau, when asked what his reaction was to Letourneau leaving prison.

When asked if he hoped to get together with her again, he sighed, turned his head and declined to answer.

It would be up to Fualaau to initiate any attempt to dissolve the no-contact order by filing a motion with King County Superior Court Judge Linda Lau, who sentenced Letourneau in 1997.

As of yesterday, no such motion had been filed, Lau's clerk said.

Several published reports have said Fualaau has hired a lawyer to look at lifting the no-contact order.

A history of the Letourneau case


October 1995: Mary K. Letourneau learns her father is dying of cancer, an event that a therapist later says was critical to her state of mind when she became sexually involved with Vili Fualaau.
January 1996: Letourneau has a miscarriage and a nervous breakdown, according to psychiatrist Julia Moore of Federal Way, who also said Letourneau has bipolar disorder.

Summer 1996: Letourneau becomes sexually involved with Fualaau, then a 12-year-old sixth-grader, whom she also taught when he was in second grade. He later tells police he and Letourneau had sex about six times in 1996, mostly at her home or in her car.

February 1997: Letourneau's husband finds love letters from his wife to Fualaau. A relative of the husband's eventually calls school officials, who alert police.

May 1997: Letourneau gives birth to the first of two girls fathered by Fualaau.

August 1997: Letourneau pleads guilty in King County Superior Court to two counts of second-degree child rape.

November 1997: Letourneau is sentenced to 7 1/2 years in prison, which is suspended on condition she complete a treatment program for sexual offenders and serve six months in jail, with credit for time already served. Her sentencing plan has five pages of other restrictions, including that she have no contact with Fualaau. She promises the judge she will stay away from him.

Jan. 6, 1998: Letourneau is released from jail and registers as a sex offender with the King County Sheriff's Office. She moves in with a friend in Seattle.

Feb. 3, 1998: Letourneau is arrested for violating the conditions of her probation when she is found with Fualaau in a parked car near her home at 2:40 a.m. She learns she's pregnant soon after.

Feb. 4, 1998: Letourneau is put on suicide watch in King County Jail while awaiting a court hearing. Officials say she is distraught at the thought of going to prison.

Feb. 6, 1998: Letourneau is sentenced to serve the rest of her 7 1/2-year prison sentence after King County Superior Court Judge Linda Lau is told she not only violated conditions of her parole, but that money and clothing found in the car when she was arrested may have indicated she planned to flee. Letourneau is immediately taken from the King County Jail to the Washington Corrections Center for Women in Gig Harbor

October 1998: Letourneau gives birth to her second daughter by Fualaau.

July 1999: The Letourneaus' divorce is finalized.

Aug. 4, 2004: Letourneau is to be released from prison.




The media frenzy has grown as Letourneau's release approaches. News and tabloid organizations from all over the world are camped out in front of the women's prison.

Friends and lawyers have speculated that one of Letourneau's main goals upon her release will be to reconnect with each of her children.

She has been allowed frequent supervised visits with her two daughters by Fualaau, now 7 and 5 years old.

She has also been in regular contact with her four children, two boys and two girls ranging in age from 10 to 19, from her previous marriage. They live in Anchorage with Letourneau's ex-husband, Steve.

Letourneau was a popular teacher and the married mother of four when she began teaching Fualaau in the second grade at Shorewood Elementary School in Burien.

Letourneau said she was struck by Fualaau's artistic abilities. She mentored him for years, introducing him to the piano, buying him art supplies and even taking a community-college art class with him.

Over the years, he described the kinds of things that drew him in: She encouraged his art; he was rewarded with dinner for doing well in school; and Letourneau ate chocolate cake from his fingers.

In the sixth grade, when she was his teacher for the second time, he asked her to marry him and gave her a sterling-silver ring that he had found on the street.

"She took her husband's ring off and put mine on," he said during a 2002 civil trial, where he and his mother sued the school district for not preventing the relationship. "She wore it every day at school."

The sex started soon after that. It wasn't long before her husband found out. Their marriage was already rocky.

Letourneau pleaded guilty to second-degree child rape and accepted intensive sex-offender treatment. But a month after her conditional release, she was caught having sex with Fualaau again. She was sent to prison immediately. Their daughters, including the one born while Letourneau was in custody, were raised by Fualaau's mother.

Gregg Olsen, the author of "If Loving You is Wrong," the story of the Letourneau scandal, interviewed her at length for the book. He believes she will contact Fualaau again.

"I think she'll want to prove to the world that it was a love story," Olsen said. "She'll want to be with him, even if it's for a little while, and she'll want to prove that she didn't waste six and a half years of her life in prison for nothing."

In jail, Letourneau enlisted as a teacher's aide, read books to the blind and studied at the law library. She also violated the no-contact order numerous times and was punished as a result.

In the years since the relationship, Fualaau has acknowledged that he has consumed illegal drugs and alcohol, been fired from a fast-food job, assaulted his mother, dropped out of high school, been arrested for car theft and spent time in a psychiatric hospital.

He and his mother, Soona, received approximately $200,000 from various tabloid, book and movie deals, including a book published in France. But the money was spent on elaborate parties, trips and hotels.

