Oberholtzer/Schnee website

[MegtheEgg86]

The Oberholtzer/Schnee "Orange Sock" murders is one of my favorite cases and I frequently check on it to see if anything new has developed. I was curious if any of you all have visited rockymountaincoldcase.com (it's maintained by members of the 11th Judicial District Homicide Task Force) and have seen the latest (and by that I mean two years) article link on the homepage.

http://parkbull.com/newsextra/080202dnadatabase.html

Two people of interest are apparently a couple of brothers believed to be from Kentucky or Tennessee who used to work for a plumbing business in the area. They may have driven a gray or light blue van (which was also what was depicted in the segment, although I don't believe any mention was really made about the specific type of vehicle the suspect drove), and somehow an old Colorado license plate figures in.

I was just curious what anyone thought about anything. I'd like to start talking about this case again if anyone's interested.

[kadrmas15]

Hmm, Meg the Egg, well I found the article interesting. I will say, I do think the person or persons that did this HAVE done this before. I think they did it before the Oberholtzer/Schnee case and I think they did it after that incident. I mean that is pretty brazen for even an experienced killer to do this twice in the same night to two different women let alone for inexperienced killers to do that. So clearly they had at least tried this before if not pulled it off successfully.

[dynoguy88]

This was always one of my favorite cases too because of how creepy it was. That site is excellent and I'm really glad to know that the police are still trying so hard to solve these brutal burders even after 28 years. I'm kind of bummed we haven't gotten any new updates from the site in the last 2 years but that article is really positive and it gives me hope that this may soon finally come to an end.

When this case was featured on "Sensing Murder" in 2006, there was an update at the end that said the police seemed to narrow the suspects down to two men thanks to the help of the psychics and more investigating. I may be sketchy on some of the details but it was reported that these men were close and one of them moved away shortly after the murders. The psychics felt that one of these men killed Annette and then asked the other for help in disposing of her body because he was a little guy. Unlike in the Unsolved Mysteries segment, it was said she was raped and killed in another location and then driven to Sacremento Creek where her body was dumped. The other man who was asked to help dump the body apparently got some sort of sick high off the crime and decided to drive back in to Breckenridge himself where he picked up and murdered Bobbie Oberholzter a hour or so later.

Sensing Murder bleeped out the men's names which were mentioned a couple times and they also bleeped out the type of vehichle the second man was driving. One of the men died in the 1990's after robbing a bank. But police are still actively investigating him and the other man who is still alive and moved back to Colorado in recent years.

[burbqueen]

OMG, I saw that episode! I really think the psychics were onto something. Yeah they bleeped the names and said that there were two perps. Just scary that they are still out there. I think that they have probably killed before or after that.

[Thinman]

Two things:

1) I would love to see this case solved as much or more than any UM has ever profiled.

2) Annette Schnee was smoking hot.

[MegtheEgg86]

Two things:

1) I would love to see this case solved as much or more than any UM has ever profiled.

2) Annette Schnee was smoking hot.

1) Me too.

2) I have a "girl crush" on Bobbie Oberholtzer. From all that I've read about her, we seem very much alike in personality.

[MegtheEgg86]

This was always one of my favorite cases too because of how creepy it was. That site is excellent and I'm really glad to know that the police are still trying so hard to solve these brutal burders even after 28 years. I'm kind of bummed we haven't gotten any new updates from the site in the last 2 years but that article is really positive and it gives me hope that this may soon finally come to an end.

When this case was featured on "Sensing Murder" in 2006, there was an update at the end that said the police seemed to narrow the suspects down to two men thanks to the help of the psychics and more investigating. I may be sketchy on some of the details but it was reported that these men were close and one of them moved away shortly after the murders. The psychics felt that one of these men killed Annette and then asked the other for help in disposing of her body because he was a little guy. Unlike in the Unsolved Mysteries segment, it was said she was raped and killed in another location and then driven to Sacremento Creek where her body was dumped. The other man who was asked to help dump the body apparently got some sort of sick high off the crime and decided to drive back in to Breckenridge himself where he picked up and murdered Bobbie Oberholzter a hour or so later.

Sensing Murder bleeped out the men's names which were mentioned a couple times and they also bleeped out the type of vehichle the second man was driving. One of the men died in the 1990's after robbing a bank. But police are still actively investigating him and the other man who is still alive and moved back to Colorado in recent years.

Thanks for the recap, dynoguy--I haven't caught the episode but would absolutely love to.

Something Jeff said in the UM segment always kind of stuck with me. Something to the effect of "...she knew better than to get in with a couple of strange guys." I always wondered why he would put it like that unless he knew at the time police were also following leads on two men instead of just one.

