TMC
05-06-2004, 04:40 PM
http://p076.ezboard.com/fwrestlecrap42390frm8.showMessageRange?topicID=623.topic&start=1&stop=20
Like any business or organization the world of Pro Wrestling has had it’s share of "crap" ie politics. But the question is, who is pro wrestling’s greatest politician, who selfishly done whatever it takes to retain their spot, and maintain their power.
10.) The Undertaker – An established locker room leader and veteran, who refused to put over certain younger talent later in his career, while boring fans with his slow methodical style.
9.) Dusty Rhodes -- Nearly killed Jim Crocket’s Mid-Atlantic territory by selfishly booking himself with title runs and frustrated fans with the fabled “Dusty-finish.”
8.) Kevin Sullivan – Snuck onto WCW booking committee and used his power to bury some of the company’s smaller, younger wrestlers such as Chris Benoit, Eddie Guerrero, and Dean Malenko. Pulled off a huge coup by getting in Brad Siegel’s ear and removing WCW head Vince Russo from power, which prompted the aforementioned wrestlers to quit WCW.
7.) Ric Flair – Hands down the greatest worker ever, but drew criticsm for his job as WCW booker in the late 80’s/early 90’s. Mismanaged younger talent (Mic Foley, Shane Douglas, Brian Pillman) and made strides to push himself to the top of the card despite his depleting skills.
6.) Vince Russo – Forced into several power struggles in WCW, Russo struggled with the political games played by Sullivan/JJ Dillon. Refused to push veteran wrestlers, and tried to elevate those younger oppressed wrestlers. Embarrassed legends in silly storylines such as Hacksaw Jim Duggan and Ric Flair, and abandoned script to lambaste Hulk Hogan live on Pay-Per View.
5.) Roddy Piper – A bigger legend in his own mind than in reality, “Hot Rod” refused to job to cash-cow Hogan during the 80’s wrestling boom, resulting in a program that never came to fruition. Also refused to “take a dive” in matches, which ruined potential programs and feuds. Difficult to work with early in his career, often balked at proposed ideas and even bragged about only getting pinned twice throughout his WWF career.
4.) Kevin Nash – One of the poorest drawing WWF champions, who along with the “Kliq,” influenced Vince McMahon’s booking decisions in the mid-90’s stagnant period. Took his political game to a whole new level in WCW, using his friendship with Eric Bischoff to assume booking power, which he abused several times. Befriended wrestlers such as Goldberg with ulterior motives, giving poor career advice.
3.) Shawn Michaels – The younger cocky and brash Michaels, wielded mass in the WWF for years. Openly complained about certain wrestlers in the company, to management and wrestlers alike. Went to great lengths to preserves his spot, including a Piper-like stance to refuse to do the J.O.B. for years. Has since dropped his stance on losing, but still is rumored to play the political game along with Triple H.
2.) Triple H – Obsessed with the business, HHH acquired the more power than any other wrestler in the business today, by marrying into the McMahon family. He Barring a break-up, he pretty much can write his own wrestling destiny storyline wise, even if it comes at the expense of what’s good for the business. Uses his power to weaken fan favorites like Booker T and Rob Van ****. Once a phenomenal worker, his plodding ring style, stale character, and long drawn out promos bore crowds to death.
1.) Hulk Hogan – No one plays the political game better than Hogan. In recent years Hogan has done everything to preserve his spot from halting the push of up-and-coming wrestlers, to stabbing friends in the back, to making wrestlers he works with look bad in the ring. Recently, played NWA-TNA by agreeing to wrestle on the “Bound for Glory” PPV and then electing to get knee surgery, allowing him to deal with Vince McMahon for a possible Wrestlemania XXV appearance. His is the puppet-master.
http://p076.ezboard.com/fwrestlecrap42390frm8.showMessageRange?topicID=623.topic&start=21&stop=40
Top ten worst politicians:
10. Steve Austin - He left after he didn't like the direction of his character, and buried Jeff Jarrett. He also killed the nWo permenently.
9. Undertaker - Managed to get himself booked with the greatest gimmick of all time. Didn't do nearly as much damage as others on this list.
8. Dusty Rhodes - Put himself over everyone, including Flair during his run as booker of Mid-Atlantic. Kept going long after he should have and it took getting fired by Jim Crockett to wedge the book from his hands.