Fualaau's father has spent much of his life in prison and has 18 children by five women.

During the 2002 civil trial, Fualaau was asked how he felt about Letourneau. He said she was the best thing that ever happened to his life.

Jesus Christ almighty, what a screwed up scandal... first of all, all teachers who have sex with their students are undeniably gross- if you want to fall in love [and be a pervert], at least wait until the end of the year! Goodness gracious...

Sick sick woman!:eek:

She is worse than gross and disgusting. This started when the kid was 12? Letourneau is severely mentally sick in the head. :eek:

her boy is legal now... think they'll hook up now?

I remember hearing on and on and on about this story, and then when they finally showed the boy she was having sex with, I was like "THAT is what she went to jail for?" LOL. If you're going to do something sick and go to jail for it, at least have higher standards... that boy was fugly. LOL

That's sick!

Originally posted by BuffySlayer79
her boy is legal now... think they'll hook up now?

I remember hearing on and on and on about this story, and then when they finally showed the boy she was having sex with, I was like "THAT is what she went to jail for?" LOL. If you're going to do something sick and go to jail for it, at least have higher standards... that boy was fugly. LOL

There's a court order she's not allowed to go near him but I heard he's gonna fight it. Personally I think they should be allowed to see each other he's 21 now I don't see how it's the courts business. I'm not condoning her behavior at all I think it's sick but I'm just talking about his age and he should be able to decide if he wants to see her or not.

Originally posted by MandieR1980
There's a court order she's not allowed to go near him but I heard he's gonna fight it. Personally I think they should be allowed to see each other he's 21 now I don't see how it's the courts business. I'm not condoning her behavior at all I think it's sick but I'm just talking about his age and he should be able to decide if he wants to see her or not.

yea, good luck for them... I don't think anyone besides Mary K. would wanna sleep with him, lol

Originally posted by BuffySlayer79
her boy is legal now... think they'll hook up now?


While that would be the "happy ending" and "what should happen", I doubt it will happen. It's a shame but life isn't a fiary tale. I still think it's what should happen though. Although, now that it's legal, the whole excitement aspect is probably gone, unless of course they really DID love each other. Do you understand what I'm saying?

This is sick. ohno:

What's even worse is that he became a father at 14.

:eek2:

Sick, sick, sick.

I believe this is the only case I heard of that had a woman as the perpetrator of a crime like this instead of a man. You don't see women doing stuff like this too often.

Originally posted by Brian
I believe this is the only case I heard of that had a woman as the perpetrator of a crime like this instead of a man. You don't see women doing stuff like this too often.

There's another case going on with another female teacher right now. I can't remember her name but it was featured on Inside Edition.

wasn't TO DIE FOR a parody of the Mary K. Letourneau thing?

Boy, if I didn't hear about this F-ed up lady a million times on Seattles' news years ago. I didn't realize it's been so long.

Originally posted by BuffySlayer79
wasn't TO DIE FOR a parody of the Mary K. Letourneau thing?


I thought it was a parody of the incident where a woman hired a teenager to kill her husband in the 1990s.

Originally posted by Brian
I thought it was a parody of the incident where a woman hired a teenager to kill her husband in the 1990s.
Yes, that was the story of Pamela Smart, the New Hampshire teacher who had her teenage lover kill her husband. Nicole Kidman starred in the movie.

The Mary-Kay Letourneau Story came on Lifetime last night or the night before.

Originally posted by Corsair de Morta
The Mary-Kay Letourneau Story came on Lifetime last night or the night before.


Yeah. I wanted to see that but I missed it. Oh well.

Anyways, I think Mary Kay has some really serious issues that she needs to deal with. I mean, sleeping with a twelve year old kid? Come on now. ohno:

Originally posted by Kaffeine Kay
Jesus Christ almighty, what a screwed up scandal... first of all, all teachers who have sex with their students are undeniably gross- if you want to fall in love [and be a pervert], at least wait until the end of the year! Goodness gracious...
:yeahthat :lol:

Parents........hide your young boys!

Originally posted by Corsair de Morta
The Mary-Kay Letourneau Story came on Lifetime last night or the night before.

I just saw a commercial on Lifetime foe the Mary Kay Letourneau Story tomorrow night at 9PM for anyone who wants to watch it.

ALL-AMERICAN GIRL
August 5 at 9 pm et/pt

Director: Lloyd Kramer
Year film was made: 2000
Genre: Drama
Stars: Penelope Ann Miller and Mercedes Ruehl
Straight from the tabloid headlines! This film is based on the true story of a highly respected elementary school teacher who begins a sexual affair with her 13-year-old student. But even when facing criminal charges and public scandal, this mother and wife can't stop her obsessive feelings toward this teen. Starring Penelope Ann Miller and Oscar® winner Mercedes Ruehl.

she needs some serious help.....that kid (or man now) is damn ugly....i feel bad for her kids though

Originally posted by Corsair de Morta
The Mary-Kay Letourneau Story came on Lifetime last night or the night before.

yup it's on my Tivo

Originally posted by BuffySlayer79
I remember hearing on and on and on about this story, and then when they finally showed the boy she was having sex with, I was like "THAT is what she went to jail for?" LOL. If you're going to do something sick and go to jail for it, at least have higher standards... that boy was fugly. LOL

:rofl: Neither is she.

