is the US sitcom really dead?

[waichingliu81]

How America stopped laughing

For more than two decades the US sitcom has reigned supreme. But the genre is suddenly out of favour with the networks. And the culprit? Those cheap British reality shows

Caryn Mandabach
Monday June 4, 2007
The Guardian

Twenty-two years ago, just before a pilot of The Cosby Show was screened at the New York "upfronts" (the annual dog and pony act that US television puts on for ad buyers), many critics were confidently declaring American television comedy to be dead. Pleasant procedural cop shows such as Magnum, P.I. and Simon & Simon dominated the ad-supported, lily-white airwaves, and there was not a single comedy in the top 40 programmes.

The argument was that character comedy, which had its roots in 1930s radio plays, simply was not relevant to a modern television audience. Though the network bosses hoped the jeremiahs were wrong - after all, the network with the number one comedy was always the number one network - then, as now, no one in power rushed to defend the genre. In fact, comedy has always been viewed as television's bright but embarrassing stepchild, skulking in the corner and licking the leftovers from other people's plates.

All that changed when, a few years later, The Cosby Show started to make money. Big money, especially for the independent production company that owned it. Bigger money than all the networks combined were pulling in from their in-house shows. Suddenly, everybody wanted in. The Cosby Show made so much money for its owners that in 1996 the networks successfully lobbied the Clinton administration to change the law to allow them to own 100% of the programmes they broadcast. Now, the vertically integrated big media companies commission 85% of their shows in-house, the independents have almost been driven out of business, and not a single comedy money-spinner has been developed for nearly a decade.

Still, we in the creative community live with the illusion of accomplishment. American writers churn out an average 200 comedy scripts a year (each paid, on average, $100,000) to get 50 produced pilots (average cost, $2 million each) to get (approximately) 10 new series (average cost, $20 million each) to, hopefully, get one new (fingers crossed) hit. As they say in Hollywood, we're talking real money here. Yet not since Will & Grace and That Seventies Show premiered within a few weeks of each other nearly nine years ago has anything even raised a pulse in American syndication markets. Sure, there's been the odd hit, or something off HBO, but, for the most part, network television comedy doesn't seem to be connecting with the audiences in that nice (kerching!) way anymore. So, apart from the colossal financial waste, what is going on?

First, reality television (thanks, Britain!) is cheap, and, though it doesn't repeat well, it consistently occupies at least a third of any schedule. In fact, the buys this year reflect a decrease not only in narrative comedy, but in scripted programming in general. It's just no fun owning this kind of stuff when DVD sales are flattening out, repeats are not delivering, and international buyers are not keen.

In addition, the networks have picked up quite a few spin-offs of existing dramas this year, thus cutting costs by doubling up on writing and production staff, and reducing the need for new ideas.

On top of all that, the smart money is betting there will be a Writers Guild of America strike in October, which is not funny for the networks, and for which they are preparing by arming themselves with increasing amounts of "reality".

Second, television is a middle-aged medium that has almost given up on providing scripted stuff for the kids, who have registered the lack of interest and gone elsewhere for their giggles. So the audience is not renewing itself. Third, even older viewers know how to use their DVD recorders, so why would anyone pay attention to network schedules anyway?

The networks' thinking goes like this. "Things aren't looking good for us. We need to find a way to make more money, pronto. Those scripted comedies are costing too much to produce. No one agrees on what's funny anyway - even our cool niche cable channels can't seem to come up with any winners. The syndication market sucks, we're spending our own money on you, dammit, and we've tried and tried but nothing's worked, and we're frustrated after eight years of this ****, and wipe those crumbs off your chin you stupid idiot!"

So, all you Brit comedy writers, the next time you whinge about how the BBC, ITV, Channel 4 or any other UK network deals with your scripts - how they mis-schedule them, how they never get back to you, how they give you inscrutable notes when they finally do - just remember that you may go through some rough patches, but you are also loved, appreciated, and sometimes even well paid.

· Caryn Mandabach produced The Cosby Show and Roseanne. She has a first-look deal with the BBC

i saw this article on a UK newspaper website 'The Guardian' and i was wondering whether what she has written rings true, according to you. the state of tv is so sad to see nowadays. is the sitcom really dead in the water? what advice would you give to up and coming sitcom writers and what would you say to the current ones that are around today?

[JulieSomoski]

Wow, that was perfectly put. There has not been a really successful sitcom since The Cosby Show and Roseanne. These 2 shows were really funny, and kept us glued to the telelvision for years. Ever since The Cosby Show went off the air, TV has become stale, especially sitcoms. Many have tried. Friends and Seinfeld were probably the 2 most successful left, yet they were nothing compared to the Cosby Show.

Now, in my opinion, sitcoms right now are dead. You can't find a good sitcom these days even on TV Land. But, if a good sitcom were to come around, then everybody would watch. But, ther is no good sitcom these days. So, I voted that there is still hope, yet currently, they are dead.

[waichingliu81]

Wow, that was perfectly put. There has not been a really successful sitcom since The Cosby Show and Roseanne. These 2 shows were really funny, and kept us glued to the telelvision for years. Ever since The Cosby Show went off the air, TV has become stale, especially sitcoms. Many have tried. Friends and Seinfeld were probably the 2 most successful left, yet they were nothing compared to the Cosby Show.

Now, in my opinion, sitcoms right now are dead. You can't find a good sitcom these days even on TV Land. But, if a good sitcom were to come around, then everybody would watch. But, ther is no good sitcom these days. So, I voted that there is still hope, yet currently, they are dead.

actually, i didn't say all that- it's just that i noticed this article in a newspaper on the internet and thought this would make for an interesting post. anyway back to your comments, i find that what you have posted here is interesting. personally i would blame the current upsurge in reality tv and the increase in these shows for the decline in sitcoms

[mraw]

Home Improvement was the last sitcom to really make me laugh out loud. I think that most sictoms today are based more within reality, and that makes them less funny (save for a few good one-liners). Several sitcoms are quite entertaining to me, just not lol funny.