7. Eric Bischoff and Vince Russo (tied) - I lump these two together because they did the same exact thing. They took advantage of the lack of structure in WCW to put themselves over -- and hastened WCWs demise.
6. Kevin Sullivan - Staged a coup, getting Russo fired so he could book his stooges in WCW. One of the worst bookers ever.
5. Jeff Jarrett - Horrible. Started his own promotion and booked himself over everyone in it. Also caused massive amounts of damage to WCW.
4. The Kliq -- These guys get lumped together too. Ran roughshod over mid-90s WWF. Buried Shane Douglas, Vader, Goldust and others.
3. Hulk Hogan -- Like a cockroach, Hogan keeps coming back. Buried tons of guys and kept himself on top far longer than he ever should have. Kept himself off of TV when there was a downturn in ratings, and came back when ratings were on the way up so that he could take credit.
2. Kevin Nash -- Yes, he's listed twice. This one is for when he plotted to take over Brad Siegels job in WCW and destroyed Goldberg. Total locker room cancer.
1. Triple H -- Was there any doubt? He married the boss' daughter for godssake.
Honorable mentions: Jim Ross (not so much for burying people, but he has to manage a lot of egos), Brian Gewirtz (another cockroach), Warrior (for taking his ball and going home and holding the WWF up for money).
http://p076.ezboard.com/fwrestlecrap42390frm8.showMessage?topicID=1362.topic
The problem with Triple H over the past year was....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
...the fact that he was overprotective of his spot, he used his political influence to hold others, that threatened to be a top player, down and not allow them to get over on him in anyway in the ring.
Also, personally I disliked the "roided up" Triple H who had so much muscle mass, he work matches like he used to four years ago.
The reason no one complains is because HHH finally is doing what he should be -- creating new superstars by allowing them to get over on him.
Even by selling for a guy like Tajiri helped elevate him. He still got the win, but he made Yoshihiro look good in the loss.
Asics -- the past two years, Triple H has not done this for any face other than his good friend Shawn Michaels. Ask guys like Kane, Booker T, and RVD -- all guys that "The Game" made look really weak.
It's good that Paul Levesque is starting to give back, rather than to take.
asicsjohnson
Member
Posts: 297
(5/6/04 6:01 am)
Reply
Re: The problem with Triple H over the past year was....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've said it before and I'll say it again:
Vince McMahon is where the buck stops, not Triple H. So, blame Vince for letting Triple H win all these matches. Even so, though, Triple H probably is protecting his spot, but hell, wouldn't you? Saying that he shouldn't protect his spot is like telling The Patriots they should lighten up next season, so somebody else will have a chance to win the Superbowl. You do what you've gotta do to get to the top, and you do what you've gotta do to stay there. I don't blame Triple H in the slightest.
Not to mention that Kane, RVD, nor Booker T were ready for the World Title. Benoit, maybe, those three, nay.
The Golden Spike
Member
Posts: 339
(5/6/04 6:12 am)
Reply Re: The problem with Triple H over the past year was....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ahh, six of one, half a dozen of t'other. Trips has protected his spot, but who wouldn't, or hasn't? One thing he has never actually been, in name, is booker (not Booker T) - Flair, Rhodes, anyone who was ever booker AND a top star used to put themselves over. Hell, Rhodes was a fat guy approaching the end of the useful part of his career when he was on top in the NWA, and he was booking himself. Flair was great, but 16(ish) titles when that really meant something?
Of course it would've been good for business for HHH to put some people up there with him, and I think he's realised that now - it makes him look better if he's making other people look better. That way, everyone gets muchos trip to da pay winda, and everyone looks better. Just common sense, and he (along with the owners and writers) seems to be using that a whole lot more now.
Sorry bruthas, but it's the nBo way
WrestlevisionProducer
Member
Posts: 127
(5/6/04 6:48 am)
Reply HHH
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Just because a guy like Dusty or a Flair protected their spot does not mean it was RIGHT! All I am saying is bsed on what we've heard and what we read, Triple H used his infuence with his father-in-law to protect his spot.
It was not good for business, and Asics' allegory about the Patriots is just silly, as wrestling is a work and not a COMPETITIVE sport like the NFL. HHH's situation would be comparable to Kerry Collin's refusal to help Eli Manning develop in NY abd try to take over his job. It is just selfish. Of course the difference is that Tom Coughlin is not Collin's father-in-law, so of course he was released.