I read that when she was released, there were a bunch of teen boys outside holding signs that said things like, "Take me!" and the like. :lol:

Originally posted by dawsongirl
I read that when she was released, there were a bunch of teen boys outside holding signs that said things like, "Take me!" and the like. :lol:

she'd probably ignore all the Chad Michael Murray lookalikes and go for the one who most resembles The Elephant Man, lol

Originally posted by BuffySlayer79
she'd probably ignore all the Chad Michael Murray lookalikes and go for the one who most resembles The Elephant Man, lol

:lol:

There was a thing like this in Florida with an 8th grader, and the teacher was REALLY hot.

I blogged it, let me find the link


....apparently I didnt blog it, but I did find the link

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2004-06-29-teacher-sex_x.htm

Originally posted by ThirteenInchEscape
There was a thing like this in Florida with an 8th grader, and the teacher was REALLY hot.

I blogged it, let me find the link


....apparently I didnt blog it, but I did find the link

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2004-06-29-teacher-sex_x.htm

Yup that's the one I was talking about

Yeah I'm new to these boards but um I just wanted to speak my mind really quick. There's a lot of people from this state and all over who look at this thing with sympathy for Mary Kay. It's hypocrisy. If the teacher were male and the victim were female there would be no room for sympathy. So why in the heck is there for her? It's wrong, sick, and makes me puke with rage. Not really but, you know. She's a sex offender for the love of God. Thank you all. I knew you'd understand. :D

I just saw scrolled on the bottom of CourtTv that the court order keeping Mary Kay away from Vili has been dissolved. So now she can be with her boytoy.

Originally posted by MandieR1980
I just saw scrolled on the bottom of CourtTv that the court order keeping Mary Kay away from Vili has been dissolved. So now she can be with her boytoy.


If he still wants her! Which I doubt very much!:lol:

Originally posted by Penny Lane
If he still wants her! Which I doubt very much!:lol:

Unfortunately, he does.

Originally posted by AKA
Unfortunately, he does.

Really? Thought that he would have outgrown that by now.:D

Originally posted by Penny Lane
Really? Thought that he would have outgrown that by now.:D

Nope. He said he wants to meet with her and see if she's the same person that he fell in love with. He wants to know if she still loves him.

It's utterly gross and disturbing to me :barf:

Originally posted by MaryElizabeth
It's utterly gross and disturbing to me :barf:


Eh. See, I think it is possible to fall in love with someone who is 20 years older/ younger than you. I really do. But the manner in which Mary Kay went about it, in my opinion, was wrong. And the timing was really bad too. I think they could have waited at least until he was eighteen if they were so in love or whatever. I think if it had been done differently, this wouldnt even be an issue.

I can't say that I think its all that disturbing. There are worse things happening in this world than adults having sex with minors. It's not like she killed anybody. I do think she needs treatment though...

Originally posted by MaryElizabeth
Yeah I'm new to these boards but um I just wanted to speak my mind really quick. There's a lot of people from this state and all over who look at this thing with sympathy for Mary Kay. It's hypocrisy. If the teacher were male and the victim were female there would be no room for sympathy. So why in the heck is there for her? It's wrong, sick, and makes me puke with rage. Not really but, you know. She's a sex offender for the love of God. Thank you all. I knew you'd understand. :D
That's why it's gross! She's a sex offender. Yeah it's possible to fall in love with AN ADULT 20 years older or younger but when it's a TWELVE YEAR OLD kid REGARDLESS .... it's disturbing

Originally posted by MaryElizabeth
That's why it's gross! She's a sex offender. Yeah it's possible to fall in love with AN ADULT 20 years older or younger but when it's a TWELVE YEAR OLD kid REGARDLESS .... it's disturbing


I never said I condoned her behavior. It was wrong of her to sleep with the kid and I'm sure she could have used better judgment. Like I said before, the way she went about it was wrong. And I never said it was okay to be 32 and fall in love with a 12 year old. All I said was that I thought it to be possible to have that much of an age difference and be in love.

And I still dont think its all that disturbing. They both said it was consensual sex. Now, if she had been sexually abusing one of her own kids, its a completely different story. I find that more disturbing. And as I said before, she didnt take anyone's life. As a result of what she did, she created two new lives. It was done under the wrong circumstances but it happened. In my opinion, everything happens for a reason, so these kids could grow up and find the cure to cancer or something. And what would people say then?

I'm sorry that I happen to sympathize with Letourneau. But that doesnt mean I think what she did was right. Maybe I'm just being too human and too open minded, but I don't know. I think people need to stop being overly critical of this woman.

Originally posted by consentida
Eh. See, I think it is possible to fall in love with someone who is 20 years older/ younger than you. I really do. But the manner in which Mary Kay went about it, in my opinion, was wrong. And the timing was really bad too. I think they could have waited at least until he was eighteen if they were so in love or whatever. I think if it had been done differently, this wouldnt even be an issue.