[blue4t]

I really hope the sitcom is not dead. I think it just needs to be revamped. What current sitcoms are popular shows in the US? Scrubs is popular right now among people my age. I think there are some sitcoms that are popular or maybe semi-popular like Two and a Half Men and My Name is Earl. Apart from that there's really nothing. Part of it is there are so many reality shows out there, but I think another part is that creators/writers are trying too hard to copy other popular, long lasting sitcoms. When Friends was nearing it's end, there were tons (at least to me) shows popping up about a group of 20something friends trying to make it in the world (and most of the time, being paired up). Originality is key here. It is hard because a lot of ideas have already been used. Its OK to reuse an idea, it just has to be made so that it is uniquely separate from everything else.

[waichingliu81]

I really hope the sitcom is not dead. I think it just needs to be revamped. What current sitcoms are popular shows in the US? Scrubs is popular right now among people my age. I think there are some sitcoms that are popular or maybe semi-popular like Two and a Half Men and My Name is Earl. Apart from that there's really nothing. Part of it is there are so many reality shows out there, but I think another part is that creators/writers are trying too hard to copy other popular, long lasting sitcoms. When Friends was nearing it's end, there were tons (at least to me) shows popping up about a group of 20something friends trying to make it in the world (and most of the time, being paired up). Originality is key here. It is hard because a lot of ideas have already been used. Its OK to reuse an idea, it just has to be made so that it is uniquely separate from everything else.

yeah, the sitcom genre has become stale and it needs an injection of not just originality but also new and inventive storylines, themes, characters, plot ideas etc. i don't know whether you'd call ugly betty a 'sitcom' but it has done well for itself and thus, it has sitcom elements encompassed within it

[Justafan65]

I would say that the last sitcom that made me laugh out loud was Still Standing. I think it was highly under-rated. Loved Seinfeld, Cosby, Cheers, Frasier and According to Jim too. I must say, I read a lot of scripts and not many make me laugh out loud. It's hard enough to do that when I am watching a show but to read something and actually lol is a challenge. I did just that several times on a pilot I read this spriing. Unfortunately, it didn't get picked up but I hope that isn't a continued sign that the networks think we need to be "told" when to laugh by showing us uncreative and silly humor (ie Cavemen?) and instead will allow us to see the humor in shows that we can all relate to by finding the humor in real life situations.

[comedyfreak]

I think the traditional sitcom is dead, there's nothing out there that is really funny anymore. Of the new shows I like How I Met Your Mother and Adventures of Old Christine.

[waichingliu81]

it is why i watch the classic sitcoms of yesteryear, as opposed to the current ones. it's as if nobody in tv land in the US care about this genre as much as they should. they are letting it rot into a corpse, whilst at the same time, they have stiffled the production of sitcoms by allowing reality tv shows to dominate the tv schedules now and then. it's a very sad situation for us sitcom fanatics to see this genre being neglected, all in favour of 'voyeuristic tv' where the concept of being looked at has gone as far as watching former a-list celebs reclaim their past glories and where people's real lives are- due to their exploits on screen- being cheapened to the extreme

[EmoJoe]

if we're only counting the "traditional" sitcoms (ie with a laugh track, multi-camera...ect), then yes, i think it is dead. those type of shows just aren't popular anymore...the "typical" sitcoms, with the big family and kids and blah blah blah. those type of shows IMO are dead and buried - and it's understandable, how many times can you watch those type of shows without it getting old?

if we're counting single-camera sitcoms though (ie Scrubs, 30 Rock, The Office). then i say no..they aren't the "traditional" sitcom, but i think those types of shows are the new sitcom, and people need to reliaze that and try and accept them. those type of shows are really popular with my age group and i think they are the new generation of sitcoms. if people actually watched them and gave them a chance instead of whining about how they don't have a laugh track and aren't "traditional" then maybe they will become MORE then semi-hits.

just my thoughts.

[waichingliu81]

if we're only counting the "traditional" sitcoms (ie with a laugh track, multi-camera...ect), then yes, i think it is dead. those type of shows just aren't popular anymore...the "typical" sitcoms, with the big family and kids and blah blah blah. those type of shows IMO are dead and buried - and it's understandable, how many times can you watch those type of shows without it getting old?

if we're counting single-camera sitcoms though (ie Scrubs, 30 Rock, The Office). then i say no..they aren't the "traditional" sitcom, but i think those types of shows are the new sitcom, and people need to reliaze that and try and accept them. those type of shows are really popular with my age group and i think they are the new generation of sitcoms. if people actually watched them and gave them a chance instead of whining about how they don't have a laugh track and aren't "traditional" then maybe they will become MORE then semi-hits.

just my thoughts.

what you have posted here joe is great. though i am more of a fan of the multi-camera, laughter track- type of sitcoms, although everybody hates chris and ugly betty are shows that i love watching- and yet those use just a single-camera .

[USATVFAN]

Between the years 1971-2003 were the best sitcoms.

[Stuck In The '70's]

if we're only counting the "traditional" sitcoms (ie with a laugh track, multi-camera...ect), then yes, i think it is dead. those type of shows just aren't popular anymore...the "typical" sitcoms, with the big family and kids and blah blah blah. those type of shows IMO are dead and buried - and it's understandable, how many times can you watch those type of shows without it getting old?

if we're counting single-camera sitcoms though (ie Scrubs, 30 Rock, The Office). then i say no..they aren't the "traditional" sitcom, but i think those types of shows are the new sitcom, and people need to reliaze that and try and accept them. those type of shows are really popular with my age group and i think they are the new generation of sitcoms. if people actually watched them and gave them a chance instead of whining about how they don't have a laugh track and aren't "traditional" then maybe they will become MORE then semi-hits.

just my thoughts.
The only one of those type of sitcoms I like is My Name Is Earl. I tried watching The Office and Scrubs and I couldn't get into them.