In any event, I;m glad that HHH is starting to "do the right thing" and help the company, instead of hurting it so he can be "The Game."
Like any business or organization the world of Pro Wrestling has had it’s share of "crap" ie politics. But the question is, who is pro wrestling’s greatest politician, who selfishly done whatever it takes to retain their spot, and maintain their power.
10.) The Undertaker – An established locker room leader and veteran, who refused to put over certain younger talent later in his career, while boring fans with his slow methodical style.
9.) Dusty Rhodes -- Nearly killed Jim Crocket’s Mid-Atlantic territory by selfishly booking himself with title runs and frustrated fans with the fabled “Dusty-finish.”
8.) Kevin Sullivan – Snuck onto WCW booking committee and used his power to bury some of the company’s smaller, younger wrestlers such as Chris Benoit, Eddie Guerrero, and Dean Malenko. Pulled off a huge coup by getting in Brad Siegel’s ear and removing WCW head Vince Russo from power, which prompted the aforementioned wrestlers to quit WCW.
7.) Ric Flair – Hands down the greatest worker ever, but drew criticsm for his job as WCW booker in the late 80’s/early 90’s. Mismanaged younger talent (Mic Foley, Shane Douglas, Brian Pillman) and made strides to push himself to the top of the card despite his depleting skills.
6.) Vince Russo – Forced into several power struggles in WCW, Russo struggled with the political games played by Sullivan/JJ Dillon. Refused to push veteran wrestlers, and tried to elevate those younger oppressed wrestlers. Embarrassed legends in silly storylines such as Hacksaw Jim Duggan and Ric Flair, and abandoned script to lambaste Hulk Hogan live on Pay-Per View.
5.) Roddy Piper – A bigger legend in his own mind than in reality, “Hot Rod” refused to job to cash-cow Hogan during the 80’s wrestling boom, resulting in a program that never came to fruition. Also refused to “take a dive” in matches, which ruined potential programs and feuds. Difficult to work with early in his career, often balked at proposed ideas and even bragged about only getting pinned twice throughout his WWF career.
4.) Kevin Nash – One of the poorest drawing WWF champions, who along with the “Kliq,” influenced Vince McMahon’s booking decisions in the mid-90’s stagnant period. Took his political game to a whole new level in WCW, using his friendship with Eric Bischoff to assume booking power, which he abused several times. Befriended wrestlers such as Goldberg with ulterior motives, giving poor career advice.
3.) Shawn Michaels – The younger cocky and brash Michaels, wielded mass in the WWF for years. Openly complained about certain wrestlers in the company, to management and wrestlers alike. Went to great lengths to preserves his spot, including a Piper-like stance to refuse to do the J.O.B. for years. Has since dropped his stance on losing, but still is rumored to play the political game along with Triple H.
2.) Triple H – Obsessed with the business, HHH acquired the more power than any other wrestler in the business today, by marrying into the McMahon family. He Barring a break-up, he pretty much can write his own wrestling destiny storyline wise, even if it comes at the expense of what’s good for the business. Uses his power to weaken fan favorites like Booker T and Rob Van ****. Once a phenomenal worker, his plodding ring style, stale character, and long drawn out promos bore crowds to death.
1.) Hulk Hogan – No one plays the political game better than Hogan. In recent years Hogan has done everything to preserve his spot from halting the push of up-and-coming wrestlers, to stabbing friends in the back, to making wrestlers he works with look bad in the ring. Recently, played NWA-TNA by agreeing to wrestle on the “Bound for Glory” PPV and then electing to get knee surgery, allowing him to deal with Vince McMahon for a possible Wrestlemania XXV appearance. His is the puppet-master.
http://p076.ezboard.com/fwrestlecrap42390frm8.showMessageRange?topicID=623.topic&start=21&stop=40
Top ten worst politicians:
10. Steve Austin - He left after he didn't like the direction of his character, and buried Jeff Jarrett. He also killed the nWo permenently.
9. Undertaker - Managed to get himself booked with the greatest gimmick of all time. Didn't do nearly as much damage as others on this list.
8. Dusty Rhodes - Put himself over everyone, including Flair during his run as booker of Mid-Atlantic. Kept going long after he should have and it took getting fired by Jim Crockett to wedge the book from his hands.
7. Eric Bischoff and Vince Russo (tied) - I lump these two together because they did the same exact thing. They took advantage of the lack of structure in WCW to put themselves over -- and hastened WCWs demise.