I can't say that I think its all that disturbing. There are worse things happening in this world than adults having sex with minors. It's not like she killed anybody. I do think she needs treatment though... What is with some people taking this story so lightly? No one said that being in a relationship with someone 20 years older or younger than them is wrong... if the two people are consenting adults. Mary K. slept with A CHILD. He was twelve years old when they were first together. TWELVE! Children are not old enough to give consent to sex, therefore he was raped. That's a crime, and a horrific one at that. Mary K. most definitely needed/needs treatment. She makes me ill.

And the argument that "there are worse things happening in the world" is silly. "It's not like she killed anybody"? Heh, yeah... like murder is the only henious crime out there. Sleeping with a child is henious.

Originally posted by consentida
I never said I condoned her behavior. It was wrong of her to sleep with the kid and I'm sure she could have used better judgment. Like I said before, the way she went about it was wrong. And I never said it was okay to be 32 and fall in love with a 12 year old. All I said was that I thought it to be possible to have that much of an age difference and be in love.

And I still dont think its all that disturbing. They both said it was consensual sex. Now, if she had been sexually abusing one of her own kids, its a completely different story. I find that more disturbing. And as I said before, she didnt take anyone's life. As a result of what she did, she created two new lives. It was done under the wrong circumstances but it happened. In my opinion, everything happens for a reason, so these kids could grow up and find the cure to cancer or something. And what would people say then?

I'm sorry that I happen to sympathize with Letourneau. But that doesnt mean I think what she did was right. Maybe I'm just being too human and too open minded, but I don't know. I think people need to stop being overly critical of this woman. Better judgement. She broke the law. What is wrong with people today. I don't care if it was consensual or not. He was a child. I feel sorry for their children. They're probably going to be screwed up. I have no sympathy for this woman and I think she got off very lightly.

Originally posted by Cashodeen
What is with some people taking this story so lightly? No one said that being in a relationship with someone 20 years older or younger than them is wrong... if the two people are consenting adults. Mary K. slept with A CHILD. He was twelve years old when they were first together. TWELVE! That's a crime, and a horrific one at that. Mary K. most definitely needed/needs treatment. She makes me ill.

And the argument that "there are worse things happening in the world" is silly. "It's not like she killed anybody"? Heh, yeah... like murder is the only henious crime out there. Sleeping with a child is henious.

I never said that what she did was right. I never said I agreed with what she did. But in today's society, I have to say that there are a lot of twelve year olds having sex already....and probably with adults. In my school district, there have been several cases of twelve year old girls getting pregnant. Whether it be incest or consensual sex, its the same thing. Its being considered "normal" now because its occuring so often. I guess, maybe thats why I take this case so "lightly." To me, hearing about this stuff is quite normal.

And I never said that a 32 year old sleeping with a 12 year old wasnt a crime. I just dont think its that disturbing. And I agree, Mary does need help. Anyone who even thinks about sleeping with a child does.

There ARE worse things happening in this world. You may not be experiencing it or you may not be aware of it but there are. I've seen and experienced a lot of things in my short seventeen years of existence and I'm well beyond my years to know what I'm talking about. Murderers get more sympathy than Mary Kay Letourneau ever did. But did she kill anybody? No. Did she take the innocence of a child? Yes. And it was wrong and I stand by that. But people act like she's the most dangerous and evil person out there.

Originally posted by Cashodeen
What is with some people taking this story so lightly? No one said that being in a relationship with someone 20 years older or younger than them is wrong... if the two people are consenting adults. Mary K. slept with A CHILD. He was twelve years old when they were first together. TWELVE! Children are not old enough to give consent to sex, therefore he was raped. That's a crime, and a horrific one at that. Mary K. most definitely needed/needs treatment. She makes me ill.

And the argument that "there are worse things happening in the world" is silly. "It's not like she killed anybody"? Heh, yeah... like murder is the only henious crime out there. Sleeping with a child is henious.

Exactly. What if it were a 34 year old male teacher and a 12 year old girl? It's the same thing either way. I believe I'm very open minded and open hearted because I'm able to look at it from this very angle and think of the kids this happens to whether the person who commits the crime is male or female.

Originally posted by consentida
I never said that what she did was right. I never said I agreed with what she did. But in today's society, I have to say that there are a lot of twelve year olds having sex already....and probably with adults. In my school district, there have been several cases of twelve year old girls getting pregnant. Whether it be incest or consensual sex, its the same thing. Its being considered "normal" now because its occuring so often. I guess, maybe thats why I take this case so "lightly." To me, hearing about this stuff is quite normal.

And I never said that a 32 year old sleeping with a 12 year old wasnt a crime. I just dont think its that disturbing. And I agree, Mary does need help. Anyone who even thinks about sleeping with a child does.

There ARE worse things happening in this world. You may not be experiencing it or you may not be aware of it but there are. I've seen and experienced a lot of things in my short seventeen years of existence and I'm well beyond my years to know what I'm talking about. Murderers get more sympathy than Mary Kay Letourneau ever did. But did she kill anybody? No. Did she take the innocence of a child? Yes. And it was wrong and I stand by that. But people act like she's the most dangerous and evil person out there.