[waichingliu81]

Between the years 1971-2003 were the best sitcoms.

yeah i'd agree with you, those were the days when american sitcoms were at its prime. but now, i despair at the present state that it is in right now

[waichingliu81]

The only one of those type of sitcoms I like is My Name Is Earl. I tried watching The Office and Scrubs and I couldn't get into them.

i've never got into them either, likewise the hype surrounding the office is so OTT. why anyone would consider that show humourous- US or UK version- is beyond me. i cannot stand that type of humour, and it's that kind of humour of which the makers assume it's funny when to the majority of us, its not

[Stuck In The '70's]

i've never got into them either, likewise the hype surrounding the office is so OTT. why anyone would consider that show humourous- US or UK version- is beyond me. i cannot stand that type of humour, and it's that kind of humour of which the makers assume it's funny when to the majority of us, its not
I've tried watching the office and I find myself daydreaming. lol

The last sitcoms I watched regularly ( every week) was 8 Simple Rules ( which deteriorated after John Ritter died) and Grounded For Life. It's really sad because I grew up watching sitcoms. It was a big part of my childhood. The sitcoms from the 60's-80's were the best. I was never a Friend fan so when it and the clones came out I started watching dramas more. BTW Ugly Betty is a great show but I don't know if it is considered a sitcom or not.

[waichingliu81]

I've tried watching the office and I find myself daydreaming. lol

The last sitcoms I watched regularly ( every week) was 8 Simple Rules ( which deteriorated after John Ritter died) and Grounded For Life. It's really sad because I grew up watching sitcoms. It was a big part of my childhood. The sitcoms from the 60's-80's were the best. I was never a Friend fan so when it and the clones came out I started watching dramas more. BTW Ugly Betty is a great show but I don't know if it is considered a sitcom or not.

yeah, i know what you mean. ugly betty is more of a dramedy, as opposed to a sitcom. but back to the subject, the sitcoms of today that use a laughter track aren't successful anymore. i don't think it's to do with the fact it uses a laughter track that those type of sitcoms are no longer popular, but more to do with poor scripts, lack of good ideas, characters and being less funnier than they were 30 odd years ago or so

[Stuck In The '70's]

yeah, i know what you mean. ugly betty is more of a dramedy, as opposed to a sitcom. but back to the subject, the sitcoms of today that use a laughter track aren't successful anymore. i don't think it's to do with the fact it uses a laughter track that those type of sitcoms are no longer popular, but more to do with poor scripts, lack of good ideas, characters and being less funnier than they were 30 odd years ago or so
Yea because if you look at the sitcoms that are playing all over America in syndication most of them have laughtracks( a studio Audience). I think the problem is that the shows themselves aren't that funny and they are being populated by characters nobody cares about. Plus you are right about all the reality shows. I can't stand them and they are taking good timeslots away from sitcoms. I wish their was another Bill Cosby coming up on the horizon. I think the sitcom is in worst shape today than it was back in 1984.

[blue4t]

I like Scrubs and I occasionally watch The Office, but with the King of Queens ending, there is really nothing that I have to watch every week. The last show I really felt this way about was Friends. It was funny and I laughed with every new episode. There's nothing like that anymore. Sitcoms nowadays are OK with having episodes splattered throughout the season that's not funny as long as a few of them are over the top.

[waichingliu81]

Yea because if you look at the sitcoms that are playing all over America in syndication most of them have laughtracks( a studio Audience). I think the problem is that the shows themselves aren't that funny and they are being populated by characters nobody cares about. Plus you are right about all the reality shows. I can't stand them and they are taking good timeslots away from sitcoms. I wish their was another Bill Cosby coming up on the horizon. I think the sitcom is in worst shape today than it was back in 1984.

american sitcoms are the pits right now. also, i wanted to ask you guys in the States do you think britain is to blame for the state of tv in america? do you blame the british and the likes of simon cowell for constantly feeding us heaps and heaps of reality tv garbage? i mean to be honest, if there's one thing, speaking as a brit, reality tv originated in the UK, only for it to spead across the globe and in particular transatlantically in the US. and so it's britain who came up with the dross that is reality tv and passed it off to you folks out there. would you agree?

[EmoJoe]

another thing is networks aren't as willing to give chances anymore...if a show gets low ratings, in most cases it's cancelled immeditaley. back in the DAY, shows were given more of a chance. most shows in their first seasons aren't as popular or good as they are in their middle/later seasons, so although a lot of the sitcoms may seem bad, give them some time and they always could grow.

[waichingliu81]

another thing is networks aren't as willing to give chances anymore...if a show gets low ratings, in most cases it's cancelled immeditaley. back in the DAY, shows were given more of a chance. most shows in their first seasons aren't as popular or good as they are in their middle/later seasons, so although a lot of the sitcoms may seem bad, give them some time and they always could grow.

exactly, it's as if a show isn't successful in it's first season, it gets cancelled straight away. of course there are some exceptions but sadly, it's as if tv executives are willing to tolerate crappy reality tv shows instead of good hearted sitcoms. what i find extraordinary but also sad is that if one reality show flops, another one comes along and takes it place and so on and so forth, whilst nowadays if a sitcom bombs, there is rarely a good alternative avaliable. i would compare the on going mass production of cheap and tedious reality tv shows to a conveyor belt of nothing but crap- they are reproduced and mass marketed over and over again and there's no stopping them

[blue4t]

I think they need to give shows a chance. It would stop them from having to bring out twice as much drivle and it may help them find a gem in what they thought was coal.

[Stuck In The '70's]

another thing is networks aren't as willing to give chances anymore...if a show gets low ratings, in most cases it's cancelled immeditaley. back in the DAY, shows were given more of a chance. most shows in their first seasons aren't as popular or good as they are in their middle/later seasons, so although a lot of the sitcoms may seem bad, give them some time and they always could grow.
That's true. Both Cheers and Family Ties were not hits during their first season. It took Seinfeld quite a long time to becaome a hit too.