[dynoguy88]

Thanks for the recap, dynoguy--I haven't caught the episode but would absolutely love to.

Something Jeff said in the UM segment always kind of stuck with me. Something to the effect of "...she knew better than to get in with a couple of strange guys." I always wondered why he would put it like that unless he knew at the time police were also following leads on two men instead of just one.

It was a really interesting special. I taped it the night it originally aired and watched it probably a dozen or so times. Unfortunately, I accidently taped over it a couple months later.

Jeff Obherholtzer was interviewed and he still spoke with so much love for Bobbie. He shared a fond memory of her from a couple years after they were first married. It was Summer time and they were both sitting out back on the deck when a bird flew down and landed on Bobbie's finger. Jeff went inside the house to get a drink and when he walked back out, Bobbie was asleep on the deck with the bird still on her finger. The bird was also sleeping.

The psychics were brought in individually and each met with an investigator who has been working on this case for the past 25 years; Charlie McCormick and Jim Hardtke. Hardtke, as you will recall, was interviewed in the UM segment. All the psychics knew was that they were coming in to work on a homicide case of a single person. They didn't know the age or sex of the victim. Once they were given Bobbie's mitten to hold as well as her car keys, they came up with a female victim around 30 years of age (Bobbie was 29 when she was killed) with shoulder length hair who wasn't originally from the area (Bobbie and Jeff moved to Colorado from Wisconsin 2 years before her death).

After coming up with these qualities, the psychics were given a picture of Bobbie and came up with a few more factoids that escape me. But both of them were adament that there was another victim in this tragedy. In fact, one of the psychics kept saying from the beginning that she felt there was another woman tied to this case; one of them is a blonde and one is a brunette. From there, the women were given a picture of Annette and it was revealed to the viewers that this was in fact a double homicide case and gave us details about Annette's disappearance and death.

New pictures were shown of both Bobbie and Annette. They were both obviously beautiful women. A picture of police carrying Annette up from the creek in a body bag was also shown. The investigators took the psychics to the areas where the bodies were found and where the crosses were placed for them. Everything about Bobbie's death was pretty much cut and dry and the psychics felt it too. The killer tried to rape her in his vehicle yet she escaped and ran about 100 yards outside the parking lot. One psychic said this struggle led to Bobbie fighting back, most likely with the key ring Jeff gave her and that the killer is going to have a really bad scar from where she poked him once he forced himself on her.

Bobbie is running towards the trees and the killer follows in his car. He gets out and she turns running off the road. The only other detail the psychic came up with at this point was that he waited a few seconds before shooting her so she would feel the absolute worst fear for as long as possible before dying. The killer then drops down on his belly, takes aim and opens fire twice. One psychic suspected that this man knew Bobbie, had asked her out before and had even bothered her a few times at work. Bobbie never cared for him and wished he would just go away. The other psychic felt along those same lines but added that she thought this killing might have been a revenge thing against Jeff Oberholtzer but didn't say anything more about that.

When the psychics were driven to Sacremento Creek where Annette's body was found, they didn't feel much. Police were never certain if Annette was killed here or if this was simply where she was dumped when she was killed. Both psychics felt this wasn't the murder sight OR a dump sight. After walking a hunderd yards or so down the road, they found another area of the creek where they believed Annette's body was dumped. Over the next 6 months, the body slowly floated to where it was found the following July.

One psychic with Charlie McCormick drove around all afternoon and she directed him to where she believed Annette was driven to after she was picked up in Breckenridge. She was confident this was the exact location. The psychic said Annette was raped in the vehicle because the killer didn't have access to get inside a nearby trailer. She was allowed to get dressed and either escaped herself or was allowed to let go before being shot. Then with the help of the other man, put Annette in the trunk and drove her out to the creek.

Before the "update" the special concluded with Jeff Oberholtzer saying these murders have gone on unsolved for long enough. His family needs closure and Annette's family needs closure. I know there's probably a ton of other stuff I'm forgetting but this is what I remember off the top of my head.

[kadrmas15]

Hmm, well I think when Jeff Oberholtzer said 'a couple of strange guys' to be honest, he was probably assuming it would take more than one guy to take down his wife or that because there were two victims that more than one perpetrator was involved. You have to remember at the time of the UM segment, Jeff was still a suspect in the case although thankfully he was never charged.

I get I am pro defense so people will be skeptical, but while I believe a lot of people out there are innocent, there is something about Jeff Oberholtzer I do not know how to explain, but he was one, more than most people whose innocence I believe in, that when you heard the guy talk and look at his face and such, you could just tell he was telling the truth. I do not know how to explain it. Jeff I believe was not eliminated as a suspect until the mid 90's when DNA testing excluded him.