I got all of what you're saying: I know you don't condone Mary K.'s actions--that's good. But just because you are used to hearing stories like this, doesn't mean it should be taken lightly. You make it sound like anybody who is horrified by this story doesn't know about preteens engaging in sexual activity.... Most of the country is aware of this, and I don't know one person that thinks it's normal. We're talking about children here.

You're saying it isn't right, and then you're trying to dismiss it by saying there are worse things in the world. That's very mixed up. I don't see murderers getting more sympathy. Mary K.'s case was a highly talked about one because this time it was a woman who commited rape; and to top it off, she was impregnated by her young victim. The laws are made to protect victims like that boy Mary K. was involved with, and to punish people like her-- just like laws are made to punish murderers.

:clap For you being 17 and experiencing a lot. I'm 20 years old and have not lived under a rock, by any means. My points here are all valid because I understand that, just because certain things happen a lot, doesn't mean they should be regarded as "normal." I know you don't think Mary K. was right either, but you are definitely taking it lightly because you view other matters in the world far worse. But there is room to think multiple things going on in the world are very wrong. What Mary K. did was disturbing.

To put this matter into perspective, experts say the reason why Mary K. Letourneau did what she did with her child lover possibly has to do with the fact that she suffered an emotional breakdown
after learning that her father was dying of cancer and that her husband gave her no emotional support and was very cold to her.
And from what I recall, this occured after she had a devastating miscarriage as well. Add to this the fact that she was bi-polar and it begins to make sense. She began to retreat into a sort of fantasy love with with a pre-teen lover who showed his "sensitive" creative side to her, and she was smitten by that. This was not simply a case of "pervy teacher", she was having a series of emotional crises in her life where she sought refuge in a young boy she felt she had an emotional and "pyschic" bond with.

This does not excuse her actions, but explains emotional state of mind that led her to her actions, a series of emotional traumas that compelled her to do what she ordinarily not do under normal circumstances.

Originally posted by Cashodeen
I got all of what you're saying: I know you don't condone Mary K.'s actions--that's good. But just because you are used to hearing stories like this, doesn't mean it should be taken lightly. You make it sound like anybody who is horrified by this story doesn't know about preteens engaging in sexual activity.... Most of the country is aware of this, and I don't know one person that thinks it's normal. We're talking about children here.

You're saying it isn't right, and then you're trying to dismiss it by saying there are worse things in the world. That's very mixed up. I don't see murderers getting more sympathy. Mary K.'s case was a highly talked about one because this time it was a woman who commited rape; and to top it off, she was impregnated by her young victim. The laws are made to protect victims like that boy Mary K. was involved with, and to punish people like her-- just like laws are made to punish murderers.

:clap For you being 17 and experiencing a lot. I'm 20 years old and have not lived under a rock, by any means. My points here are all valid because I understand that, just because certain things happen a lot, doesn't mean they should be regarded as "normal." I know you don't think Mary K. was right either, but you are definitely taking it lightly because you view other matters in the world far worse. But there is room to think multiple things going on in the world are very wrong. What Mary K. did was disturbing.


I am not dismissing Mary's actions by saying that there are worse things happening in this world. I'm just saying that people seem to dwell more on this story than the story of a man killing his pregnant wife or a woman drowning her five kids. In the situation of a man killing his pregnant wife or a woman drowning her five kids, lives were taken. Mary Letourneau didnt take anyone's life but people seem to dish out more criticism and hatred for this woman who made a terrible mistake.

I'm glad you don't live under a rock but that wasnt my point in saying that I had experienced a lot in my time. When people learn my age, they quickly disregard anything I've said as stupidity and immaturity. So, in saying that, I was trying to make sure that people knew I wasnt just some stupid, immature, headstrong teenager. So that's that.

Just as you believe all of your points are valid for various reasons, so do I. I think most of my points are valid and clear. Other people may not agree and that's fine. But on a messageboard such as this one, I'm allowed to state my opinion just as you are or anyone else. I respect your opinions and your views on this situation and I have not challenged them the way you have mine.

Also, you stated that she committed rape. Some people may believe so, but she didn't force Vili Fualaau to have sex with her. Some people see him as a victim but there are others that don't simply for that reason. It was consensual according to both parties involved. If you read anything about the case, Vili's mother and even Vili himself say that he wasnt a victim. So, in my opinion it wasnt rape.

Originally posted by Captain ABlairica
To put this matter into perspective, experts say the reason why Mary K. Letourneau did what she did with her child lover possibly has to do with the fact that she suffered an emotional breakdown
after learning that her father was dying of cancer and that her husband gave her no emotional support and was very cold to her.
And from what I recall, this occured after she had a devastating miscarriage as well. Add to this the fact that she was bi-polar and it begins to make sense. She began to retreat into a sort of fantasy love with with a pre-teen lover who showed his "sensitive" creative side to her, and she was smitten by that. This was not simply a case of "pervy teacher", she was having a series of emotional crises in her life where she sought refuge in a young boy she felt she had an emotional and "pyschic" bond with.