6. Kevin Sullivan - Staged a coup, getting Russo fired so he could book his stooges in WCW. One of the worst bookers ever.
5. Jeff Jarrett - Horrible. Started his own promotion and booked himself over everyone in it. Also caused massive amounts of damage to WCW.
4. The Kliq -- These guys get lumped together too. Ran roughshod over mid-90s WWF. Buried Shane Douglas, Vader, Goldust and others.
3. Hulk Hogan -- Like a cockroach, Hogan keeps coming back. Buried tons of guys and kept himself on top far longer than he ever should have. Kept himself off of TV when there was a downturn in ratings, and came back when ratings were on the way up so that he could take credit.
2. Kevin Nash -- Yes, he's listed twice. This one is for when he plotted to take over Brad Siegels job in WCW and destroyed Goldberg. Total locker room cancer.
1. Triple H -- Was there any doubt? He married the boss' daughter for godssake.
Honorable mentions: Jim Ross (not so much for burying people, but he has to manage a lot of egos), Brian Gewirtz (another cockroach), Warrior (for taking his ball and going home and holding the WWF up for money).
http://p076.ezboard.com/fwrestlecrap42390frm8.showMessage?topicID=1362.topic
The problem with Triple H over the past year was....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
...the fact that he was overprotective of his spot, he used his political influence to hold others, that threatened to be a top player, down and not allow them to get over on him in anyway in the ring.
Also, personally I disliked the "roided up" Triple H who had so much muscle mass, he work matches like he used to four years ago.
The reason no one complains is because HHH finally is doing what he should be -- creating new superstars by allowing them to get over on him.
Even by selling for a guy like Tajiri helped elevate him. He still got the win, but he made Yoshihiro look good in the loss.
Asics -- the past two years, Triple H has not done this for any face other than his good friend Shawn Michaels. Ask guys like Kane, Booker T, and RVD -- all guys that "The Game" made look really weak.
It's good that Paul Levesque is starting to give back, rather than to take.
asicsjohnson
Member
Posts: 297
(5/6/04 6:01 am)
Reply
Re: The problem with Triple H over the past year was....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've said it before and I'll say it again:
Vince McMahon is where the buck stops, not Triple H. So, blame Vince for letting Triple H win all these matches. Even so, though, Triple H probably is protecting his spot, but hell, wouldn't you? Saying that he shouldn't protect his spot is like telling The Patriots they should lighten up next season, so somebody else will have a chance to win the Superbowl. You do what you've gotta do to get to the top, and you do what you've gotta do to stay there. I don't blame Triple H in the slightest.
Not to mention that Kane, RVD, nor Booker T were ready for the World Title. Benoit, maybe, those three, nay.
The Golden Spike
Member
Posts: 339
(5/6/04 6:12 am)
Reply Re: The problem with Triple H over the past year was....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ahh, six of one, half a dozen of t'other. Trips has protected his spot, but who wouldn't, or hasn't? One thing he has never actually been, in name, is booker (not Booker T) - Flair, Rhodes, anyone who was ever booker AND a top star used to put themselves over. Hell, Rhodes was a fat guy approaching the end of the useful part of his career when he was on top in the NWA, and he was booking himself. Flair was great, but 16(ish) titles when that really meant something?
Of course it would've been good for business for HHH to put some people up there with him, and I think he's realised that now - it makes him look better if he's making other people look better. That way, everyone gets muchos trip to da pay winda, and everyone looks better. Just common sense, and he (along with the owners and writers) seems to be using that a whole lot more now.
Sorry bruthas, but it's the nBo way
WrestlevisionProducer
Member
Posts: 127
(5/6/04 6:48 am)
Reply HHH
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Just because a guy like Dusty or a Flair protected their spot does not mean it was RIGHT! All I am saying is bsed on what we've heard and what we read, Triple H used his infuence with his father-in-law to protect his spot.
It was not good for business, and Asics' allegory about the Patriots is just silly, as wrestling is a work and not a COMPETITIVE sport like the NFL. HHH's situation would be comparable to Kerry Collin's refusal to help Eli Manning develop in NY abd try to take over his job. It is just selfish. Of course the difference is that Tom Coughlin is not Collin's father-in-law, so of course he was released.
In any event, I;m glad that HHH is starting to "do the right thing" and help the company, instead of hurting it so he can be "The Game."