[Stuck In The '70's]

exactly, it's as if a show isn't successful in it's first season, it gets cancelled straight away. of course there are some exceptions but sadly, it's as if tv executives are willing to tolerate crappy reality tv shows instead of good hearted sitcoms. what i find extraordinary but also sad is that if one reality show flops, another one comes along and takes it place and so on and so forth, whilst nowadays if a sitcom bombs, there is rarely a good alternative avaliable. i would compare the on going mass production of cheap and tedious reality tv shows to a conveyor belt of nothing but crap- they are reproduced and mass marketed over and over again and there's no stopping them
Reality shows are so cheap to produce and they look cheap too that they just put one on when another one fails. A good sitcom takes time to develop. Also if their is one good sitcom that does come on it's usually partnered with one that isn't that great and people like myself that watch a lot of dramas aren't willing to watch one half hour and then wait until the top of the hour for something else to come on. That's what happens with me and My Name Is Earl. Its a good show but I have no interest in the Office so I'll usually skip it and just watch Smallville instead.

[waichingliu81]

That's true. Both Cheers and Family Ties were not hits during their first season. It took Seinfeld quite a long time to becaome a hit too.

yeah but the thing is back then during the 80s, sitcoms were as successful and popular and although it took a while for those shows to find its own feet and it's own audiences, american sitcoms were at the forefront of US TV. in the UK, out of those three, the brits never warmed to seinfeld because they couldn't understand the humour in that show. it was different to other US sitcoms such as mork and mindy, cheers, happy days etc. and yet so many of them never laughed along with the jokes and the one-liners in seinfeld

[Skywalker]

I think sitcoms are in worse shape now than they've ever been. The only sitcom to even make the top 20 in the ratings is Two and a Half Men. I believe that it's the last classic sitcom too as far as traditional sitcoms go. Once that show goes off the air, I'd be surprised to see any other sitcoms left on the air.

I like The Office and My Name is Earl but I don't see these shows lasting a very long time. And it's a shame too cause they're both very funny well written shows. Maybe another 2 years for Earl and 2-3 for the Office. These shows just don't do very well in the ratings.

It's going to take more than a miracle for sitcoms to become popular again, I just don't see it happening. As long as you've got Simon telling people they can't sing, people trying to "survive" on an island and Big Brother watching, sitcoms are always going to be treated like a red headed step-child. :(

[troopoleon8897]

It's Not As Great as it used to be but I dont think it is completely dead, I believed it flatlined in 02 but this year it has been rejuvinated current network shows that I think are still good:

King Of The Hill
The Simpsons
Family Guy
Everybody Hates Chris
How I Met Your Mother
Two And A Half Men
Rules Of Engagement
The New Adventures Of Old Christine
According To Jim
'Til Death
The Office
30 Rock
My Name Is Earl

And Cable Shows:

Weeds
It's Always Sunny In Philadelphia
My Boys
Curb Your Enthusiasm

[Stuck In The '70's]

I think sitcoms are in worse shape now than they've ever been. The only sitcom to even make the top 20 in the ratings is Two and a Half Men. I believe that it's the last classic sitcom too as far as traditional sitcoms go. Once that show goes off the air, I'd be surprised to see any other sitcoms left on the air.

I like The Office and My Name is Earl but I don't see these shows lasting a very long time. And it's a shame too cause they're both very funny well written shows. Maybe another 2 years for Earl and 2-3 for the Office. These shows just don't do very well in the ratings.

It's going to take more than a miracle for sitcoms to become popular again, I just don't see it happening. As long as you've got Simon telling people they can't sing, people trying to "survive" on an island and Big Brother watching, sitcoms are always going to be treated like a red headed step-child. :(
I think that's why Sitcoms Online is so popular and I'm not really talking about the message boards. All you have to do is look up a sitcom over on the main board and visit all the links and it really takes you back. That's what got me addicted to this place in the first place. I'm afraid you might be right about sitcoms after Two And A Half Men leave. I am optimistic, however, about the new Patricia Heaton-Kelsey Grammer sitcom though but if they flop I don't think anybody can do it.

[Stuck In The '70's]

It's Not As Great as it used to be but I dont think it is completely dead, I believed it flatlined in 02 but this year it has been rejuvinated current network shows that I think are still good:

King Of The Hill
The Simpsons
Family Guy
Everybody Hates Chris
How I Met Your Mother
Two And A Half Men
Rules Of Engagement
The New Adventures Of Old Christine
According To Jim
'Til Death
The Office
30 Rock
My Name Is Earl

And Cable Shows:

Weeds
It's Always Sunny In Philadelphia
My Boys
Curb Your Enthusiasm
I like My Name Is Earl and Weeds is pretty good. I think the Simpsons and KOTH are way past their prime. I haven't watched much of the rest of them. I used to watch Two And A Half Men but it comes on opposite Monday Night Football, 24 and Heroes so it loses by default.

[freshprinceofLA]

It's been pretty long since i've seen a good sitcom. All the story lines have been done all the issues have been pretty much tackled what other story's is there to do I think the sitcom in general is dead

[Skywalker]

I think that's why Sitcoms Online is so popular and I'm not really talking about the message boards. All you have to do is look up a sitcom over on the main board and visit all the links and it really takes you back. That's what got me addicted to this place in the first place. I'm afraid you might be right about sitcoms after Two And A Half Men leave. I am optimistic, however, about the new Patricia Heaton-Kelsey Grammer sitcom though but if they flop I don't think anybody can do it.