This does not excuse her actions, but explains emotional state of mind that led her to her actions, a series of emotional traumas that compelled her to do what she ordinarily not do under normal circumstances.


:notworthy Thank you. That was going to be my next point. You saved me a lot of explaining and typing.

Originally posted by consentida
:notworthy Thank you. That was going to be my next point. You saved me a lot of explaining and typing.

:welcome:

Originally posted by consentida
I am not dismissing Mary's actions by saying that there are worse things happening in this world. I'm just saying that people seem to dwell more on this story than the story of a man killing his pregnant wife or a woman drowning her five kids. In the situation of a man killing his pregnant wife or a woman drowning her five kids, lives were taken. Mary Letourneau didnt take anyone's life but people seem to dish out more criticism and hatred for this woman who made a terrible mistake.

I'm glad you don't live under a rock but that wasnt my point in saying that I had experienced a lot in my time. When people learn my age, they quickly disregard anything I've said as stupidity and immaturity. So, in saying that, I was trying to make sure that people knew I wasnt just some stupid, immature, headstrong teenager. So that's that.

Just as you believe all of your points are valid for various reasons, so do I. I think most of my points are valid and clear. Other people may not agree and that's fine. But on a messageboard such as this one, I'm allowed to state my opinion just as you are or anyone else. I respect your opinions and your views on this situation and I have not challenged them the way you have mine.

Also, you stated that she committed rape. Some people may believe so, but she didn't force Vili Fualaau to have sex with her. Some people see him as a victim but there are others that don't simply for that reason. It was consensual according to both parties involved. If you read anything about the case, Vili's mother and even Vili himself say that he wasnt a victim. So, in my opinion it wasnt rape.
If someone has sex with a minor, whether they consent to it or not, it's rape. Ask an attorney. Whether his family believes he's a victim or not, he still is according to the law. I never thought of you as someone who was immature, naive or stupid. I appreciate your ability to debate and articulate yourself. That itself speaks volumes about your maturity. I've been through a lot myself starting at an early age. So I can recognize people who are intelligent beyond their years. You're one of them.

I dont think she made a terrible "mistake". When people make terrible mistakes, they usually learn from them. And by that argument you made, you could say that murderers make terrible mistakes. While she's not a murderer, she's still a criminal. I don't give symapthy to ANY convicted criminal when it comes to the crime. It's called judgement. Yes this case has gotten a lot of media attention ALONG with the others you mentioned at least where I live. I haven't forgotten about those victims either.

Hatred and criticism is not what I dish out to Mary Kay. They've been factual points.

Originally posted by Captain ABlairica
To put this matter into perspective, experts say the reason why Mary K. Letourneau did what she did with her child lover possibly has to do with the fact that she suffered an emotional breakdown
after learning that her father was dying of cancer and that her husband gave her no emotional support and was very cold to her.
And from what I recall, this occured after she had a devastating miscarriage as well. Add to this the fact that she was bi-polar and it begins to make sense. She began to retreat into a sort of fantasy love with with a pre-teen lover who showed his "sensitive" creative side to her, and she was smitten by that. This was not simply a case of "pervy teacher", she was having a series of emotional crises in her life where she sought refuge in a young boy she felt she had an emotional and "pyschic" bond with.

This does not excuse her actions, but explains emotional state of mind that led her to her actions, a series of emotional traumas that compelled her to do what she ordinarily not do under normal circumstances. Lots of people have emotional crises. I have had a few. I'm being serious here. But I, along with others who've had emotional crises don't necessarily resort to crime. If every teacher who had a mental breakdown decided to sleep with their students, we wouldn't have as many teachers as we do now. There's a line here and she crossed it. That's all I'm saying. I wonder why it is that she's getting sympathy and people are giving her the benefit of the doubt? If it were your kid (if you had one) would you still be? If it were a male figure and it was a little girl, would people still be coming up with excuses to sympathize and feel sorry, regardless of what emotional state he was in? Or would you be calling him a pedophile? That's all I'm saying here. This is how I'm looking at it.
Also, teachers are adults. They are authority figures. They should have a CLEAR idea on what is right and what is wrong when it comes to their studends.

Originally posted by MaryElizabeth
Lots of people have emotional crises. I have had a few. I'm being serious here. But I, along with others who've had emotional crises don't necessarily resort to crime. If every teacher who had a mental breakdown decided to sleep with their students, we wouldn't have as many teachers as we do now. There's a line here and she crossed it. That's all I'm saying. I wonder why it is that she's getting sympathy and people are giving her the benefit of the doubt? If it were your kid (if you had one) would you still be? If it were a male figure and it was a little girl, would people still be coming up with excuses to sympathize and feel sorry, regardless of what emotional state he was in? Or would you be calling him a pedophile? That's all I'm saying here. This is how I'm looking at it.
Also, teachers are adults. They are authority figures. They should have a CLEAR idea on what is right and what is wrong when it comes to their studends.

couldnt have said it better myself

Originally posted by ThirteenInchEscape
There was a thing like this in Florida with an 8th grader, and the teacher was REALLY hot.