Interesting that Jeff and Bobbi were from Wisconsin. Listening to Jeff talk, I had thought he was from the midwest, you could tell by the accent, but I had no idea which state he was from, just knew he was from this region of this country based on the accent.

In looking at the case, yeah, I think the killer(s) were shocked that Bobbi fought back the way she did. For her to get out of the car the way she did and run about 100 yards before being shot, tells me that there was only one perpetrator on that one. But in listening about how she was, yeah, she would not have taken that, someone trying to assault her, she would have fought back with everything she had and I think the killer was just surprised by how much she fought back and then she was able to escape from the vehicle. Also, for the killer to shoot her considering she was a distance away from him, and it was nighttime, tells me he had some marksman skills.

Annette, yes, her body, I believe was not found until 6 months after her death, so yes, that makes sense to me that she was killed at another location and then dumped and her body continued to slowly float downstream until it was discovered in July of that year. I do think the same person or persons did this to both women. HOWEVER, the theory that it was more personal towards Bobbi makes sense too. I mean being shot in the back. I almost wonder if Annette was just collateral damage? That Bobbi was the one that he really wanted, but that he needed to get his courage up and 'practice' so he first lured Annette into his vehicle, raped and killed her and then drove back to Breckenridge.

[kadrmas15]

You know Thinman, you really are something. You have the gall to lecture me in another thread about how I was in 'poor form' because I disagreed with Lisa Kimmel's mother on the death penalty. I never told her what or how to think, I was merely disagreeing with her on the death penalty. Her and I did not agree with each other on the subject but we were respectful towards each other and that was that. However you have the gall to arrogantly lecture me and falsely accuse me of arguing with a victims mother and then you turn around and talk about how you think a murder victim was 'smoking hot'. Is that not also in poor form?

[Thinman]

Saying a girl was "smoking hot" is a compliment. That has nothing, at all, to do with her murder. I challenge you to find me one female out there that would not like that said about her. If I had said she was "beautiful", would that be more appropriate and not hurt your poor little feelings?

[kadrmas15]

Ouch Thinman. First off Thinman we are not talking about a living, breathing person. You referred to a murdered woman as 'smoking hot' I did not say you could not say it. I get what you were getting at but I really did not appreciate you lecturing me about proper etiquette when you said that a murder victim was 'smoking hot'.

[Thinman]

Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn what you appreciate. And, I made that post almost two months ago. Why didn't you respond to it back then? What did you do, search for all of my recent posts tonight, still seething over Tim Hennis going back to the chain gang?

[Mastermind]

Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn what you appreciate. And, I made that post almost two months ago. Why didn't you respond to it back then? What did you do, search for all of my recent posts tonight, still seething over Tim Hennis going back to the chain gang?

Vulgarity is the refuge of a coward.

[kadrmas15]

Agreed Mastermind.

[mattc]

So anyway......

I would love to have seen that special, but thanks dynoguy for giving that great summary. I was visualizing the area while I was reading your summary. I still say this was one of the creepiest segments ever on UM; especially the part when the car is slowly following Bobbie down the road..can you imagine her terror.

The one question I had: I'm still thinking about how likely Bobbie would be to get into a van with two (or even one) stranger(s), particularly someone from the past that she didn't really like or wanted to stay away. If the psychic is correct, then that means she got into the van with someone she did not care for and apparently wanted to stay away from her. That doesn't make sense.

The only thing I can think is that it was pretty late and she was just plain ready to get home, and calling Jeff would have meant having to wait 15-20 mins for him to get there.

Overall just a sad case. I wonder what Jeff is up to these days.

[Thinman]

Vulgarity is the refuge of a coward.

Great point! It's easy to spot the cowards online. Normally, internet message boards are just stocked full of courageous, brave warriors like you and kadrmas. I really hope to have guts like you someday!

[Mastermind]

Quote:
I really hope to have guts like you someday!

If you want to achieve that try walking foot in Anacostia during the 1990s in the old 6th PSAs.

[Thinman]

If you want to achieve that try walking foot in Anacostia during the 1990s in the old 6th PSAs.

Now, for exhibit B: internet braggadocio. The "I am bigger, badder, tougher, meaner, more successful, and prettier than you" syndrome. And to prove it, I will post it on an anonymous internet forum and make those weak little vulgar cowards feel even more inferior! That'll show 'em, 'cause I'm a man!

[crystaldawn]

Lets knock off the arguing back and forth or these posts will be deleted!

[Mastermind]

Your the moderator, Crystal, but I would suggest those posts should be deleted including my own. They add nothing to the conversation.