Yeah, I used to go to the main board all the time. I was just amazed at all the sitcom links and I went there for a year before I ever realized that there was a message board at SO. :lol:

I'm a big fan of both Heaton and Grammer and I really hope the show does great in the ratings but since the show will be airing on Fox, I have a bad feeling that it won't last very long. :(

[Stuck In The '70's]

Yeah, I used to go to the main board all the time. I was just amazed at all the sitcom links and I went there for a year before I ever realized that there was a message board at SO. :lol:

I'm a big fan of both Heaton and Grammer and I really hope the show does great in the ratings but since the show will be airing on Fox, I have a bad feeling that it won't last very long. :(
For me it was 3 years. :lol:

It's going to be paired with Till Death. Have you seen this show and is it any good? It looks interesting but I never watched it. :lol:

[EmoJoe]

It's Not As Great as it used to be but I dont think it is completely dead, I believed it flatlined in 02 but this year it has been rejuvinated current network shows that I think are still good:

King Of The Hill
The Simpsons
Family Guy
Everybody Hates Chris
How I Met Your Mother
Two And A Half Men
Rules Of Engagement
The New Adventures Of Old Christine
According To Jim
'Til Death
The Office
30 Rock
My Name Is Earl

And Cable Shows:

Weeds
It's Always Sunny In Philadelphia
My Boys
Curb Your Enthusiasm
i agree, there ARE a lot of good ones still out their, maybe not as much as 10/20/30 years ago, but there are still some good ones. :nod:

[Skywalker]

For me it was 3 years. :lol:

It's going to be paired with Till Death. Have you seen this show and is it any good? It looks interesting but I never watched it. :lol:

:lol:

It's ok but it's not a show I'd remember to watch every week. Brad Garrett and Joely Fisher are good and they have great chemistry but I don't really care for the young couple (can't remember their names).

[noveel]

Reality shows are cheap to produce, sitcoms cost more to produce. It's about profits, not ratings. A low rated show will stay on if it's cheap to produce.

[troopoleon8897]

i've never got into them either, likewise the hype surrounding the office is so OTT. why anyone would consider that show humourous- US or UK version- is beyond me. i cannot stand that type of humour, and it's that kind of humour of which the makers assume it's funny when to the majority of us, its not

I completely understand that this isn't your kind of show and that you dont like the humour in it, however I think me and about 12 million other fans (8million live viewers, and 4 million Tivo viewers on average) will agree that your last statement is false, lol... The show is definately something you got to get into but it has a very well earned cult and critical following that believes the show is funny...

[mraw]

I can't believe I forgot Everybody Hates Chris. That is my favorite sitcom ever! I guess there is hope for the sitcom...

[ethelmaepotter]

Sitcoms in the US have been lame since 1980. There was all this talk in the 1980s how shows like Family Ties and The Cosby Show "saved" the future of the sitcom. Now, we see these shows in syndication and we ask, "How did these shows save an already dead genre?" (I never understand the success of either of the aforementioned series anyway.)

Then you had "Roseanne" (an all-time low in sticoms), "Seinfeld" (much ado about nothing) and "Everybody Loves Raymond" (well, not everyone). "King of Queens" (Egad! Help Me!) "Will & Grace" (a 22-minute romp in the stereotypical week after week).

Anyway, yes. The sitcom is dead and the batch of no-talent nitwits that populate Hollywood these days because of their family ties are not going to improve the situation one bit.

Thank God so many great classic shows are out on DVD now. We need good shows and this is the only way to get them. Prime-time is now Grime-time. Lucy, Andy & Ozzie & Harriet....where are you when we need you?

[waichingliu81]

I think that's why Sitcoms Online is so popular and I'm not really talking about the message boards. All you have to do is look up a sitcom over on the main board and visit all the links and it really takes you back. That's what got me addicted to this place in the first place. I'm afraid you might be right about sitcoms after Two And A Half Men leave. I am optimistic, however, about the new Patricia Heaton-Kelsey Grammer sitcom though but if they flop I don't think anybody can do it.

the reason why i love coming on this site is because i can discuss my favourite classic sitcom shows on here and because there is so much to discuss. with the old shows, there can be only so much we can bring up to the forefront whilst with today, it's something we cannot do with all of the current shows that are on at the moment. and besides, most of them don't offer anything worth talking about, but rather they exist just for us to vent our disagreements and how disatisified we are with the state of the sitcom genre on tv in america

[waichingliu81]

Reality shows are cheap to produce, sitcoms cost more to produce. It's about profits, not ratings. A low rated show will stay on if it's cheap to produce.

i understand where you're coming from. with reality shows they don't have numerous sets and locations- therefore financially, there are not so much of a risk to take and make. all those reality tv executives and producers care about is the benjamins- eg, the dollar bills- they really don't give a damn about talent. why watch a talentless, desperate fame-seeking wannabe over a bunch of well established, highly talented and credible actors doing well on a good sitcom?

[waichingliu81]

I completely understand that this isn't your kind of show and that you dont like the humour in it, however I think me and about 12 million other fans (8million live viewers, and 4 million Tivo viewers on average) will agree that your last statement is false, lol... The show is definately something you got to get into but it has a very well earned cult and critical following that believes the show is funny...

yeah, you got a point. besides, different strokes for different folks and there are certain sitcoms people will like and there will be ones people will dislike as well. it's all a matter of personal choice and if you're a fan of the show, then so be it, regardless of what others think. if everyone liked the same show or same type of show, then it gets rather boring, repetitive and tedious. so therefore choice is good

[troopoleon8897]

yeah, you got a point. besides, different strokes for different folks and there are certain sitcoms people will like and there will be ones people will dislike as well. it's all a matter of personal choice and if you're a fan of the show, then so be it, regardless of what others think. if everyone liked the same show or same type of show, then it gets rather boring, repetitive and tedious. so therefore choice is good

Very True, Choice is good and I think thats part of the reason the sitcom was dying, Every Network wants their show to be the most popular and sometimes its just not gonna happen, so were not left a choice of what we like because we may choose to like the show but the network may not and then it gets cancelled...

[waichingliu81]

Very True, Choice is good and I think thats part of the reason the sitcom was dying, Every Network wants their show to be the most popular and sometimes its just not gonna happen, so were not left a choice of what we like because we may choose to like the show but the network may not and then it gets cancelled...

you're right, it's as if it's one huge popularity contest to see who will get the most ratings. it shouldn't be about 'which is better out of friends, frasier, seinfeld, everybody loves raymond?' or whatever. i'd rather that sitcoms and the writers of sitcoms concerntrated their efforts on their fanbase and audience and keeping them intrigued and interested, as opposed to the tv critics and everybody else, inc the sitcom fans in general because the thing is not everyone will be a fan of that particular show, as they would much prefer to watch a different (type of) sitcom instead

[noveel]

Sitcoms might come back when they need more profits from syndication, reality shows door poorly in syndication

[waichingliu81]

Sitcoms might come back when they need more profits from syndication, reality shows door poorly in syndication

i just hope that the so-called reality tv phenomena dies a quick and painful death; yes 00s sitcoms are nowhere near as good as the 50s-90s equivalents, but the genre has been around long enough to make a comeback whilst reality tv, as depressing, annoying and tacky as it is, hasn't existed that long a time. it is only recently as say 3 years ago when it all kicked off sadly and hence less and less sitcoms were being commisioned, produced and televised

[EmoJoe]

reality shows seem to be dying out already. they aren't as popular as they were like 3-4 years ago. the last one i could really think of that hit was America's Got Talent last year and that's more of a competition then a reality show...they seem to have moved to cable. the curent big ones (Flavor of Love, Laguna Beach, I Love New York) are all on cable now. dramas are the big thing at the moment - CSI, Grey's Anatomy, Heroes...ect. game shows seem to be making a comeback too, so it would seem logical that sitcoms may do the same thing in the near future.

[waichingliu81]

reality shows seem to be dying out already. they aren't as popular as they were like 3-4 years ago. the last one i could really think of that hit was America's Got Talent last year and that's more of a competition then a reality show. right now, dramas are the big thing - CSI, Grey's Anatomy, Heroes...ect.

i hate reality tv shows but also i am neither a fan of those dramas that you mentioned- there is too much hype surrounding them, i don't know why in this day in age tv has to be so serious all the time. although the events of sept 11 may have something to do with it, perhaps. i'd rather watch a show that will bring a smile to my face, rather than one which does not

[EmoJoe]

i'm not a big fan of dramas either, but at least it's scripted stuff and not reality TV crap.

[AB]

It does seem like we're getting fewer good sitcoms, but maybe things will pick up in a year or two.

[Big3sCompanyFan]

I agree that sitcoms are basically dead especially now because they just cancelled George Lopez which is a JOKE!! HOW can they consider keeping According to Jim and 2 rookie shows with lower ratings plus bring a new caveman (?!?!?) show and dump the funniest sitcom on TV today!! It's riduclous!

The George Lopez show was basically the last good sitcom left and there has not been an excellent sitcom since Fresh Prince which is one of the best of all time.

The golden age of sitoms must've been the 70s to early 80s when you had such MEGA hits like Three's Company, Jeffersons, Alice, Happy Days, Diff'rent Strokes, Family Ties, etc.

Sitcoms are nothing like what they used to be!! So you better watch TV Land or Nick at Nite!

[Big3sCompanyFan]

It's been pretty long since i've seen a good sitcom. All the story lines have been done all the issues have been pretty much tackled what other story's is there to do I think the sitcom in general is dead

EXACTLY. They've already covered the same plots and storylines over and over again.

Fresh Prince was one of the very few sitcoms that could've kept going for years longer since they had such an extended cast.

Even James Avery said they could've gone on another 3 or 4 YEARS only if Will Smith wanted to stay!

You should've stayed Will since you were much better in Fresh Prince then you were in any one of your movies! I think it's because in Fresh Prince he could just be himself and he didn't have to pretend to be someone he's not.

[waichingliu81]

It does seem like we're getting fewer good sitcoms, but maybe things will pick up in a year or two.

i am keeping my fingers crossed that this will happen soon, though the writers need to come up with something new, fresh and different to what we had in the 50s right up to early 2000. tv is never the same without the good, odd sitcom or two, or three, four etc. it's time that reality tv was ditched for good and that less emphasis is placed on dramas. i don't really care much for desperate housewives, 24, prison break, etc, but rather sitcoms instead. all of us on this site want decent american sitcoms screened

[waichingliu81]

I agree that sitcoms are basically dead especially now because they just cancelled George Lopez which is a JOKE!! HOW can they consider keeping According to Jim and 2 rookie shows with lower ratings plus bring a new caveman (?!?!?) show and dump the funniest sitcom on TV today!! It's riduclous!

The George Lopez show was basically the last good sitcom left and there has not been an excellent sitcom since Fresh Prince which is one of the best of all time.

The golden age of sitoms must've been the 70s to early 80s when you had such MEGA hits like Three's Company, Jeffersons, Alice, Happy Days, Diff'rent Strokes, Family Ties, etc.

Sitcoms are nothing like what they used to be!! So you better watch TV Land or Nick at Nite!

Big3sCompanyFAn- i loved the fresh prince of bel air, it's one of my all-time favourites, even though it did go downhill during the last 2 or 3 seasons. as for that last quote, unfortunately i live the UK and so we don't have tv land or nick at nite. instead on cable and satalite tv, we have the paramount comedy channel which screens american sitcoms- old and current ones, stand up shows, as well as british comedy

[waichingliu81]

.....

Fresh Prince was one of the very few sitcoms that could've kept going for years longer since they had such an extended cast.

Even James Avery said they could've gone on another 3 or 4 YEARS only if Will Smith wanted to stay!

You should've stayed Will since you were much better in Fresh Prince then you were in any one of your movies! I think it's because in Fresh Prince he could just be himself and he didn't have to pretend to be someone he's not.

i always preferred will in the fresh prince, as opposed to the films he has done, as i've never been that big a fan of his movies. personally speaking, i think that he should've stuck with tv

[Stuck In The '70's]

I agree that sitcoms are basically dead especially now because they just cancelled George Lopez which is a JOKE!! HOW can they consider keeping According to Jim and 2 rookie shows with lower ratings plus bring a new caveman (?!?!?) show and dump the funniest sitcom on TV today!! It's riduclous!

The George Lopez show was basically the last good sitcom left and there has not been an excellent sitcom since Fresh Prince which is one of the best of all time.

The golden age of sitoms must've been the 70s to early 80s when you had such MEGA hits like Three's Company, Jeffersons, Alice, Happy Days, Diff'rent Strokes, Family Ties, etc.

Sitcoms are nothing like what they used to be!! So you better watch TV Land or Nick at Nite!
Unfortunately TV Land isn't what it used to be...picking up Extreme Makeover. Who wants to watch a reality show in reruns? :rolleyes:

[AB]

Unfortunately TV Land isn't what it used to be...picking up Extreme Makeover. Who wants to watch a reality show in reruns? :rolleyes:


Good Grief! What are they thinking? :eek:

[Big3sCompanyFan]

i always preferred will in the fresh prince, as opposed to the films he has done, as i've never been that big a fan of his movies. personally speaking, i think that he should've stuck with tv

Yeah, I don't see how anyone could disagree that Will Smith was much better in the Fresh Prince than any of his movies. I mean I'm sure he acted good in Muhammad Ali (I never saw it) but who cares?? It didn't make much money since not that many people are going to go and see a movie about Ali.

Will should've done the Fresh Prince for at least another couple of years since men are accepted to be older that women in hollywood. Plus he could've done some creative scheduling and done both simultaneously.

It seems the case was begging Will to stay 1 more year. They should at least do a Fresh Prince reuinion movie. That would be great!

[JT]

Yeah, I don't see how anyone could disagree that Will Smith was much better in the Fresh Prince than any of his movies. I mean I'm sure he acted good in Muhammad Ali (I never saw it) but who cares?? It didn't make much money since not that many people are going to go and see a movie about Ali.

Will should've done the Fresh Prince for at least another couple of years since men are accepted to be older that women in hollywood. Plus he could've done some creative scheduling and done both simultaneously.

It seems the case was begging Will to stay 1 more year. They should at least do a Fresh Prince reuinion movie. That would be great!
Um...actually, and I'm not trying to be a smart ass or anything, but...well, "Ali" made over $87 million and got Will Smith an Academy Award nomination, so I don't think he regrets doing that movie.

[noveel]

Good Grief! What are they thinking? :eek:
I think they are trying to become a baby boomer themed lifestyle channel. Wouldn't HGTV be a better place for that show?

[noveel]

It seems the case was begging Will to stay 1 more year. They should at least do a Fresh Prince reuinion movie. That would be great![/QUOTE]

I'm sure Nick@Nite would love to do that.

[Stuck In The '70's]

Um...actually, and I'm not trying to be a smart ass or anything, but...well, "Ali" made over $87 million and got Will Smith an Academy Award nomination, so I don't think he regrets doing that movie.
yea and he was nominated for an academy award again last year. I don't think Will Smith has any regrets.

[noveel]

Next, they'll just start airing stuff off youtube.

[waichingliu81]

It seems the case was begging Will to stay 1 more year. They should at least do a Fresh Prince reuinion movie. That would be great!

I'm sure Nick@Nite would love to do that.[/QUOTE]

that would be interesting and besides, if fox and matt groening can make a movie on the simpsons, then i don't see why nbc cannot do the same for the fresh prince

[waichingliu81]

wow! i never thought this thread would generate so many responses but thanks guys! your comments have been interesting, lively and echoed many of our feelings on this topic:)

[neon000]

Most shows these days seem to be really bitter, just knee-jerk exercises in old cliches. The people impress me as pretty awful to spend your time with. You need a balance of the good and bad in characters to want to watch them on a regular basis.

[waichingliu81]

Most shows these days seem to be really bitter, just knee-jerk exercises in old cliches. The people impress me as pretty awful to spend your time with. You need a balance of the good and bad in characters to want to watch them on a regular basis.

yeah, you do have a point. it's important to have a mixture of different personalities and types of characters in sitcoms. otherwise, if all of them were the same and acted as the same type of character, then there would be no substance. yes with the bad characters, we would dislike them just as much, but also by having them in sitcoms, it often brings further excitement or interest to the storyline. although they can also ruin a sitcom as well. it all depends really

[JT]

This is in response to reply #60, which was written by noveel.

You bring up an excellent point, I think. I think that there is a serious problem with channels who claim to cater to a particular audience, meaning the channels that are "for women," "for African Americans," "for teenagers," "for baby boomers," etc. They make it seem as if *every* black person wants to watch "The Wayans Bros." every afternoon (which...well....I kinda like "The Wayans Bros," but still). Or as if *every* woman wants to watch "Overly Melodramatic Title: The Insert Name Here Story" (which, of course...I like those too). And that's another thing. These channels claim to be for one specific audience, so they basically neglect any viewers who don't fall into that category. I know for a fact that many men watch Lifetime and LMN. But Lifetime acts as if that's not true. I don't even have to tell you how many teenagers have watched channels geared towards older folks over the years.

I think the answer to those problems is simple. Scrap the "for whoever" channels and make channels "of whatever." I mean, devote entire channels to one genre or production company or whatever else they can think of. Of course, many channels have found ways to even screw up that formula (GSN, SOAPnet, Sci-Fi, I'm looking at you!), but if there was a set system of who aired what, it'd be so much easier. Viewers would know what to expect and the channels would know what their viewers expect.

There would have to be at least two or three stations per channel, however. You can't cram every soap opera on one channel, or every cartoon on one channel. Some would do good with just one (talk shows, maybe, and possibly game shows), some would require two (soap operas, cartoons), some would even require three or more (sitcoms). But it could work!

You could have the sitcom area sliced up so many different ways. You can do it by eras, by production companies, by subject matter, by type of sitcom (a channel devoted to cable/premium sitcoms, for example), etc. Same thing with soaps. You can put all of the current soaps on one channel, cancelled soaps on another, or you can put classic episodes of the current shows together with the cancelled shows.

The possibilites would be endless.

[noveel]

Maybe there's hope with Multicasting on Digital TV, StandardDef TV will remain for several years

[GoldenGirlsFan92]

Yes. I prefer 80's & 90's sitcoms, but the 2000's haven't been really that great(except Scrubs). Plus the studios never seem to give the sitcoms a chance.

[waichingliu81]

Yes. I prefer 80's & 90's sitcoms, but the 2000's haven't been really that great(except Scrubs). Plus the studios never seem to give the sitcoms a chance.

they are just obsessed with reality tv and dramas, which is why tv nowadays suck, and suck badly too

[Stuck In The '70's]

they are just obsessed with reality tv and dramas, which is why tv nowadays suck, and suck badly too
Their's always been dramas though. I think reality tv is the the big problem. When you have the President of NBC saying things like he doesn't think script shows should air in the 8-9pm time slot and that reality shows should, that says alot.

[like2throw]

Wow, that was perfectly put. There has not been a really successful sitcom since The Cosby Show and Roseanne. These 2 shows were really funny, and kept us glued to the telelvision for years. Ever since The Cosby Show went off the air, TV has become stale, especially sitcoms. Many have tried. Friends and Seinfeld were probably the 2 most successful left, yet they were nothing compared to the Cosby Show.

Now, in my opinion, sitcoms right now are dead. You can't find a good sitcom these days even on TV Land. But, if a good sitcom were to come around, then everybody would watch. But, ther is no good sitcom these days. So, I voted that there is still hope, yet currently, they are dead.

Sorry to bring this up from the underground but I have something to get across my chest....yes imo the sitcom is not dead, but its just in a rejuvenating state at the moment....(Like rock and roll, hip hop and pop seem to dominate the mainstream...but its probably a cycle, and rock could make a comeback.) Same thing could happen to television situational comedies....it just needs that ONE show to restart and revive the genre again....what will be that show we don't know... but it happens with every genre. (Survivor for reality tv, Who wants to be a millionaire for game shows, and Er for drama.) All of those shows kickstarted theyre genres and spawned a mass of imitators.

And imo Seinfeld was MUCH better than either the Cosby show and Roseanne and influenced the sitcom genre to a greater degree...that show probably was the main reason why the sitcom genre is in a reviving mode right now...its really hard to have a better written show than that (Except for the simpsons)...and unlike the Cosby show and Roseanne, Seinfeld actually has replay value which is the main reason why its still one of the top rated syndicated programs and the other two mentioned aren't.

[Corolla]

I think Reba and Married With Children were great sitcoms.

[88survivor]

Don't forget the comebacks of former celebrities appearing on reality shows...how the might has fallen.:eek:

[mrs.gingerhinkley]

I think Reba and Married With Children were great sitcoms.
here here!

I refuse to believe that the sitcom is dead.
Yes... it may be dying...
but i believe that there is still a chance!

TV networks aren't getting as good as ratings as they used to... i think sometime they'll have to realize there's a reason shows like "I Love Lucy" and many others are still poplular.

I hope.

[waichingliu81]

Sorry to bring this up from the underground but I have something to get across my chest....yes imo the sitcom is not dead, but its just in a rejuvenating state at the moment....(Like rock and roll, hip hop and pop seem to dominate the mainstream...but its probably a cycle, and rock could make a comeback.) Same thing could happen to television situational comedies....it just needs that ONE show to restart and revive the genre again....what will be that show we don't know... but it happens with every genre. (Survivor for reality tv, Who wants to be a millionaire for game shows, and Er for drama.) All of those shows kickstarted theyre genres and spawned a mass of imitators.

And imo Seinfeld was MUCH better than either the Cosby show and Roseanne and influenced the sitcom genre to a greater degree...that show probably was the main reason why the sitcom genre is in a reviving mode right now...its really hard to have a better written show than that (Except for the simpsons)...and unlike the Cosby show and Roseanne, Seinfeld actually has replay value which is the main reason why its still one of the top rated syndicated programs and the other two mentioned aren't.

no need to apologise. there i was thinking that there wasn't much else said on this topic, but i was wrong:) . anyhow, in response to your comment, yeah, i suppose that we have to wait patiently for one really good and well written sitcom to kick off and hopefully, the sitcom revival will really begin. interesting that you mentioned seinfeld because even though it is a massive hit in the US, here in the UK that show has struggled to find audiences. the time slot wasn't just an issue- it was shown at 11.30pm weeknights over 10 years ago- but rather the humour wasn't to many audience's taste and as they didn't get many of the jokes either. i thought it was good, even though the humour in that sitcom was different to other sitcom shows, back in the 90s

[Classicshowsgurl15]

I think the last really successful sitcom was Friends. The sitcoms now suck. They aren't funny. They have really gone downhill. Its sad.

[Overdose]

Then you had "Roseanne" (an all-time low in sticoms)
"Roseanne" is one of, if not THE best sitcom in my opinion.

Gah! How can you say it was at an "all-time low"! Everything about "Roseanne" was quality (well, up until about season 7 -- but 6 great seasons is a lot for any sitcom!).

The dialouge was witty, the storylines were interesting and realistic and the acting was the best of almost any sitcom.

"Roseanne" changed the family sitcom in so many ways by allowing for more realistic topics to be discussed and dealt with, paved the way for gay characters on TV and enpowered women.

I guess to each their own. But I personally love "Roseanne".