I blogged it, let me find the link


....apparently I didnt blog it, but I did find the link

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2004-06-29-teacher-sex_x.htm

Crap...she's a year younger than my brother. That's SIIIIIIIIIIIIIICK.

That's disgusting to think that the teacher is old enough to be my sister. :eek:

Originally posted by MaryElizabeth
If someone has sex with a minor, whether they consent to it or not, it's rape. Ask an attorney. Whether his family believes he's a victim or not, he still is according to the law.

Yes, that's true and I completely understand that. But I was just stating my opinion on that. I wasnt writing from an attorney's point of view. So, I was looking at it from my own perspective and stating my opinion based on that.


I never thought of you as someone who was immature, naive or stupid. I appreciate your ability to debate and articulate yourself. That itself speaks volumes about your maturity. I've been through a lot myself starting at an early age. So I can recognize people who are intelligent beyond their years. You're one of them.

Thank you very much. I wasnt just singling you or any other person out when I said that. There are some judgmental people here and I was just making sure I was being understood by everyone as a well-spoken, mature person.

I dont think she made a terrible "mistake". When people make terrible mistakes, they usually learn from them. And by that argument you made, you could say that murderers make terrible mistakes. While she's not a murderer, she's still a criminal. I don't give symapthy to ANY convicted criminal when it comes to the crime. It's called judgement. Yes this case has gotten a lot of media attention ALONG with the others you mentioned at least where I live. I haven't forgotten about those victims either.

Not everyone learns from their mistakes the first several times they make them. I grew up in a family where certain people made the same, stupid mistake over and over again and never learned from it. I have no idea why, but that's just how some people are.

And I can see where you're coming from when you say you dont have sympathy for any convicted criminal. I can completely understand that too. If I hadnt had family members that were convicted criminals, I'd probably feel the same way. But despite all the terrible things a person does, they're still human. My brother has been to jail many a times. And as disappointed I am in him, I love him to death. I have other family members whi have committed crimes as well. At heart, they're good people. The crimes they committed, were terrible but I think everyone deserves a second chance. But that's just me.


Hatred and criticism is not what I dish out to Mary Kay. They've been factual points.

Again, I wasnt singling you or anyone else out for that. It was a generalization, which may not have been the best thing for this type of discussion. But there are a lot of people out there that are just very critical. Most of us don't know where we'll be in ten or twenty years. And we're even less likely able to predict what our state of mind will be. I'm pretty sure that Mary Kay and other convicted criminals, had no idea that they'd be sitting in prison for whatever amount of time and for whatever reason. People go through a lot things. Once again, I'm speaking from experience (My father was a family man and then all of a sudden, he up and left and decided not to be part of his kids' lives). People change; they get tired of the same old thing. Maybe they get frustrated with the cards they have been dealt. It's things like that that make people do things like what Mary Kay did. I'm not saying it was the right way to deal with it, but a person's judgment is impaired when they're under stress or if they're depressed or whatever. It's happened to me. I cant say I've made terribly bad choices, but it does happen.


^^I think I talk too much...

Originally posted by consentida
Yes, that's true and I completely understand that. But I was just stating my opinion on that. I wasnt writing from an attorney's point of view. So, I was looking at it from my own perspective and stating my opinion based on that.




Thank you very much. I wasnt just singling you or any other person out when I said that. There are some judgmental people here and I was just making sure I was being understood by everyone as a well-spoken, mature person.



Not everyone learns from their mistakes the first several times they make them. I grew up in a family where certain people made the same, stupid mistake over and over again and never learned from it. I have no idea why, but that's just how some people are.

And I can see where you're coming from when you say you dont have sympathy for any convicted criminal. I can completely understand that too. If I hadnt had family members that were convicted criminals, I'd probably feel the same way. But despite all the terrible things a person does, they're still human. My brother has been to jail many a times. And as disappointed I am in him, I love him to death. I have other family members whi have committed crimes as well. At heart, they're good people. The crimes they committed, were terrible but I think everyone deserves a second chance. But that's just me.




Again, I wasnt singling you or anyone else out for that. It was a generalization, which may not have been the best thing for this type of discussion. But there are a lot of people out there that are just very critical. Most of us don't know where we'll be in ten or twenty years. And we're even less likely able to predict what our state of mind will be. I'm pretty sure that Mary Kay and other convicted criminals, had no idea that they'd be sitting in prison for whatever amount of time and for whatever reason. People go through a lot things. Once again, I'm speaking from experience (My father was a family man and then all of a sudden, he up and left and decided not to be part of his kids' lives). People change; they get tired of the same old thing. Maybe they get frustrated with the cards they have been dealt. It's things like that that make people do things like what Mary Kay did. I'm not saying it was the right way to deal with it, but a person's judgment is impaired when they're under stress or if they're depressed or whatever. It's happened to me. I cant say I've made terribly bad choices, but it does happen.

^^I think I talk too much... I said when it comes to the crime, that's what i don't have sympathy for. I've had a few family members who've sat in jail. But there's consequences to those actions. The justice system isn't there to convict only certain guilty people (even though it does sometimes) that we want to see go to jail and not to convict our loved ones.
Edited

Originally posted by MaryElizabeth

Also, teachers are adults. They are authority figures. They should have a CLEAR idea on what is right and what is wrong when it comes to their studends.

Sadly, there are a lot of teachers that dont know what's right and what's wrong when it comes to their students. And school administration is even worse. There have been several cases at my school where teachers have sexually harrassed students and such. There's one teacher at my school that has been accused of the same thing several times. The school suspends him temorarily and then he comes back. There are even other teachers that speak out against him. But still, they let him teach.

Then there was another situation where a female teacher was falsely accused of doing something to a student. Many teachers and students were on her side, defending her. Yet administration regularly questioned her students and observed her class. The poor woman was treated so badly the entire year that she ended up resigning. She went on to teach at another school.

There are a lot of teachers that have no idea what the hell they're doing. It's very rare that you find a teacher worthy of any praise what so ever, especially in my school.

Originally posted by consentida
Sadly, there are a lot of teachers that dont know what's right and what's wrong when it comes to their students. And school administration is even worse. There have been several cases at my school where teachers have sexually harrassed students and such. There's one teacher at my school that has been accused of the same thing several times. The school suspends him temorarily and then he comes back. There are even other teachers that speak out against him. But still, they let him teach.

Then there was another situation where a female teacher was falsely accused of doing something to a student. Many teachers and students were on her side, defending her. Yet administration regularly questioned her students and observed her class. The poor woman was treated so badly the entire year that she ended up resigning. She went on to teach at another school.

There are a lot of teachers that have no idea what the hell they're doing. It's very rare that you find a teacher worthy of any praise what so ever, especially in my school. Agreed but that's why i said "SHOULD."

Originally posted by MaryElizabeth
I said when it comes to the crime, that's what i don't have sympathy for. I've had a few family members who've sat in jail. But there's consequences to those actions. The justice system isn't there to convict only certain guilty people (even though it does sometimes) that we want to see go to jail and not to convict our loved ones.
Edited

Yeah, I understand that too. I don't expect the system to not convict our loved ones and all that. But I was just saying that people need to be given second chances and not be shot down before they're given the chance to fly. People, in general, seem to think that just because you've committed a crime, it automatically makes you a bad person. And that just isn't so.

Originally posted by consentida
Yeah, I understand that too. I don't expect the system to not convict our loved ones and all that. But I was just saying that people need to be given second chances and not be shot down before they're given the chance to fly. People, in general, seem to think that just because you've committed a crime, it automatically makes you a bad person. And that just isn't so. True and that sucks...but Mary Kay's second chance to her is to be with her "lover" and i think it's incredibly f***** up

Originally posted by consentida
I am not dismissing Mary's actions by saying that there are worse things happening in this world. I'm just saying that people seem to dwell more on this story than the story of a man killing his pregnant wife or a woman drowning her five kids. In the situation of a man killing his pregnant wife or a woman drowning her five kids, lives were taken. Mary Letourneau didnt take anyone's life but people seem to dish out more criticism and hatred for this woman who made a terrible mistake.

I'm glad you don't live under a rock but that wasnt my point in saying that I had experienced a lot in my time. When people learn my age, they quickly disregard anything I've said as stupidity and immaturity. So, in saying that, I was trying to make sure that people knew I wasnt just some stupid, immature, headstrong teenager. So that's that.

Just as you believe all of your points are valid for various reasons, so do I. I think most of my points are valid and clear. Other people may not agree and that's fine. But on a messageboard such as this one, I'm allowed to state my opinion just as you are or anyone else. I respect your opinions and your views on this situation and I have not challenged them the way you have mine.

Also, you stated that she committed rape. Some people may believe so, but she didn't force Vili Fualaau to have sex with her. Some people see him as a victim but there are others that don't simply for that reason. It was consensual according to both parties involved. If you read anything about the case, Vili's mother and even Vili himself say that he wasnt a victim. So, in my opinion it wasnt rape.

It sounded like you were dismissing them to me by saying what Mary K. did wasn't "all that disturbing" and pointing out that worse is going on in the world. I do understand your points; I really do, and I think it's good you and I agree she was wrong in her actions.

Perhaps you get the feeling that this case receives more attention when there are other cases that are far worse, because, again, not many female sex offenders have been known about. Also, it seems to be a pretty controversial subject--you and I wouldn't have much to argue about in a case such as the Andrea Yates case... we all agree crimes like that are extremely horrific. I don't know of any one in their right mind though that thinks murderers are less horrible than Mary K. Letourneau. I certainly don't. I still am appalled by her actions and think it was very distubring though.

Now, about her "emotional trauma." I've heard about all that. All it tells me is Mary K. was a very distressed woman who commited a terrible crime, that she might not have otherwise. In addition to her jail sentence, she most definitely needed psychotherapy. I feel sorry for anyone who goes through crises in their life, but I find them irrelevant in this case because we don't all go out and commit crimes after crises. It's true, everyone reacts differently, and sometimes a person will just "snap" and they can't help themselves. She still commited a terrible crime and deserved due punishment--that's all that matters to me. But she also needed/needs therapy.

I've exhausted this topic enough, so I'm out now. :seeya: